Disgusting ignorant "analysis" of the FGC's "highly problematic player culture" from MIT

Current Fighting Games Fighting Game Discussion
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Guy: “Can’t I get my Street Fighter without sexual harassment?”

Aris: “No, you can’t! Because they’re one and the same thing”

He’s a disgrace not only for the FGC but for mankind, period. Anyone who tries to defend a scumbag like him is stupid, to say the least.

BTW, he never truly apologized or said that he was completely and utterly wrong on his statements, so he must still believes that he’s right, we can’t have fighting games without this disgusting sub-culture of hate and disrespect, wich should ashamed any half-decent human being.

I’m 34 and grew up playing SFII in the arcades (since 1991) and we had a lot of disrespect back then, but that was not because “FGs are like that, take the whole package or leave”, that was because most of us was immature and stupid kids, but guess what?, most of us became adults and started acting accordingly.

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I’m not wasting my time watching those long videos, but the comments here are interesting…and seem to have gone as they always do to the topic of sexism/feminists etc. Interesting that there is such a strong fixation on this from a 99.99% male fanbase.

I don’t watch a ton of shit, just big tournaments sometimes. However I did see the ‘real niggaz don’t cry’ and the Aris vid cause it was so talked about. Anyways it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to see how bad it looks. People can only judge from what they see and hear, and it looks damn awful. Especially when spouted from a morbidly obese individual who has probably never been laid in his life, it is hard to see it as just playful teasing. The end result is it scares off whatever women may have been interested in participating offline. Hey but if u guys love sausage fests, that is all fine and good.

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it goes the other way too. Sherry Jenix being sponsored simply because of her vagina and not for her skills is a great example.
if you got a demographic that’s mostly nerdy males, playing competitive games, what do you expect? it’s going to breed that kind of culture and that’s just natural. it’s great that we’re more aware of this problem now but it’s never going away. we can make it better but it’s not the end of the world and there’s no need to be ultra sensitive about it.

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No, it’s not, Fighting Gamers are not “mostly nerd”, and whatever there’s a huge difference between being “nerd” and being sexist and disrespectful.

You’re part of the problem if you think that way, and -furthermore- try to convince us of that and take it as “natural” and acceptable. Go to a psychiatrist, please.

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Actually he’s sarcastically criticizing the main reason women get special treatment in any male centric scene. For better and for worse.

One could also point out that a female player gets 1000X the attention (and sponsorship deals) that a male player of the exact same caliber of skill could only dream of getting, just for having a rare vagina in the middle of a sausage fest. That’s the annoying reality and we can’t change that.

The problem lies in the hypocrisy of wanting to keep the positive special treatment, but complaining when it also comes with the negative part. You can’t have your cake and eat it too. The solution is earn the respect DESPITE your gender, not BECAUSE of it, and that is done by being more competent than the people around you.

I have no idea how Woshige looks like, all I see is the actions on the screen after he presses buttons, but god damn the guy is good at what he does, which is to win with Millia.

In the same manner, people have no idea how I look like, what’s my height, weight, race, gender, hair color etc. but they appreciate the hard work and knowledge I pour into the videos I make. I am only measured by my competence at the field of making videos, and that’s the only real way to play “fair”. Every other person who will do well in this type of scale, regardless of gender or race, will get what he/she deserves.

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Well this is the fault of the FGC fanbase. If I suck and someone is willing to sponsor me, I’m not going to refuse.

I watched a lot of EVO this year, and yeah the vast majority are nerdy males…looking a bit like the D&D crowd or those that are hardcore Star trek enthusiasts. However stuff like what Aris pulled just makes the FGC look even worse to outsiders.

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I hope I don’t get killed for posting this…
So, I’ve got some thoughts:
I like the idea of yelling “OMG THE MERITOCRACY, WHY CANT I JUST BE AN EQUAL!” the next time I’m not doing well at a tournament and I hear people snickering behind me. In fact, I may even yell it whether or not there’s anyone watching, just to preemptively stop any sort of snickering. Seriously though, that cracked me up.

In terms of treating others (strangers) in a certain way because that’s how you treat your friends… not a good idea usually. I act a certain way when hanging out with friends at my house or somewhere else that’s private, and I may say certain things, but I would think twice about behaving that way with them in public or with strangers that way. I mean, you have every right to behave as silly as you want with friends, but if you behave in public that way, you’re free to be judged as being a bunch of idiots by people with different sensibilities. It’s like how when I take the train after high school kids get out of school and they all behave like idiots. They speak loudly, they yell, they squeeze through people without saying “excuse me”, they curse with little kids around, etc. Everyone on the train shakes their heads thinking to themselves, “fucking kids”. The kids meanwhile, are oblivious. This is how they act with their friends, why should they have to conduct themselves properly in front of all these strangers on the train? It’s the same at a fighting game event. This isn’t a private place for you to behave however you want, it’s public. I mean, some people at these events ultimately do end up behaving however they want, some of them very obnoxiously. But if you behave that way in public, you’re going to be judged in a certain light.

