RSF needs to stay. It’s what makes Fuerte fun. Screw you guys who think he should just become some other boring mixup character.
Besides, it’s not even a real infinite.
Oh and +50 health to Fuerte.
Then leave it in and make damn sure that it doesn’t work after 3-4 hits, no matter how good your execution is.
Unless they change damage scaling the risk/reward for doing the “infinite” is so out of whack that nobody’s gonna keep doing it. 4 hits into slide does like 400 damage. The most practical damage anyone’s gonna get out of it is like 600 damage.
I’d rather see it gone. A semi infinite skill shouldn’t be what makes the character seem balanced. Thats just dumb. I’d rather see a boost to stamina and damage than to see RSF stay. Aside from that Qbomb and Sorbat need to be changed big time, they don’t fit in with the character at all…
Qbomb= Faster start up time and charge times cut in half.
Sorbat= Replace it with a evasion dash similar to Vega’s backflips or make it a counter skill similar to Gouken’s counters.
We’ll see if he even gets a revamp. But, if he gets any statistical boost, I’d vote for damage. Health wise, El Fuerte’s a character who gambles on not getting hit. That’s the fun and reason behind his speed. Damage will be more helpful than a health boost.
It depends what they change. I agree he is a risk vs reward character however, the risks at this time greatly out weight the rewards. I think a faster way to stun would be nice too. Hopefully qbomb and sorbat do get revamped because they stink.
No shit Fuerte needs the runstopfierce. Runstopfierce is not an infinite. There is no such thing as a semi-infinite. That’s like saying I counted almost all the way to infinity. Either way, it scales pathetically after a few hits so there’s no point in doing 9. El Fuerte can do RSF and he’s still bad, so obviously we can stack some new shit onto him besides that.
Is this that new thing called logic?
- Shorter Qbomb charge.
- Sobat breaks armor.
- EX run armor extends to move executed from run.
I agree with you. I can’t consistently do the RSF but it’s pretty fun and it makes Fuerte unique. Including what he has now he is still a low tier character (proof) so he still needs some tweaking for SSF4. And people are asking Capcom to remove RSF? :\
Capcom isn’t going to remove RSF, so we don’t have to worry about it. It was clear they overestimated how good RSF was, which is why Fuerte isn’t as good in other areas. Now that Capcom realizes that, they aren’t suddenly going to neglect to give Fuerte more tools because of that RSF wildcard. They played the wildcard, and it lost. It’s very hard to land in matches against real players. It’s not a solution to all your troubles when you’re getting rolled (like DP FADC safe on block is).
What it IS, however, is a combo that makes Fuerte unlike any character in SF history, and extremely fun and rewarding to play. It’s hard to do and it does as much damage reliably as any good character’s jump in bread and butter combo (you aren’t landing RSF for free without a jump-in-like setup). People think just because his BnB is some sort of loop that it’s unfair. Given the context for landing it, it’s totally, 100% fair. Damage scaling makes sure that players with perfect execution don’t get much better of a reward for the combo than your basic player who can do 3 reps. It’s not some combo that, when we can all play like robots, goshdarnit Fuerte will be broken!
Taking it away is taking away Fuerte’s identity and 75% of his fun factor for good players. He’s just going to be some other wimpy crossup character with no personality or life. It’ll stay.
I agree on the first two. Sobat can break armor and be safe on block, but should do marginal damage (60-70) and have no real followups (and shouldn’t knock down). I don’t agree with your last one, though. It basically gives Fuerte a semi-invincible move from full screen that can ONLY be hit by armor-breakers. EX run is good as it is, imo.
As I mentioned, Fuerte needs both a damage buff and a health buff. If you don’t want to give him 1000 HP because of his character’s personality, give him 950 and a pretty substantial damage buff (20% on slide and all moves off run). Q-bomb being shorter charge and sobat breaking armor are nice but don’t do a whole lot to move him up the tiers.
His back dash is fast, but what’s the point of having a fast back dash that doesnt go anywhere? his :qcf: :p: xx :lk: back dash goes farther and is just as fast. THAT dash right there should be his normal backdash.
Nobody gives a crap about rep. This isn’t high school. Grow up. Besides Barbie’s Horse adventure is awesome!
No. RSF’s timing is there for a reason. What needs to be fixed is either the move’s hitbox so that proper execution is rewarded with a hit, and/or to fix the reeling animation of characters to actually allow him to land the damn thing. Also, dont for get about Sliding. cl :hp: xx :qcf: :p: xx :hk: is just as effective.
Anyone who states Fuerte should lose RSF is a retard. If you spam that flaming shoryuken like an idiot, you deserve to catch RSF x 8 + slide. He needs it to strike that fear into opponents.
