No!
NO!
You back out of money matches, and we fall back. You back out of fights, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here! This far and no further!
The entire point of win swapping is in winner take all. i.e. it doesn’t matter if i get 3rd or 4th, so i’m going to drop the games vs one person, and play really hard vs another person. I’ll get 4th instead of 3rd, but my friend will win instead of the other guy.
I am as well, but NKI needs to come and say what he’s behind, if he wants a NKI invitational with his own rules and whatever 10 players he wants, so he can play them all, then great, i love it. Just say your pissed off about what happened last year and your inviting everyone to play in your invitational, invite who you want, and do whatever you want and get it done. Have single char, make everyone play as O.Sagat, whatever you feel like doing.
But if you expect people to say “I won NKI’s tourney, therefore i am the best ST player in the US, all grudges settled, end of discussion”, the it’s going to be a different conversation, and the rules need to be looked at with a different set of eyes.
EDIT: I posted the 5on5 as sort of a third idea, and that is still on the table as well.
I think that’s whats really throwing the discussion off, the posts are just coming from different directions and now it’s hard to tell where you want to go with this. NKI pick what direction you want to go first, then we’ll talk about what tournament gets you there, then everyone can go with that.
wtf graham is posting? go back to EQ fool! :wgrin:
another note: nobody loves me 
We don’t talk about you buk cause we already know your the ChampBell, only losing to Gian(#1) and Tokido(#3) and beating DSP. Your belt is in the mail.
Now that I think about it I only lost to Tokido and a pause… wheres my beef?
I lost to David Spenc and Mike Watson. I want a fucking belt too.
Hey I only lost to japan, and barely at that. ANYWAY, I would much rather have a 5 on 5 vs japan ‘IF’ some decent japan players are coming that know ST. If not, knock it down to 3 on 3. The invitational does seem kind of silly, sure free money eh whatever. For some reason, i dont think to many top ST players are even coming this year. So everything will be settled during EVO ST major. So why have ANOTHER ST single on top of EVO. It just starting to seem redundant now. Its almost like NKI saying ’ these are the guys i want to play agaisnt to test my skill, so lets have a small RR tourney so i can play them all and see where i stand.’
Anyway, Team tourney good, RR uneccessary. FMJ is right (geez did i say that shit?) its really about beating japan. Lets have so more players other then myself who has beatin Japan in a major =P
J-Cole
shutup, ya hate ST… hater 
Yeah buk im back, i heard smelly cole was winning these st tourneys so i had to come show people some of what it used to be like with cole taking 5th place! lol. Also i heard that japanese been winning this tourney last couple years so had to come help out scrubby cole beat the japanese.
Graham
Ahh the good times are coming back!
A couple of things, a RR style tourney can be done for more than 8 people. Just do pools of 8 to whatever, then advance X of entrants into a new pool of X entrants. Or try Swiss Pairs snicker.
Also, if individual games are to be counted I.e. losing 3-2 is better than losing 3-0, then character’s HAVE to be locked. Otherwise even inferior players can counter pick someone to a 3-2 match count, esp against a known honda, gief, whatever character.
If all that really matters is overall wins and maybe win % would be factored in tie breaks, then I suppose open character selection if ok.
I actually really agree with Cole here, theres all the drama about who’s really best in the US, but honestly we should be worrying about who Japan is sending this year to kick our asses. Who the hell was Gian? He shows up out of nowhere and creams us, and instead of being concerned about being owned by Japan for the upteenth time, we’re on here nitpicking about the PS1 version of ST and who’s a fluke winner.
What we should really be doing is setting up a way to practice against each other and get as much into our game as possible to beat Japan…that’s what it’s really all about. I feel I would get a lot more useful practice playing in a round robin that lets me switch characters and play the matches I would have played in a singles tournament, rather than put me into the corner in unbalanced matches. If we were forced to pick one character only, I would have to decide on either Vega or Dee Jay…which means I either lose for free to Dhalsim or Balrog/Honda, take your pick. OR I could go random mode and pick Blanka, and end up losing most of my matches.
I just want to get some fucking practice in man! Let’s start setting some shit in stone!
Sorry I don’t have time at this moment to reply to everything, but I just wanted to say…
Gian is Japan’s best Dhalsim player…
(He used to go by the name Ken-O.)
And I’m sorry if I gave people the impression that you’d have to stick to one character, because that’s definitely not what I had planned…I was just saying people over-exaggerate how bad counter-characters are.
Yeah, lucky for Gian that the last hit in our match was a trade and he won by a sliver. Hope he comes back, but I really doubt he will.
Anyway, nobody saying it has to be one character, that was just my suggestion. Seriously though NKI, try to find out what japanese players are going and then talk to Wizard about having a 5 on 5 for ST. If not to many, then have a 3 on 3. We can then have a quick 10 man RR to see which 5 are in.
Another singles tourney on top of EVO is not a good idea.
J-Cole
i thought it was KKY…? shrug
That would be totally awesome if it were feasible, but unfortunately it’s not. There have only been two Japanese ST players to ever make it to an American tournament: Gian and Daigo. I’ve tried to get more peeps to come, but they’re old, they have full-time jobs (plus families in some cases), and perhaps the most devastating factor is that Japan’s national ST tournament is right around the same time, and it’s in Osaka (so the Tokyo players have to travel across the country to go there). Muteki Guile is the only person who expressed any serious interest in going to Evo, but he said that he can only go to one or the other, and he’s going to Japan’s national tourney. :sad::sad:
I do not want to use brackets of any kind for this tourney, because I want to see the results of everyone playing against everyone.