And to those suggesting that if Aris had treated her differently, as opposed to the way he may treat his friends which includes inappropriate jokes, then that would have been sexist… that’s just downright stupid. Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see how you could treat or speak to a stranger the same way you speak to your best pal. You can say something racist to a good friend and your friend will know you’re just being stupid and laugh with you and not take it serious. You say something racist to a stranger, guess what, you are a racist. Or at least that’s what the stranger is going to think. I talk so much shit with my friends when I play with them, but I wouldn’t think of doing that with a stranger because I have no way of knowing how they’ll react. And if you want to treat a stranger the same way you treat your friends, fine, but don’t be surprised when they react defensively or when you’re viewed in a certain light because of the way you treat them (since they don’t know you).

I don’t think we are a sexist community. I think… the sexist question is more complicated than that. Firstly, any examples of online play or chat need to be thrown out the window. If I judged humanity based on what I see online then humanity is unsalvageable. Sometimes I wonder if what is seen as sexist is really just socially awkward interaction. I read about half of that woman’s article, and in one part she talks about how a guy sat to play with her and asked if he should “take it easy” on her. They then went on to have a few more awkward exchanges as they played. So assuming this story is true, I wondered if he was trying to be friendly but wasn’t quite sure how to speak to her. Some of the people in the community are awkward around females, some just don’t have much experience around females. I remember seeing an interview of Gilty (I think that’s how she spells it) with SkiSonic, and he looked very nervous and awkward. I am going to guess that a fair number of the people at events get awkward and nervous around females because of their lack of experience or familiarity being around females. I could easily picture my high school self going up to a female gamer and asking jokingly and teasingly (in a non malicious manner) if I should take it easy on her, and I would hope her reaction would be something along the lines of her teasing back with “You should be concerned with me not taking it easy on you”. We would then make out and get married and have kids and live happily ever after. Older me knows that if I approach a female gamer with that line, and if she has a defensive mindset, she may see it as me being condescending.
The author also pointed out that when she walked in, she felt all the eyes on her because she was this random female walking into a room full of males. She went on to feel uncomfortable as she walked around and was nervous to prove herself. The uncomfortable feeling and nervousness happens to everyone, male or female, so I don’t know where she was going with that. She told a story of how someone was playing repeatedly, and she couldn’t play next unless she actually said next. Again, this is common, you have to be a little pushy at times to play next. Her point of walking into the room and feeling all eyes on her because she is female, that might actually be true but it’s to be expected. I mean, if I walk into Sephora to buy a lotion I really like for my hands, I’m going to draw some attention from the females. It’s to be expected. Doesn’t mean they’re sexist in Sephora, but they will be surprised to see a sole straight male in their midst buying something for himself and not his girlfriend. If one of the women inside were to point at a lipstick and say “That shade would look good on you”, I would laugh and respond with something witty and we would then make out and get married and have kids and live happily ever after. Of course, if I walked in with a defensive mindset, I would see everyone looking at me and think, “Why is everyone looking at me, cuz I’m a guy?!”. And then when the female made the lipstick comment I would yell " OMG THE MERITOCRACY, WHY CANT I JUST BE AN EQUAL!".
So, I mean, there’s so much that goes into the issue of sexism that I think it’s important to not simplify it. I’m sure there are some sexist individuals, and I’m sure there are some awkward individuals, and I’m sure there are some female gamers who approach with a defensive mindset, and I’m sure there are plenty of other things I haven’t spoken about. If anything I think the problem may be tied more to immaturity within the fgc than sexism, and the immaturity extends beyond the issue of sexism. There’s the immaturity of those who think it’s ok to treat strangers a certain way because that’s “arcade culture” without a thought of how it makes the other person feel (I’m picturing CORN in this instance), the way a T.O. may treat a player, or a player treats a T.O., or how T.O.'s treat each other sometimes. I mean, I’m sure all of you can come up with instances of immaturity in the fgc (some of the comments here strike me as immature. How can you think it’s ok to treat a stranger the same way you treat your friend? And how can you say it would be sexist to behave otherwise?).
But to focus on all that ignores all the good in the fgc. The fgc has made efforts to include its female player base. The most obvious example was the female only event at EVO a few years ago. I have seen some local events offer free entry to female gamers (please don’t argue that this is an example of reverse sexism). And to focus on the immaturity in the fgc is also a bad idea. In my time in the fgc and going to events (whenever I can go, which isn’t as often as I would like), I’ve seen far more good and heard far more good than I have bad. Of course, there may be some bad apples, but that issue exists everywhere.

