CvS2: P-Groove Thread

Classic Fighting Games Capcom VS SNK 2
161

…

to a new p groover DVD i would suggest just learning how to fight without parry and do not try to parry every

if u already have your footies game down you will understand when you need to parry

and try to use characters that have big damage potential off a poke… but without having to use a super

IE kyo geese eagle iroi cammy sagat bleh bleh bleh

and very last but not least ALWAYS use your normals for anti air… you dont wanna miss a parry and get combo’d or u dont wanna attempt to parry while they empty jmup

i think p is more of a threat of parry… that u have and not actually using it. Parry changes peoples playing style from what they are comfortable with.

162

Thanks for the props and advice. I know ALL my matches that are out there suck. The fucked up thing about it is i’ve been runnin around sayin im hella good and shit…

163

stick with rolento. i gotta give u props for that vega.

164

well i can front for you beein good,i don’t think thats in questions.

165

Thx fellas. But thats the point of my last post. I’ve never said anything about my skill at all on these boards. I don’t brag and i don’t pretend like im hella good and anybody who knows me knows that. But this guy comes to the p-groove thread to take a few shots at me like i’m overdue. Points out flaws in my matches like somebody asked him, then tells me 'It’s ok to put Sagat or Cammy as your R2. People won’t say anything… ’ Like i’m stupid enough to be on some anti toptier shit and i’m playing lower tier characters JUST to prove some kind of point. Which btw would only matter online because in the higher levels of play, from svgl to japan, nobody gives a shit so dont think you’ll get a pat on the back just cuz you use ryo, dan, r2 yun…

Me and magus play together often and i can vouch for him and myself that the matches we have online are not accurate representations of our skills but that shit doesen’t matter. This is the p-groove thread so lets keep it on topic

166

Here’s an interesting about parries. This happened to me today when I whiffed a close S.HK with Kyo and immediately after, go for a low parry and got it. It seemed like the parry shortened the recovery time of the move. I dunno, I found that really weird. Anyone wanna confirm this? I’ve done it with quite a number of other moves as well.

167

How is Sagat immobile in P Groove though? Granted he doesnt have a run which does limit is mobility some but most people end up walking with Sagat anyway. The man covers so much ground just by walking its stupid. I dont see how P Groove really renders his mobility at all. He still has everything he needs to be effective, plus a parry, think about it its Sagat who is already sick enough with a damn parry. You dont even need a super to deal massive amounts of damage. Just something stupid like parry fierce does stupid amounts of damage as it is with it.

Im not trying to start an arguement btw, just trying to get a better view point on things.

168

eightysix

It didn’t shorten the time at all. Actually whiffing those moves leaves you in more trouble than if you hit them with it because they dont share any of the recovery time with you. All that happened is he reacted in a usual way to your whiff by attacking low (many attacks in sf games are low attacks - like 70% or somethin) and you covered your bases by parrying low just in case he tried to hit back around the time you were safe. This is sorta like baiting whiffs and punishing with supers, specials, or higher priority normals. Its basically a counter hit set up. And baiting parries is just another version of counter hit set ups

Jae hoon

You’re right about sagat covering alot of ground with just his normals. Your right about pretty much all that other stuff too. Here’s the thing tho. Sagat walks really slowly so if you’re out of his best range and you make a mistake he can’t capitalize very well by jumping in since his jump is pretty slow and his walk is slow. Every other sagat gets in by running or rolling. P has neither so when you look at it like that you’ll see why people think p sagat is immobile. He has none of the options to get in fast. But you’re correct he is a really good p groove character

169

ya sagat is always good but imagine a p-sagy vs like iori or guile,they can jus keep throwing booms or whatever till you jump or advance,just hope you have life advantage ,sit back and let them come,this at least nulls booms

170

If you guys can critique how I play … I’d appreciate it. Like what I need to work on, and what I need to stop doing (bad habits)

http://www.justdefend.com/GokouvsDream.wmv

Thanks.

171

Not too much parrying there, only wake-up attacks against Blanka’s electricity.

Kyo looked to be afraid of Dhalsim for some reason.
The Hibiki did well, the one clutch use of a counter…
Chun was good but again, nothing special used from P-Groove.

172

…

if u wanna a good Fight where its P groove vs A groove and im playing A id be more than willing to send it to u through aim

contact me as krazyflip25@aol.com

173

Gotta be more consistant with your b&bs. There were no mixups with Kyo. Against Sim you can parry the fireball and then DP the poke; this takes care of the trap. Anyway, a bit more aggression can’t hurt. P-Kyo is dangerous because of the threat of damage, but Sim wasn’t pressured at all. You can beat his normals with c.mp, plus you’re not risking much since you can option select. I think when you get better at parrying you’ll be more dangerous; there were some points where you didn’t really have to parry or you parried and didn’t capitalize on the parry. Anyway, I can’t really give any more advice since you were playing against Sim; if you have something like a Kyo vs. Blanka vid we’d probably be able to tell you more. In general though, be more aggressive

174

Thank you. To be honest, I don’t know Kyo. I often go for cr short cr mp into double kick chain … should I just go for the punch chain?

I am not used to playing a game outside of run. I know very little of Kyo’s mixup, care to enlighten me?

