I’m going to have to agree, once he’s knocked down, all the stamina in the world won’t help him, as his wake up game is lousy.
what elf needs is to be able to end his rsf with a close HK > ex- guac – so less start up on cl.HK
it’ll add much needed damage to the one combo every fuerte needs. – RSF of course
He definitely needs an increase in health
and make his ex-guac escape during wake-up less punishable
he needs more priority with his air-grab
make it harder for him to get grabbed out of the air --like more timing
his elbow cross-up is ok but make it better anyways
completely remove mk > mk target combo – pointless-- but leave H.dash > mk > super
does anyone else have the hardest time against blanka. – atleast make it an even match-up
Blanka is a really tough matchup for me too.
Also, I think I’m the only El Fuerte mainer who doesn’t use RSF. :wow:
Nah, I don’t use RSF either, but that’s mostly because I can’t pull it off yet. Currently, I try going for Tortilla loops.
Off topic, but man these 3rd Strike characters are driving me crazy. I might end up having two or three secondaries with Juri being one of them.
So should we discuss on what would our “little Mexican Gang” stamp be in Fuerte General Discussion Thread? Looking forward to it!
I like Elf, but damn, he’s gonna need so much more just to hang with EVERYBODY else in terms of playstyle and popularity. Give him some more combos and more better options off the run. Who’s gonna play him with all these other interesting characters in the game? Look at freakin Cody. He already had a ton of options, and they still gave him a new one (Zonk Punch).
There’s room for changes and new implentations in his moveset, more specifically in his Run. For example, In his forward run, his lk is a backdash cancel. AFAIK, you could do the same move by pressing lp and performing the backdash input. So, they could change this function into something else that might open up new combo abilities outside of RSF loops. In the Back run, all three kick buttons perform the wall jump. Surely we can change two off those kick buttons into something new. Less not forget the additional options that could be added to the run with directional input (similar to the propeller throw). Granted he doesn’t need a dozen options of hab dash, but could use some more stuff to make him more interesting and bring him up in the tier list.
Hi,
I am new using Fuerte, but I will use it on SSFIV.
He needs lot of things to be changed.
- More stamina and do more damage.
- Dash back (more distance!, now it is ridiculous)
- Command throw like abel/honda, it will be very good to make pressure and not to stay very close on Fuerte.
- Better normals and better wake up.
- Make quesadilla bomb more usable plus armor proprieties like habanero dash.
See you compadres.
Yeah, I actually just started picking up Fuerte myself and he’s definitely a lot of fun, but I’ve been strongly wondering how he’s going to measure up against this new super offensive cast and air ultras in SSF4.
It’s a real dilemma because it looks like SSF4 is going be real different with all the new characters and ultras, but not enough that you can safely quit practicing SF4 and then pick up SSF4 assuming that you won’t be far behind everyone else.
The Back step from forward run goes farther back then his normal backdash. and is perfect for baiting and buffering Flying Giga Buster / EX Guacamole / what have you.
As for the kick buttons I feel your mention of new moves and I agree, but his back run can stop on a dime with LP, you can do anything off of it, just get it into your muscle memory, you can run back stop then: q-bomb/dropkick/normal slide/ fake tortilla/Guacamole
1) More stamina and do more damage. = More damage would be just fine, he doesn’t need a health boost if he hit harder. Giving him more damage would allow newer players to have a better chance as they learn RSF.
2) Dash back (more distance!, now it is ridiculous) I’m inclined to agree, but on the plus side, he has the fastest backdash in the game.
*3) Command throw like abel/honda, it will be very good to make pressure and not to stay very close on Fuerte. * He has 4 already, Fajita Buster, Propeller Tortilla, Flying Giga Buster, and El Fuerte Ultra Spark. Though a Conventional one for close range WOULD be quite welcome. a Chipotle Hurricanrana would be a perfect move lol.
4) Better normals and better wake up. Absolutely. his wakeup would improve just by making EX back Run ungrabable, and giving mk Guacamole, the one we don’t use, have more horizontal reach to allow better escape. Not all his normals are shitty. if Q-Bomb were faster…
5) Make quesadilla bomb more usable plus armor proprieties like habanero dash. It would be too good with EX Hab Dash’s 2 hit super armor, though given it’s already ridiculous charge time, giving it 1 hit super armor would be welcome along with what it really needs which is **faster start-up ** and less recovery. I think Q-Bomb just having shorter charge and faster startup/combo ability/ recovery would be more then enough to give it constant use.
EX guacamole is one of the best anti-airs in the game. it beats nearly every uppercut in the SF4 (including EX) and owns / goes through Blanka’s Ultra on Reaction. Tostada Press has awesome invincibility frame The Tortilla has ridiculous uses, he has the game’s fastest Overhead, a sick okizeme, the current second best Airthrow, and don’t forget RSF. He’s just missing combos, has lots of crap normals, a deadzone for back run(fix this please), shit health, and has a shitty wakeup game
Unfortunately, it seems no one really touched him at the events, so we’ll have to see what SSF4 has in store for him.
