I think Yun and Yang are much different to Rufus. Rufus needed 3 meters to do anything on wakeup, Yun does that stupid upkick thing and on block its ok, but on whiff he goes so far away its impossible to punish it. Also that ex rush punch thing gives him an easy way to get in, and it’s like nothing he does can be punished. I had to dig out my old main Rog who I hadn’t played in so long, and I spent the whole match playing like a pussy and kept Yun out, he got me in the corner and built that super so stupidly quick, I lost the round in no time. It was so frustrating, it’s like they get you in the corner and there is no way in hell you are getting out. Give Yun the health Seth had in super and I’ll be happy, seems quite radical but for all the pain these two have caused to so many players, I think it’s worth it. I mean, how often do you see Daigo get put in a corner and raped to shit. It’s extremely frustrating for me.
So what do you guys think, am I just a complete dumbass or is there some element of truth to what I’m saying? To sum it up, once the twins get in, you ain’t getting out unless doing random shit.
I think the problem is that most players don’t have good defense. Most players especially online players focus on combos so much that they forget to block half the time. If you’re attacking all time you’re going to get countered. If the first and second hit of a link combo doesn’t connect you really shouldn’t continue with the entire combo.
So far I have not seen anything great about Yun or Yang compared to other fighters in the game. I think they’re over rated just because top players use them. The only benefit I see with them being added is the faster pace fights.
Rufus is quite a bit different for several reasons. His hit box takes up like half the screen so it’s far easier to AA him. His walk speed is much slower on the ground too. These two things combined make it hard for him to get in reliably. Nobody thought Rufus was broken when vanilla was out in arcade at all, you’re just making shit up at this point. Anti-airing dive kicks is straight up a guessing game. There’s no consistent way to keep them out, don’t pretend like it’s as simple as finding a button that works and then pressing it. Yun can bait the normal and then punish it with a knockdown and then you’re basically going to die to retardo mix ups.
I’m not making up anything. Inititially when vanilla arcade came out, people thought Rufus was a good candidate for S-tier because someone had a 56 game win streak with him on the opening day. You MAY not remember this because it was a short lived thing. By the first month of SFIV, people knew Sagat was top tier.
Rufus has lower and steeper angels, and have more flexibility with his dive kick. If you think AA Rufus is easy you haven’t played one who is good at mixing up his dive kicks. From what I’ve seen so far, there isn’t as much diversity in the angles with Yun. It seems he can only divekick after the 5th frame of his jump. Making wakeup dive kicks much less of a viable option since they can be meatied relatively easily. Also the divekick hurt box seems easier to reach for the twins than in Rufus. They probably need faster walk speed because the divekicks really aren’t that great on their own.
As far a the lunge punches. They seem SLOWW to me. I’ve been able to react to each lunge punch (and trust me I’ve played with people who love to throw them out randomly). The ex will probably catch you if you’re sleeping, but they don’t seem to have a crapload of invincibility frames either. So they probably can be hit out of them. The shoulder seems unsafe on block from what I’ve seen. But maybe it’s because Yuns aren’t blocking after they do it. In either case, it doesn’t put him in enough plus to the point where he can do anything he wants after a blocked one.
I can agree, the twins are good, but they aren’t like 3s Chun-Li where they eliminate half of the cast.
A lot of people are seriously exaggerating the power of yun. Even on the streams skisonic is saying Yun should be banned. What a joke. I remember before super came out, there were podcasts where everyone was talking shit about capcom and saying capcom wanted guile to suck - and this was even after they “tested” him. Then Daigo beats everyone with guile right before the release date and guile is immediately at the top of the tiers. If you want a laugh go back to some of the old guile threads, you can see all the whining…People just jump on a bandwagon without even trying things out for themselves.
Lets see against yun using ryu as an example:
Wakeups: you can safe jump him easily and if he does dive kick you get free 300 dmg. Thats 35%.
You can OS MP DP if yun has no EX meter. When he gets EX you just do delay cr.HK OS on jumpins. This effectively shuts down every single wakeup he has.
So, Yun cannot escape mixup pressure after an untech knockdown. This means rufus has better wakeups than yun.
All of his specials leave him at frame disadvantage except for EX lunge. lp shoulder is safe at the right distance but it’s still -3.
For example, lp lunge get punished for 270 minimum by ryu on block.
I don’t see this match as impossible for ryu at all. But this is only the 3rd day so i could be completely wrong. I would much rather fight Yun than Fei Long. If Yun was broken, i would already be saying this match was impossible.
Once everyone breaks down all the yun options i think the matchup might be a lot of fun because of his low health and bad defense.
Yun doesn’t apply pressure. He guesses into easy damage.
Dustlooper, you know better than to say that Yun’s super damage than Yang. It does not. Genei Jin cannot cause ~600 damage without dipping into Ultra meter.
This whole low-risk concept to Yun is garbage. One SRK or hard knockdown is all it takes to change the momentum back into your favour. And guess what, SRKs go through everything he has - palms, upkicks, poke strings, command grab attempts, everything.
To fight against good Yuns, you just need to know how to read.
Yun has been out for half a year at least in Japan. What are you guys smoking? 3 days ago? Training mode availability is just icing on the cake.
And yeah, like the other guy said, just because they’re good, doesn’t mean you’re all gonna be able to pick him up and rape everything in sight.
They’re good, but this doesn’t really compare to vanilla Sagat w/safe Tiger Knee trap in the corner against 90% of the cast and 60% damage off everything with or withou meter; that’s much less effort than twins mashing blockstrings for meter into Geneijin/Shadow.
If you read frame data and play a lot you’d realize the twins have almost no invincible moves and only the ex moves are safe… learn to read drama data and you’ll see how unsafe they are.
It’s also cause they are new. They have the super adin factor where no ones knows what that Fuck to do. Look at Rufus, he was widely a mix up character because no one knew what to do. Now they know his shit and he is still good because he has a solid mod game. Twins will he the same
His Palm strike is REALLY strong and can handle fireballs really easily, and once he starts glowing blue its pretty much over as soon as he gets a hit on you:
this. the twins and fei are not “broken” as people say. the problem as many other people have said is just the fact that the majority of the cast is just mediocre while A tier and higher are full of good characters. if you want to see broken look up pet shop from jojo’s bizarre adventure or hdr akuma. the top 3 does not in slightest make match ups as impossible as the characters i just mentioned. you’ll just have to work hard depending on your character.
I’m calling it now…after evo we will have all figured out the twins bs. Maybe before… with how rapid info is passed and every mother fucker has to post a combo video exposing everything give it time… soon we will figure them out.
I’m sure Yun mod play will keep it at an even keel. Yun doesn’t even do well in 3s because of rushdown, at least not until he activates Geneii Jin. Until then, most Yuns just turtle for meter. That’s not a very difficult gameplan to set up in this game.
I really like how Yun can use his palm strike on the multi hitting fireballs like Akuma’s red fireball and still jump after nullifying the first one.
play 98 goro daimon and u will know what is broken or play steve in tekken 5,yun is not broken he is just better and i dont think if he has any bad matchups.
The problem is all of his tools are exceptional and rewarding compared to most of the rest of the cast. He won’t be a completely easy mod top tier though because you do stuff dumb and he can get busted. Also his divekick is probably the fastest in the game making getting in combined with his other tools really easy.
Make st. MP not cancellable like in 3S and he’d probably become a lot more fair. Everything combo’s into it into lunge punch or upkicks into more rush down. Most of his combo’s deal like 150-230 no meter which is pretty insane given his great options and the oki followup.