I think the big thing he needs is as follows:
Hitbox fixes for RSF
Quesadilla Bomb input change to :qcf: :k:
or
Keep its input the way it is, and reduce both startup and recovery. The move is extremely risky as it is and there’s already far better options, so it must be given a use. Also, shorten EX Q-Bomb charge time for fuck’s sake.
target combo removal. shit’s useless.
Gordita Sobat can combo to super and can be FADC’d but thats a waste of meter as any decent Fuerte player will be using Meter for EX run and EX Guacamole. I say make the damn thing recover fast enough to be safe on block to set up for his only worthwhile block string of lp lp lp lp cr.mk xx run (mixup)
OR
Replace it all together with a jump similar to his Picadillo jump ( :qcb: :p: xx :k: )
that, unlike the back one, allows for follow up attacks. it would be a nice alternative for stopping and quickly inputting Guacamole.
Make :dp: :hk: go farther horizontally, this gives him an option against jump back happy opponents. Make the :mk: version the current :hk: version, leave :lk: version as is.
Health is fine. I like the risk involved.
make close :mp: a fricken overhead.
either speed up some of his normals so he can at least be able to defend himself or increase normals damage by maybe 10~15%
EDIT: Fajita Buster needs a significant damage increase. Opponents must be standing to get grabbed. unlike Tortilla which grabs both standing and ducking (and even srk’ers). Either that or give it the same invincible frames going up as Tostada Press.
@Densou: as always, your posts are very detailed and informative.
Yes, RSF should stay, and should be improved in the ways Densou mentioned. I have to admit that I still struggle with the timing, but this is part of the challenge that makes me love maining Fuerte. People pretty much associate him with it instantly and crowds go wild when a 3+ rsf gets done in the heat of battle, all that will be lost if rsf is removed.
Habanero dash should build meter :
:
I’ve always thought that too. Aside from that…
Close HP should have a larger hit box for RSF like some have already said. Far HK should be moveable (like Guile’s b+mk) so moving doing f+HK extends the range on the normal. And now that someone else mentioned close mp really SHOULD be an overhead. Never thought about it til now.
On the specials, instead of the QBomber I would turn it into a ground command throw so he has more to protect himself on wakeup and make another one of his specials armor breaking. Oh and EX splash should retain armor breaking properties throughout the move, not just the ground.
how is such a large man eating that little food.
tostada press being armor breaking…man that would be some akuma shit. but yea fucking a when guac hits a sumo smash…and it’s a no-damage RESET? wtf?
I’m not a huge fan of this idea. I just think it would be unfair. Fuerte’s uncatchable, with this he becomes unstoppable too.
Please tell me I’m not the only one that thinks this isn’t a good idea. Though it’d be funny to see, Fuerte will be the best meter builder on the game. He could run back and forth forever, and with his speed not many could stop him.
As a fuerte player, the only time I feel vulnerable is when I don’t have EX to escape/absorb with. Every character needs to have some non-EX time.
I agree with the people that say he doesn’t need much improvement for three reasons:
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I LOVE being the underdog. I love balance too, but it’s hilarious beating up Sagat with Fuerte.
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Don’t want him to become the Ryu of SSF4. If everyone started picking Fuerte as much as him, I’d throw up.
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I get called cheap enough as it is. Don’t want this to esculate, and I don’t want to be called cheap just for picking Fuerte…
But building meter while running can be a good thing because if anything, most Fuerte’s moves need to be EX in order to really put the hurt on other characters. Especially priority wise since he can Guacamole a lot of aerial attacks with EX. Another thing it would do is add on to his mix up game in that he further can control the field by forcing the other player to try to stop him from building his meter. Fuerte can bait him into a close enough range and go for the distance control. If anything, it will make the Fuerte player work more on keeping active if they want to benefit from anything while giving greater rewards for the hard worker. And Fuerte players will all tell you that your fingers are never at rest for no longer than a second or two. Unlike the other players, we can’t risk sitting there and waiting to put in just four commands while we have to do a dash then go for another button press, then another one based on what we do then, such as back dashing to the wall and leaping off of it. We’re not Zangief and any El Fuerte player that plays as a turtler is doing it wrong.
El Fuerte usually isn’t a turtler, but he can turtle just as good as anyone else. Trust me, I’ve been a victim of it. If dash built meter, fuerte could gain the lead, dash back to the corner then dash f/ dash b 'till EX is built, wait… then punish jump in w/ ex propeller or ex guac to escape rush in. EX Dash away and repeat. If you get hit during dash, just wait 'till your health comes back. Don’t forget to build meter…
Yes, Fuerte can turtle decently, especially against characters with low mobility like Zangief. A lot of people manage to get a life lead and just run for the entire match successfully.
Fuerte already has lk.guac as a good tool to build meter, making the run do that is going to give him a super in 3 seconds lol a bit too much.