The new challengers look real good. But as I said, we haven’t seen Fuerte’s changes and improvements… let’s bide our time corn tortillas don’t spoil and while El Fuerte never confuses salt with sugar, we’ll just have to hope that Capcom doesn’t forget both. Let’s wait it out.
that made my day lool
I agree almost 100% with your post. It covers almost all the crucial points.
Damage output buff for specials (and maybe some normals) is by FAR the most important improvement (especially Fajita, needs more damage AND stun as I mentioned before). What good opponents lack right now is fear from his moves, as they can make mistakes and get away with it for the most part (except RSF). By making his moves stronger, it will completely change Fuerte’s game as he will be pressured less and have more chance to put his own pressure.
Then, Better wake-up game with longer reach mk guac and/or unthrowable backrun comes as the second most important improvement. This will improve his defense, along with the new ultra.
These two points will help a lot both offensively and defensively, which should put him in a much better spot. The other issues like Qbomb startup, Gordita Sorbat, normals, could definitely use some improvement but they are less essential imo.
I kinda gave up on gordita sobat, Fuerte needs meter for ex far more then he’ll ever need RSF xx Run xx Gordita Sobat xx El Fuerte Dynamite.
I think Q-bomb is a big deal. Some characters can survive with one or two useless moves like Cammy (Spin Knuckle, and sorta kinda with Hooligan) But she can actually dish out some damage fairly quickly
Gordita sobat can be ignored due to the plethora of moves available conventionally from the runs, and unconventionally just from practice and abusing run stops.
Fixing Q-bomb’s startup would add another USEABLE move, while it gets beat by the usual dp (fuck you dragon punches) and sweeps, q-bomb is distance controllable (I think) and if it’s useable, we can mix it up run stop sweep, run stop shower kick, or dropkick, we’ll have a surprise armor breaking special, a 2hitter that hits overhead and lead to other stuff on it’s own, the quick overhead etc, more moves in the menu so we can stuff people’s faces.
just imagine busting Q-bomb off of an FA fient, or how Paper mentioned after a taunt >_> ain’t nobody gonna see that coming. shit people don’t see coming makes them jumpy, and or overly cautious. And if they scurred of him, that’s when the real mixup begins.
[media=youtube]wFsY45do1rg[/media]
Look at 1: 30. That should be our new “fuck you” routine. People think RSF is exciting/impressive? Pssh…
I typically hit two RSFs then slide, and if not the mess up usually results in them getting a Fajita to the face; RSF isn’t necessary to win, but it’s a flashy/useful tool.
And I just saw that screenshot of his costume, and I’m officially in love. 
I agree completely with Densou’s opinion of Q- Bomb, except ,as some people have suggested before, it shouldn’t be a charge move; having it be the Back Habanero + MK would be interesting for mixup. /runs back only to turn around for a Refried Beans, Sour Cream filled Quesedilla Bomb
P.S. Reyart, let’s get some matches in! And Densou, I’m going to add you ASAP!
That Tortilla kick into Super is HARD! I can probably do it once every 100 times lol.
Rsf drop into fajita? Dp everytime is what happens to me.
Double posting. We can already Q-bomb off backrun lp let go of k. But I find it useless. It’s unsafe as hell, and is only good to go if the opponent does a horizontal based attack (tatsu) jump back, dp sweep block it’s four bad outcomes vs one good one, one of them being negatable at the cost of 2 ex stocks. Shower kick is a better idea here
Fuerte’s problem is that he exists in SF4. Getting knocked down isn’t scary in this game. Reversal DPs are too free. His only good tool is safe tortilla, which can be devastating in certain match ups. Other than that, it’s tough for him to control the match because the risks he has to take are never equal to their rewards. Against good players you have to run away for half the match trying to set up one knock down, then go for a risky mix up which some characters can avoid for free. We’ll see what happens in SSF4 I guess.
Anyway. An idea:
I was thinking that they should give Fuerte a mix up after Tostada Press connects. After he knocks them down with it, you could QCF+P for an arm bar or QCF+K for an ankle lock. Your opponent can break them by pressing the corresponding button. Each move would do 100 damage. This would make Tostada Presses more useful, rather than pure focus bait.
Reversal DPs are too free. Exactly. Backdash being as powerful as it is… and how open it leaves Fuerte after whiffing Tostada or Fajita yech.
some times when i habanero back dash to get out of a situation i get grabbed right out of it
this is definitely an issue especially if we are not close enough for the grab to look normal
it kind of makes it look as if you are being kara thrown with chars. who don’t even have one. wtf
this is one of my biggest pet peeves
does anyone know if rsf > quesadilla bomb > super, combos. let me know
b/c it popped in my head and have been wondering ever since.
@Killakev: I think it does, havent tried it though. but Qbomb combos after fierce, and super combos after Qbomb from what I know, so I assume u can do all three as one combo.
I don’t mind the risk aspect of Fuerte, but the reward definitely needs to be more to even it out. One thought that came to me, lucha libre is all about confusing your opponent and making them dizzy, doesn’t that mean Fuerte’s moves should cause more stun? That would make sense in terms of his playstyle and will also make him more feared, especially if the damage is also increased on certain moves.