FEEL HEAVEN'S WRATH: Thor Thread Reloaded

Classic Fighting Games Ultimate Marvel VS Capcom 3
1321

I’m not actually sure why he needs a hammer throw. Mighty Spark is a decent projectile already. Perhaps it will be really good hitstun and durability or something (it better have amazing durability… no way his hammer should be getting stopped by anything), but leave him totally exposed whilst its out…

Whilst I agree that armored moves would ‘help’ him, I think it would make him pretty brain dead at the same time. You already are on plus frames for aerial might strikes right? And H Mighty Smash. Having so many moves with armor AND positive on block just sounds stupid. Perhaps they could make them negative on block. Otherwise those are the only moves you would ever use, either to attack or just move about. Wouldn’t the super armour also carry over to his assists too? An armoured ground bouncing move… sounds ridiculous. I think that armor for charged versions is acceptable, because the opponent has a chance to realise what is coming.

I don’t think he actually needs armour at all. Even on his normals. If anything, I think they just maybe need to tweak some of his frame data on his normals, perhaps give cr. L slightly greater reach/hitstun or something. If they all they did was make cr.M a better AA, I would actually be pretty happy. I don’t think he needs anything to help him extend combos when he already does a fairly hefty amount of damage. Another 100k or so would be pretty sweet I guess…

I think the overall design of how he plays right now is great, he doesn’t really have a lot of brainless shit (though some might consider corner resets to be his one ‘thing’) that almost seems necessary to keep up in this game, and thus people consider him ‘low tier’. You have to at least plan things a tiny bit when you play Thor.

1322

having armor on mighty smash wont help thor much if you think about it, mighty smash M is the only one that can start a combo but its very unsafe so you cant throw it out like an armored normal.

i completely agree that thor doesnt need any armor on his normals, but they still need to buff his normals by making them faster and maybe adjusting the hitbox.

1323

Agreed. But I find he lacks in the reversal category, unless you happen to time a mighty punish or got lucky, hence why I said super armor on mighty smash. Because if someone throws out a well timed super on you and you happened to have pressed buttons you eat damage. But I find if he did have super armor you would have people less willing to press buttons, giving him greater opportunities for resets. But if they gave him more super armor it should be negative on block, plus would be stupid.

1324

Saw the video Capcom Unity posted of CCSD. Assist 3 is still Mighty Strike. I’m fine with that, so long as it has better properties.

And he’s diverse enough, he really doesn’t need any more moves. (Maybe lvl 3…but huh).

Yeah, he needs tiny booast his normals that I’ll agree with. He’s at the point where if Capcom gave him the wrong buffs, I think he’d be brain dead. Giving him armor (as much as every Thor player wants it…and you know, you secretly want it) would make his shit too good. He wouldn’t have to play so hard and people will abuse the armor.

I feel…again, I FEEL…since Thor has very little options to get succesful hit confirms, his damage in certain areas could improve. For example, Might Thunder is only good for assist punishes and mighty smash combonation. Thats’ it. Damage scaling makes it worse when used in combos for some dumb reason, it’s slow and very punishable, and since his ground game is blah, it’s hard to make it work. Each thunder hit does 130,000 and scales back after the 2nd hit, make it 383,700. I wish they’d take some of the scaling off the last 2 hits, and in turn make the hyper: 1. More powerful, since it’d hit somewhere in 400k now. 2. actually be more useful in combos, due to not scaling so bad.

Mighty Punish could use a damage increase to 360k or 370k, since DHC is gone. The move can keep it’s crappy range, but make the 1 active frame that’s invinible more “invincible”, if that makes sense. For example, Joe’s Mach Speed. After he actives it, I always active Might Punish to hopefully catch him. Nope. I mean, considering the little bugger is grounded, and MP has 1 invincible frame…you’d think Thor could grab him out of his hyper. It’s annoying. Something like that, if you follow me.

Or make his mighty spark L hit 1 time, M hit 2, and H hit 3 times (without the blast radius). So at least useing it in a combo, it doesn’t scale back so back.

That’s about it. Though realistlically, making this normals better is good enough by me.

1325

I Agree and Disagree with some of the suggestions for what Thor needs to be a bit more competitive in UMVC3. Thor has been my point guy since Day 1 and I still main him or find a use for him on just about every team That I play. Thor/Hulk/Dorm Phoenix(on point)/Thor/Dorm and Thor/Tron/She Hulk. To be absolutely honest unless you are playing a scrub it is very hard to get in with thor and against someone who knows what they are doing near Impossible without a good assist or some sort of overly cumbersome/dangerous tactic. Against noobs I just dive in with jumping H and on hit go into M mighty strike and go into a combo from there. Against harder opponents its usually try to lock them in place with a dark hole assist or anti air hulk jump in and MH toss that ass to start a combo. But playing footsies or even using normal moves for the most part is super dangerous with Thor everything anyone has beats everything you can do. He Does Need some form of armor on something which I believe would be the simplest fix. If not there gonna have to change the frame data for a TON of his moves because all of them have HORRIBLE startup and recovery. Faster characters can take thor for free with their never ending pokes and rushdown. Armor on something would change peoples mind about rushing in and mashing on the god of thunder.