What really bothered me, and I think everyone here, about the video is how little actual research seemed to go into it. This feels like an example of taking the data you want to take to create the argument you want to make, and ignoring everything else. I think they would have learned a lot more by simply going up to people at fgc events and speaking to them.

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:rofl:

keep believing that bud

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They’re gettin’ the FGC confused with folks that play Street Fighter and Marvel…as usual. And even then, they still just used a few examples to paint a pretty broad picture about those people. Sgdh.

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It seems you’re mistaking “personal respect” to “respect to a player”. No matter if people are good or bad players, you must respect them in the personal sense, not be rude to them. What can be justified only if they provoked first, and sometimes not even in that case.
Girls generally do not explicitly DEMAND to be treated specially, in fact there are many of them who actually prefer not recieving too much attention from guys, specially on “sausage fests”, because they feel obliberated. But they can demand NOT TO BE TREATED RUDELY, for sure. It’s part of your right as a person.

In the end, it sounds just like you’re kind of jealous of girls getting attention and you accept and condone them being mistreated in exchange.

Like I said, it was a lack of sensitiveness. It’s like, you know, obvious. Girls are not as ‘confortable’ with gross sexual references are guys are.
And Aris was poking Miranda with that all along. He seriously should have at least suspected he was making her uncomfortable. In fact, it looks like Aris was enjoying that; he was basically accosting her. Bullying her, with gross sexual allusions. That’s plain disgusting.
It’s like, who knows, starting to make Nazi jokes to a Jew or a black person you just met. Or mocking at fat people with an obese guy. That’s plain being an asshole, and in Aris case, seriously look like stereotypical sexual accosting.

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Magegg is dead on, just cause someone draws attention (which they aren’t even tryin’ too, but put a woman in a typical FGC crowd is like putting a big slab of meat in front of a starving lion) doesn’t excuse treating them like shit. As for earning respect, whose fault is that really? If all the lonely hardcore male gamers want to put a woman on the pedestal just cause she plays games, well besides this being pathetic, it is the fault of the male gamers not the female.

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Wonder how all those fucks defending Aris would act if it was their mom on crosscounter being asked by him if he could smell her.

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Yeah nowadays I see more white people in the scene than anything. Funny story, I’ve been out of the Seattle scene for awhile and in that time I’ve changed a good bit physically, lost a bit of weight, cut my dreads, changed galsses and a ton. Alot of people didn’t recognize me outside of the Seattle FGC, Mikehascookie’s takes one look at me, instantly knows who I am, I ask him how and the reason was the best “Dude you’re black, we only got like 8 left” lol.

Also yo, Sherry Jenix does more to harm women int he FGC than damn near anything. The fact more people know about her than Kayane for some god forsaken reason is shameful. And for people bitching about Aris, dude got complaints about how he was advertsiing his newest shirt and he quickly and very nicely changed how it was done and respected people. And it’s funny how people get mad about Aris making jokes about other peoples appearance, bu it’s totally okay for y’all Social Justice Warriros to clown on him for being a big dude. Bunch of hypocritical fools.

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eh, i dont know. i dont really care, but sherry hate doesnt make much sense. its comparable to justin wong hate in 2009. while everyone who has been around forever was like lets fucking go justin, everyone else was like boooo. then he went to grand finals, had a great set with daigo where he played balrog, and then all the noobs were like yaaaay. anyways, sherry has legit beat combofiend at a wnf with combo playing that shin akuma character vs cviper. combo just got bopped. she has knowledge and control of her character, but shes not a top level player. most of the times she is on the stream she has never been overly disrespectful to anyone or outlandishly annoying. she just commentates, and or just fills some free air time before handing over the mic after a few minutes.

sherry hate is mostly from rumors of who she is banging and her tagging along with friends she has made at tournies. sorta the same way people hated noel before noel proved many times reasons to not like him. people were like who is this fucking tag along, and how is his jobless ass flying everywhere. ive met sherry before, chit chatted with her, offered to buy her a drink before i found out she was 19 (lol), invited her up to a marvel room in the hotel where the good players were playing, made some side bets with her in a marvel room at evo, and she was nice, approachable and cool.

i dont care who jocks sherry, who she fucks, where her money comes from, or anything other then are you not a shit head, and can you play. the latter two i personally havent seen online and offline, except i guess her confrontation with that one female gamer, but thats a different story that started before evo, and shes grown since then it seems.

people in america naturally arent going to know much about kayane. european majors are all kinds of random times for us here in the states. she doesnt really come here often. she doesnt make top 8 or even 16 enough for you to even know she was there if she was, except i think early days of sc5. kayane also hasnt been involved in any scandals or slander outside of random rumors of her and pr balrog which never really got disrespectful.

