So because El Fuerte moves up on a tier list written by a completely different scene in a different country, he magically becomes a better character in the West? El Fuerte moved up in Japan because his player base grew and he started winning/placing well in tournaments. Until the same happens in the West, he will remain low tier. Hopefully once SSF4 comes out, things will change, and I’m sure they will. I actually dropped Sagat as my main just recently and picked up El Fuerte in preparation for SSF4, because I feel like he’ll be a good character (and I was bored of Sagat). I can consistently get 4 - 5 RSFs in matches now too, so I feel good about my character switch.
I don’t like saying this but yes most of the people on the east follow what the west usually says about anything fighting game related. Most of our strats come from the west(Japan mostly) and a perfect example would be when the Japanese came over and raped everyone with characters that us westerns thought… were terrible. The match I am talking about is the Justin Wong vs the Urien player and he got destroyed and all of a sudden, people just follow along instead of figuring out things themself’s. This is my opinion and I am guilty of falling into this category but this is a pointless arguement so let’s just agree to disagree on this subject before it gets blown out of proportion. I just like hearing that he’s not low tier and I will continue to spread the word that’s he’s mid.
This isn’t an argument, it’s a discussion, nothing will get blown out of proportion. I do not support Fuerte player on Fuerte player violence. :razz:
Thing is, the key issue here is that there isn’t enough high level representation for Fuerte in North America/Europe. There are maybe 4 or 5 in North America, while I’m sure Japan has 4 or 5 Fuerte players per city. I understand what you’re saying, that American Fuerte players will pick up the improved Japanese strategies and make him a better character, but there still aren’t enough players. I personally think Fuerte is undervalued and that mid tier is a good spot for him.
At the risk of looking like an ass, I would just like to point out that conventionally, Japan is East, and America is West.
Additionally, i think Fuerte is a difficult character to rate in terms of tiers, simply because he plays so unconventionally. When you pick fuerte, youre playing a totally different game to the rest of the cast. Naturally, if you use conventional methods of comparison, Fuerte comes out looking like shit. (Pokes, zoning, priority, normals, specials etc.) Unfortunately for fuerte, HOLYSHITWTFMINDFUCK isn’t really considered when people think about this. And as Tofu Warrior has pointed out, his underrepresentation doesn’t help him in that regard.
I was so happy when Japan did that Fuerte festival last december, he got some much needed love 
I agree that he is very unconventional, I know quite a few people who know how to use multiple characters in the roaster very well but not Fuerte. I think that is one of the reasons he is underrepresented, but also why he is really liked by those who end up using him. Not sure yet if I can say he is mid tier for sure, but he isn’t too far from being one. I really hope he gets those needed improvements and gets a larger userbase eventually, I am feeling there is possibly a bit of untapped potential.
What i should’ve said before was that i dont actually mind that he is underrepresented. I personally like being one of a small portion of players that can actually play him (fairly) well. I would personally HATE to see him become as popular as say, Ryu. But i guess i can’t be greedy forever.
Fuck that. Yes i can.
haha I also dont’t want him to be as popular as Ryu, that would be a nightmare. I can’t deny that I also enjoy being part of this small portion of players.
The main reason I want Fuerte to grow a bit more popular though is that I want to see him appear in more SF games in the future. If he is significantly underrepresented it might affect his chances of more story development and reappearances, since Capcom would not have a reason to do that due to lack of fans. I really can’t imagine SF without him anymore tbh, he made SF4 for me and I have never enjoyed maining someone as much before. Whenever they announce a new character for SSF4, my first thought is “I wonder how this matchup will be for Fuerte” instead of “this character looks cool”.
Another reason is that with a slightly larger userbase, there will be more chances to explore more possibilites with the character, and get to know his true potential. But given enough time, this can still be done with a small portion of players, so its not a major issue for me.
I would have mained Fuerte, if Sagat wasn’t in this game.
This Mexican dude should get 950 health, slightly more damage on everything, and chainable close standing light punch.