175

I guess I can offer a general idea, but I’ve posted in the Kyo section before so I’ll only give you some starting points. If your opponent is wide open after a parry (like when you parry Sagat’s tigeruppercut) you have all the time in the world to do close s.HKXXqcf+HK, K, DP+HK (or super if you have it). You have to time the DP+HK when their body is lower to the ground or you miss the last hit. A variation is after the qcf+HK, K, do towards+HP (the shoulder tackle) XX qcb + K to get them into the corner. Anyway, in general I will use the aragami chain for b&b:

c.lk(or c.mp), c.mp (or s.mp if it’s a taller character), aragami (qcf+mp, qcf+mp, towards+K)

damage:

s.HK, qcf+HK, K, dp+HK = 4250
s.HK, qcf+MK, K, super = 6700, 7100(in the corner)
clk,clp,cmp, aragami = 3170 (minus the jab = 2900)

I’d say these are basic combos that any Kyo player should know. After that you’re set for the basic mixup. Mastering the timing on the crossup smalljump+dHP and the empty small jump crossup gives you some tools to use after a roundhouse throw; they can’t safe fall so the timing is the same. Anyway, a few options after a HK throw are:

qcf+LK, dp+lk, empty small jump, smalljump dHP, RDP+lk

Anyway, the idea is to mix up high/low and throw in some cross ups. Practice c.lk, c./s.MP, aragami so that you never miss. If they block low you can nail them with a smalljump dHP. Obviously don’t get predictable; throw them as much as you can to the point where you can do c.lk, pause, c.lkXXcombo because they’re expecting the throw. I dunno, there are tonnes of things that the opponent has to worry about and I don’t have time to list them all and I’m starting to ramble. I’ve gotta go now, so maybe I’ll post more later. Try to get some vids of Makoto playing Kyo and you’ll understand why Kyo’s so dangerous.

176

Yay

I was thinking about switching from P, to either K, C, N, or S. And A is in the running too.

177

No. You weren’t. :rolleyes:

178

Thoughts on P-Sakura? I know her A groove incarnation is 20 times better, but I think she makes a good P groove character as well. Maybe as battery … her bnb builds good meter and she has a nice mixup afterwards. She also has good pokes and GC strings. I wouldn’t put her as R2.

Btw, this is Legendary Gokou.

179

Although not AS good as her A-Groove counterpart like you said, she does really well as a battery. She has a good poke (S.HK), good anti-airs/air-to-air, plus everything else you mentioned. And parry just adds on to her game. Overall, I’d say she’s really good in P-Groove.

There’s a Japanese player that used to play P-Sakura a long time ago named Bouya. Dunno if he still plays anymore though.

180

Maybe I can clarify the sagat lag thought. I also think sagat is really limited and slow in p-groove, but I see where you’re coming from. He’s pretty strong and has those nice meaty jump ins and hops.

You have to understand that sagat isn’t really all that sick without his rush down(run and/or JD) or a roll.

His walking speed is slow: This makes him to easy to poke. Since he can’t run or roll you can count on him having to jump to get anywhere.

His feirces have a lot of recovery time: If you wiff a feirce in P-groove, you give any top tier the advantage to control pace. It’s not like you can follow it up with something, you’re to slow to do anything afterwards that wouldn’t get RCd or JD. So you’re left with poking with short, which isn’t gonna scare anybody cause if you follow a short up with feirce or a jump(your only weapons)…you loose your pace advantage cause everybody saw that jump coming anyway. Short does nothing.

And he is a big target for RCs: Sakura’s RH hurricane kick must be parried on the first hit, and that’s pretty hard to do when you have to think about position and poking. For that reason alone I gave him up, heh. Plus his size gives other characters a huge range advantage. His size makes it easier for blanka to dash in and rc electricity…bigger dashing range. Cannon arrows own you 'cause they’re hard to parry in the first place and you’re really big, and cammy ownz you anyway cause she’s a beast:D…Every top tier hop in the game also ownz you btw :frowning: .

These three things combined, don’t make for a very good rushing game do they? Where’s the pressure of Sagat getting close??? It’s not there. You can’t exactly dash in either, What are you gonna do, wiff feirces and try to jump in? Good luck. You’ll never get in range for anything because it’s to easy to follow his movements and poke him.

Also: Turtling sucks with him to. remember when I said that you can’t poke effectively with him? Now try turtling vs. A-sak, or K-Blanka WITHOUT getting guard broken. GG

Sagat relies way to heavilly on parrying in order to be usefull in
P-groove…his game is just parrying basically.

So what is he good for in P-groove??? Poking with short and hopping RH…or… If you’re nervous about a match in tournament or for money, picking sagat first wouldn’t be a bad choice because you won’t get slaughtered, but you won’t win either and it will help figure out your opponent without risking your good characters to some bad luck of early round
K-rushdown or sakura CC…Is this your opinion???

I had to explain for everyone because it is hard to see at first why sagat sucks in P-groove.
it took me about 50 games to realize that he was holding my
P-team back(fortunately all in one night:)).

My advice would be to sub in rolento and runaway and poke in order to interpret your opponents playing methods, you’ll probably win to. Or if you like Sagat’s style to much to live without, apply it to P-Kyo and I guarantee results…watch makoto murder Ino’s K-sagat with P-kyo…beast!

Pgat: to much work, to little results.