unless you can name some solid things as to why to not like sherry, i dont see any reason to bully her at all really. i even felt she was a legit diversity choice on cross assault. she actually knew how to play sf4 and could at least transfer that execution and game engine knowledge to sfxt. she wasnt going to win, but shes definitely top 5 females in the usa in sf4 i feel. cviper too random, too good. lol

also random about aris. i remember when aris and tastysteve first met. i remember this vividly, it was a great tekken stream, and at one point steve says, “you know youre fat right?”. aris kinda awkwardly pauses like yeah i guess, like yeah im fat man. then steves like yeah see thats fine, as long as you know youre fat, and not pretending like youre not fucking fat. i was like oh damn, and then like right after that little exchange, aris was like, i like you. lol. it was funny because aris is use to busting balls and then steve is pretty quick and witty, and busted aris’s balls a little. dat boy had to pause for a second like oh shit, am i getting styled on. but it was all good

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I don’t give a fuck about who’s diddling Sherry or anythign personal against her. met her a few times and she was nothing but cool, just find it weird SJWs and random females always complain about not enough good female representation, ad people always wanna run straight o Sherry when you got Kayane right there. Eh guess I can’t hate to much, like you said she cool and it did make sesne to have her on the show.

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It’s more like the minority of people who do go play offline arguing with the people who only experience the FGC via streams and online. The latter thinking that every scene/community is the same all around the globe.

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Somebody’s stream, 3rd strike guys? DrSub w Long Island Joe Pyrolee the guest maybe, had the idea of the “bizarro/scumbag FGC”… whatever the FGC is. Actually that’s more for Shinobi’s topic, before that got ruined with violence threats by some other nerd. Making a division between the 2 kinds, or just putting the thought out there quite a long time ago really.

And yeah its just a buncha nerds with their Japanese videogames where the most notable players are super dedicated to their games… aka (otaku) nerds.

There’s videos out there for you guys that go to the tournament and only hang out there all day, Combofiend being interviewed. ‘Yeah I’m getting older now, I go out and do stuff in this city I’ve never been to, get some culture in have fun. Can’t stay in the ballroom all day anymore.’ The funny stereotype is it stinks, convention stinky people, gamers/non-gamers, whatever. And etiquette on not even asking about saving a chair, so nervous and anxious bro, gotta sit here the whole time to save my precious seat and really good view!

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It tells me they should probably hire professionals whose job it is to do this stuff, and go over their guidelines with what they expect from them, instead of hiring players with a history of being extreme, and just placing the mic in front of them and saying “Have fun.”

The hilarious thing here is your doing to me the same shit you’re doing to Aris. You don’t know me. You don’t know what I have been through, what I have or have not felt. You have no fucking idea weather I know how she did or didn’t feel. Your making an assumption and then leaping off the deep end with it like a retard. Do us all a favor and unplug your keyboard so you longer post this kind of bullshit. Thanks.

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So you’re saying that we’re 13 year olds for enjoying the games we play and competing against better players instead of demanding respect and making money off a hobby.

Damn yo, God forbid and all that shit.

Ask a Olympian and ask why they put so much time into the things they do, ask one of those old grandmasters that coaches up and comers to chess, ask Alex Valle why he still plays Street Fighter when he was around before Genesis 1:1; A lot of them will say that they enjoy the things they do; pushing themselves to be better with money/respect being second. Of course there’s people that place respect/money first, but you can’t say that the former is childish.

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I dunno how many people don’t realize just how dry and straight Aris pulls his act. I swear that a bunch of niggas can’t pick up these inferences. You can hear it how he plays it out in his podcasts and guides that he’s being deliberately wry. He was wry and dry on Cross Counter as well. The thing is he usually knows his boundaries, but the true problem came in with the miscommunication by Miranda. If she truly didn’t jive with it, she should have spoke up and communicated with Aris to have it resolved cleanly, quietly, and explicitly. It was only last minute that she spoke out against it and did it too publicly. Her lack of communication to resolve the bit early on with Aris added to the problem. Aris’ fault in this is his lack of verification and confirmation with Miranda to play out the bit.

Aris isn’t stupid and oblivious. To play his kind of act, you need to be observant and self-conscious to properly play upon social awkwardness to try to make it funny and appealing. It’s like how Tig Notaro plays her act, although Aris is more crude and is audience centered to the “FGC.” Miranda’s miscommunication and silence accidentally communicated her consent to play off the bit.

So to all the niggas that say he’s just a pig-disgusting, awkward, insensitive turbonerd, y’all need to work on not taking everything at face value; and you’re just showing your inability to assess and recognize dry humor and reveal your own ignorance and obliviousness. In regards to the CC incident, everyone is at fault and lacked better organizational communication skills to foster a better working environment, understanding, and trust while pulling acts and bits for entertainment value.