The developers love El Fuerte! I don’t think he’ll go away any time soon.
Btw, I’m thinking the same thing too about the new chars and his potential, so exciting!
I’m going to be honest. When I see these new characters, I think whether or not they’ll fit my style. Juri looks like she’ll be a secondary. Mind you that I’m NEVER going to drop the luchador. I’ll start thinking about the matchups the moment I finally fight them.
i think us fuertes would suit guy as a secondary
command run sounds awesome.
but NEVER going to drop the luchador!
Ibuki or Guy would do. But there’s always the psycho bi.
I really hope that is enough, I really do 
Right now my secondary is Dhalsim, but I barely use him tbh. I will try out some of the new comers in SSF4, but I have a strong feeling I will end up using them only in random select when fighting very casual matches, or like Dhalsim at best. Good luck to all of you looking for a secondary though
is thread supposed to be about fuerte in SSF4? AND NOT STUPID TIER OPNIONS?
ok ok sorry…
Title is “El Fuerte improvement thread”. You ever stop to think that maybe one reason for this thread is because of his tier status and discussion on how improvements or lack of improvements could affect that status? Hmm. Maybe.
And you’re right. Opinions don’t belong in this thread. OH WAIT
Good point about Qbomb being in mind for having all three kicks for back run be picadillo jump. But just like we give up a kick for q-bomb already (Throw, Focus, Dropkick/normal Slide) I think we’d all adjust depending on our opponents, if we know they dont throw we can hold light Kick, etc
I think just giving Fuerte Faster Startup and better priority on Q-Bomb and better recovery on Gordita Sobat to allow combos would be great.
I can see it now: Fuerte gets the knockdown, forward dash three times, back run xx Q-BOMB
I changed my mind on EX Run being ungrabbable. Fuerte is all about the guessing game, and as mentioned some characters have crap Armor Breakers perhaps the same thing as for Abel… Tornado Throw has Throw immunity, EX TT has hit immunity. Same concept: Back Run gets throw, EX Already takes two hits, and as been stated, Reversal EX Back run immediatley canceled into tortilla is almost a guarunteed hit
If Fuerte is going to be Low Stamina Low Damage he should get Faster normals and slightly better priority…
Regarding Ultra Spark, his second Ultra, I think it’s obvious, This remedies his problem of not being able to ultra characters with Mid-Air directional Changing Moves.
Speaking of Ultras. I want Flying Giga Buster to hit harder. Yeah, I said it. Because I like seeing El Fuerte being like >:O for 3 seconds on the screen before going 
while showing off his arm muscles, doing a WTFMINDFUCK propellerbackflipsomething going upside down for some O: and a win quote
haha, awesome stuff! People should be honored to lose with a giga buster because it rocks!
I don’t mind if it keeps the same damage (just a bit more is welcome though), but I would actually rather the ultra spark to have a damage that is very close to it as well. Right now those mid-air trajectory changing characters get a free pass and jump around without fear of ultra punish for the most part, so the ultra spark should be just as dangerous as the giga buster against them to make things more even.
On another note, His super should REALLY have more meaningful uses to make it a viable option, as right now its hard to pick it over EX bars. I have never seen any pro Fuerte players using it at all, which leads me to think there really is no reason to pick the super over the EX guac/ EX run options, and that is an imbalance that needs fixing imo.
In general, I find Supers useless. More often then not, you’re going to be using that meter up like crazy. Come to think of it, who does use their super often?
What is this about mid-air trajectory changing? The way it’s worded makes it sound like some sort of air dash.
@KumaOso: lol sorry for my bad wording, don’t really know how to describe it better 
I am sure you know that I basically meant characters like Gouken who can float longer in air with a special to avoid getting caught by the giga buster. It is almost impossible to get an ultra on them unless they really mess up… Not fair :sad:
yea supers in general are a bit useless, though I have seen some Ryu pros use it sometimes.So I guess this is more of a game related problem than an only-Fuerte one…
Fuerte should get Zangiefs’ lariat but he only spins with one arm out.