I want to get input from other people as well so that the majority can be happy. I can say that I certainly do not plan on enforcing a single-character rule. As for the players…
Like I said, I want to see who is America’s current best ST player, and if people feel that I’m not good enough to deserve a spot in the tourney, then I don’t deserve a spot.
Me? Pissed off…? I don’t really get pissed off. 
I am not angry or anything, I just think that double-elimination tourneys don’t produce precise results. I’m definitely not saying this out of bitterness, because if anything, I placed HIGHER than I should have last year.
I’m open to any suggestions you may have to make this as official as possible.
I love you Buk.
It’s not just to see where I stand, but where all the ST players stand. But like I said, if people think I don’t deserve a spot, then I don’t deserve a spot, and I won’t participate.
That’s not the direction I wanted this to go. Because of last year’s drama, I want to know where American ST players stand among themselves. Besides, given that Japan’s CvS2 and 3S players players can snag top 4 spots in our ST tourney every year, and the fact that Gian dominated practically everyone he played against, it’s already obvious that Japan is way ahead of us in ST. I don’t want to sound like a nut-riding fanboy, but in all honesty, if they sent their best players…I don’t think we would stand a chance against them in ST. :sad:
Don’t you think that a really good way to do that would be to get all of America’s best players together and have them all play against each other…?
The problem is, I’m not even confident that we could get three ST players to come. The only feasible team I can even imagine is Gian/Kuni/Daigo, if Gian decides to come back again. If that’s the case, then I’d definitely like to go with a USA vs. Japan tourney, with this RR being the qualifier.
Agreed.
KKY is dope and all, but Gian is definitely better.
So do you think I shouldn’t run my 32 man invitational as well?
I think what everyone fails to forget is that the past EVOs have BEEN on console.
I hate to say it, but the results are very different than what they normally are on arcade.
Honestly, Apoc, Sirlin, Seth, Choi, and Watson are ALL elminated early. This has NEVER happened in an arcade ST tournament, and this can strictly be based on a few things such as speed/timing/hit box/move differences from Arcade to PS1.
Why did Japan win? Why does Japan ALWAYS win? I am sure they have played on home systems practicing more than we have, especially a PS1 or DC version like the year before…
IN any event, it does not really matter, and no offense to the players that did REALLY well at EVO last year (DSP, Buktooth, NKI, Afro, EHONDA player from XBL, and others) because it was quite an accomplishment for new school players, but it’s seriously way different in the arcade, and we have all seen that.
Spastic movements and instant uppercuts? Watson, Valle, Apoc, and Choi need that momentum to win, and it’s very difficult to adjust to something that is not stable.
I know I sound like a broken record here, but if we are talking about invite only of the BEST 16 players in ARCADE ST tourneys, the list might be a bit surprising, and some people would have to come out of retirement to play.
If anything, with the amount of interest for ST now, it should be 32 players…and I think that because most of the players are predominantly West Coast, it’s going to be a bit harsher for players that may or may not come to EVO or not…names we are all forgetting…
Midwest-
Seth Killian
Wes Truelson
Jesse Howard
Nick (NKI)
East-
Pete Talley
Omar Deloney
Kris Grytebust
Justin Wong
Julian Robinson
Phil Burnell
John Gordon
Chris Li
Masaka
Phi Ngyuen
South-
Jesse Cardenas
David Hem
Hsien Chang
West-
Alex Valle
Jason Cole
Jason Gonzales
Jason De Heras
Jason Nelson
Jason Wilson
John Choi
Graham Wolfe
Alex Wolfe
Thomas Osaki
Mike Watson
David Sirlin
Jabari Bain
Campbell Tran
Afrolegends
James Romedy
David Spence
Geoff Arnold
Neil Atkin
That’s pretty much everyone that’s done well in tourneys…
Hmm, Year before last Choi got second to Diago. Before that I think it was Diago/Nuki and then before that It was Cole/Nuki. Last year was the first year US didnt do so well in ST. The time USA went over to japan and had the 5 vs 5, we lost by 1 point in ST. So PLEASE NKI spare me the whole ’ we wont stand a chance agaisnt them in ST’ fan boy speech. Sorry but its exactly how you are sounding with a statement like that.
Also, I completely forgot Cigarbob was holding an invitational as well. So what 3 ST tourneys at EVO? Come on now, how many torneys do we need on this game lol. If what you say about most of the japanese not being able to come for ST (cause yes, most have lives outside of ST) then EVO ST is really the only one we need. Sure maybe at night when everyone is partying and drunk, we can have a secret tourney in Cigarbobs room or something like last time. Other then that, we can just have matches all day long.
If you really insist on going through with it though NKI, I suggest you just pick 8 people and throw them in a little RR. Nobody is gonna bitch about who you pick, or care. You have proved yourself enough with your knowledge on the ST scene so just take charge of it. Oh, and just for the record… I really dont care if you put yourself in the mix. 8 is a good number.
J-Cole
How easily I’m forgotten :wtf:
Just have a qualifiers single elimination one match or something for the people interested with a small entry fee, and pick the top 8 from those who survive. Make sure to seed the ones who are supposed to be good so we can have an rr with those if they hold up to their name.
Graham