1326

Disagree. Thor’s tri-jump mixup and pressure games are legit and, while he isn’t top, Thor is by no means a free character. Tri-jump S, L, and empty tri-jump crossup piledriver is a solid mixup, while his crouching L is a workable ground normal. Thor should pretty much never be standing or walking on the ground unless he’s firing mighty spark or charging mighty strike, so armor on his normals wouldn’t really set the world on fire. The hitboxes and speed on them would still be unworkable.

I’d much rather have a consistent anti-air option and an easier time hit-confirming tridash moves against jumping opponents, which in practical terms means faster normals. Marvel’s version of footsies is zooming around in the air, dashing forward and back trying to predict and counter your opponent’s movement, and Thor is rather weak at this because it is very difficult for him to hit-confirm an air H or S against a jumping opponent into a full combo compared to, say, Viper, Wesker, or Magneto. The Thor player must realize that it’s an airhit and do a different chain of normals because his other B&Bs will drop, and both the timing and spacing of this is tricky.

The last thing I’d wish for is a hitbox on Mighty Spark that can’t be ducked by 90% of the cast.

edit: Also, I agree with the previous posters saying that Mighty Thunder and Mighty Punish are kind of shit. Give Thunder a reasonable startup and make it safer; -72 is cruel and unusual. The problem with Mighty Punish is that it gives Thor far less damage than a normal piledriver (sans DHC glitch), builds you no meter, and also costs you a bar. The only way to put it on par is to give it invincibility out the ass or a ground bounce like the other throws.

1327

What tactics are you attempting to use to get in with Thor against ‘good opponents’?

I also disagree with what you are saying. Superjump -> trijump -> j.L is actually a pretty damn fast way to catch people, and with an assist to hold them in place even for a little bit it makes it easier. Aerial mighty strikes are also good for approach.The fact that he can use it in different directions and after an air dash/flight mode really does do good things for his manuvurability and importantly unpredicability.

Also its worth remembering that if you feel confident on your defense, playing Thor somewhat defensively and looking for patterns until you can pick your spot to command grab them is an effective strategy sometimes. You can actually use cr.M cancelled into M Mighty Smash if you are feeling ballsy.

Footsies with Thor are sorta possible. You have to rely on his actually very decent backdash, and the range he can acheive with trijumping into j.L or empty jump/command grab.

I think in terms of his hypers, yeah Mighty Thunder could do with some tweaks to make it at least a little bit useful. But I think Mighty Punish is already very decent. Bear in mind that its only a Level 1 hyper, but its an instant (after the flash anyway) grab.

1328

The Tri jump mixup only works on people who dont see it coming a mile away and most people online only play with 10 characters and you know who they are. All of them have easy options for cancelling or severely limiting your tri jump approach. Mighty strike is generally better for coming in which is why I cancel into it from normals every chance that I get also it puts me at a + on block so its not too dangerous. And I dont know about you but if I had some armor on crouching H or on my Launcher I could punish a lot of things that currently punish me due to priority.

1329

ya i agree with this, what i usually do is always stick with cr.LM after any j.H or j.S because they both have enough hit stun to keep an airborne opponent in a juggle state long enough for me to land and connect a cr.L. It’s a shame that cr.LH cant juggle because its too slow, i dont rly mind the damage difference between LM and LH but the range on LM is pretty bad. Kind of annoying how you have to keep switching between them depending on the situation, for juggling you have to use LM but if they’re too far or after a cross up trijump L you have to use LH.

The buffs i would personally like for thor are:

-Faster normals
-Mighty thunder pushes back on block
-Mighty punish causes a ground bounce
-Bigger hitbox on mighty spark
-Mighty smash L safe on block
-Charged Mighty smash H causes an untechable ground bounce
-Faster start up on flight or longer duration
-Lower recovery on Mighty speech
-Mighty spark and strike assists are changed to the L versions.

1330

i don’t think thor needs much, but he could benefit from earlier projectile durability on mighty strikes. i think increasing the startup speed would be unnecessary, but the proj durability could begin during its startup (maybe they’d alter the animation).
i agree he should have a faster startup/longer duration flight.
he also needs one of the following…c.C sped up, c.A more hitstun, s.C sped up and hits small chars. and s.A could be a little faster too.
even though they’re normalizing xfactor across the board, he’ll probably still hit harder than most considering overall damage output still seems high, so i don’t expect too many changes for him, unfortunately.

1331

Tack on as other possible buffs:

  • Mighty Smash hits an overhead.
  • L and M Mighty Smash can charged. (L still knocksdown and M still ground bounce.)
  • Mighty Speech builds faster meter in X factor.
1332

You guys ARE joking about the mighty speech buffs right?

Honestly, just give Thor a reversal, and I’ll be happy. The super armor was just a cover up for the ability to have a reversal. I can’t punish random supers as easily as I should be able to and forced to take chip or raw damage because someone got extremely lucky.

1333

why not? the way it is now its pretty much useless for canceling out of specials and ends up making the recovery even worse (except for mighty spark H).

1334

Actually I really want to know WHY Mighty Speech was put in the game. It’s only useable if Thor is grounded when the opponent gets eliminated, and Thor has just enough time to charge half of the his meter. That’s it.

Really, is there a reason why it’s there? He’s not like Dan, so it’s not meant to be funny. I’m really curious about that…

1335

Because hearing Shakespearian Old English is funny.

“Have at THEE!!!”
“I say thee nay”
“Accept thy defeat”
“Aye verily”
"Tis’ not over"
and etc.
^Lol worthy lines, I always chuckle when I hear Thor talk in cartoons/movies/games.

1336

I love mimicing his lines in the game, no doubt. Go to conventions and yell: “BUY ODIN’S BEER!” and people will instantly get it.

But in all seriousness, I wouldn’t mind asking Seth-K why they really put it in there.

1337

I’m telling you bro, it’s because Shakespearian English is simply lulz. I’ll put money on it for that being the reason, I actually did mighty speech to a friend online yesterday, for 5 seconds he didn’t know what to do before hitting me.

1338

It’s hard to say what it is Thor needs because I think he is so damn good as he is (except for his hypers). On the ground I am looking to throw at all times. Usually I just use his normal comand throw into full combos. Because of his high HP Thor can shake off a pressure so a lot of times I will corner myself and wait for a character to rush me down, wait for their blockstring to end then reverse comand grab them. Now I have them in the corner for a punishing combo and reset opportunities. Also c.l is tricky, because althoughth it isn’t mash friendly its not slow and seems to out prioritize most other c.l pokes. Most people who know what Thor can do will try and jump a lot, but Thor air dashing and mh put fear into their hearts. I usually mh in the air only and it seems to b very effective. As far as mobility goes his mighty strikes give him tons as well as plus on blocks and protection from projectiles (this is why it was so hard for me to watch the match from sdcc where the Thor player got totally zones out by doom. I was like jump in there with a l mighty strike, then come down with a m mighty strike!). I will use tri dashing to keep pressure on just to set up an empty jump throw, but its all about mind games with Thor. Throwing the hammer would only b good if it was like a beam super that had unlimited durability so that it could go through others beams, and caused a wall bounce. I don’t think Thor needs armor, but a overhead move would b nice.

1339

It’s kinda odd to me that we Thor players can’t come to an agreement as to what changes we’d like. I’m guessing that it’s because we’re the minority and as such, we all have pretty different playstyles. Really though, we all can agree what Thor is bad at. Somehow I feel that Capcom doesn’t really care about him and I have little faith in him getting much better. It would seem that just about anything he can do, someone can do better. From my perspective, even the great things about Thor are outweighed or cancelled out by the cons (i.e High Health but lack of defensive options makes him a durable punching bag).

Personally I’d just like him to have either higher mobility and better priority/speed on his normals. If not that then some super armor. Having useful supers would be great too as it’d seem that he technically has no super that he can throw out and be safe before or after =/ I feel that we [Thor players] have to rely way more on gimmicks and resets to do proper, good damage and even then our opponents aren’t afraid of us and that, to me, is the biggest problem with Thor: most players just don’t find him threatening [and with good reason].

1340

You know as much as I can think of…the Thor forum is one of, if not THEE most understanding and fair forum. It could be due to Thor’s unqiue playstyle…but it’s not soo much a bad idea Thor players can agree on what we want. And this is where I mean the forum is fair: we all want to give him something, but we don’t want him being dumb. That say’s alot. Other characters and in other games have some stupid shit that mainers have can abuse and they don’t think it’s good enough…or some character might want buffs even if it’s a bad or okay, but they won’t think about the cons of the character.

Here, we’re all actually agreeing on giving him buffs (that yes would help) but don’t want to break his design. I dare say were all trying to making Thor perfect. Not broken, or bad…but just right to where he’s really good, but you gotta earn your shit with him. Almost like we all want Thor to represent the player, not Thor.

Either way, like the post above says, Thor is in the minority for this game, so opinions are slim and non. And I think we get that. We just gotta wait and see and hope for the best.