Claw's 2013 wishlist

[TriasNT]

yeah it is.

Are you seriously going to sit there and claim that Vega’s lack of reversal is what keeps him from being a tournament winner?

The answer is obviously « yes » ! If you’ve got that you can stop a false blockstring as soon as you’ve guessed once correctly. Without, you have to keep guessing correctly during the whole blockstring…

But nothing that I could say will get to you, so I will let all other Claw players say it for me :

Also fuck all this “Vega doesnt need it” talk, we need a godamn reversal or a 3 frame normal (c.lk maybe? shit is omega worthless atm)

When people lose VS Claw there almost always will be something that they could have done about it - whitout the need to guess right.
When Claw lose is pretty much because they just jumped. And there is nothing that he could have done. Guess right doesn’t count.

I believe vega is mid tier in ae2012 and the limit for a major placement is top 8, much similar like most of the other mid tiers (except for extremely few exceptions that confirm the rule). Without an invincible get of me move its virtually impossible to win a top level major.

I was talking to my other half about this yesterday and I honestly think had they given Super time to develop, Vega would have been a pretty strong character.
All that really held him from being the top of the tiers was the lack of reversal and solid AA.
Which I wish people would get through their heads when I say this but CAPCOM WON’T GIVE HIM THIS.

Guess what system Capcom puts in their games?

Anyway, if it’s a wishlist, 4 frames of invul on EX ST

I could go asking to you the same question you did asked to me, Pedoviejo, but I’ll save you this nonsense.

lol what??

Vortex? That isn’t a vortex. Those are simple mix up games. Stop using words that don’t apply.
Look up what a real vortex is, all he has is simple mix ups. This isn’t SF2 where 50/50 games can lead brutal to brutal health loss.

It leads to brutal health loss.

If you do anything but block high against a Claw safe-jump, you’ll eat between 110 and 329 of damage. Reversals will be punished, backdashes, option selected.
If you haven’t got invincible reversal, the next attack is a +11 frame trap, where you can choose to block (and thus be thrown), or tech (and eat 259 damage). And Claws block/tech mix-up continues longer than most chars.

If you choose to go corpse-hop, you do frame trap him, and add a block back high/block back low 50/50 mix-up. Even Ryu’s HP SRK would trade against a well timed bjHP, and he would take more damage than you would.
Do I need to mention Izuna loop where he must do anything but block, and will still take damage for it ?

It’s a situation where the attacker has a great advantage against the defender, which options are heavily limited. You can mix-it up between block front high, block back high, block back low, and evade. Your arguing about something so obvious indicates me clearly that you’re just denying, trying to avoid to look dumb in public, not discussing. Thus that you will continue arguing whatever I might say to you.

I’m not interested in wasting my time in such way. You’re confusing vortex game (which are based on knockdown) with advancing frame-traps. Nothing else to say.

[pedoviejo]

[media=youtube]LLYt2jhxcSc[/media]

[media=youtube]ORqf0QGf8_Y[/media]

this is your Vortex?

things that players have been doing since SF4?

really? bwhahahahahaha

that isn’t vortex son, its high low mix ups or left right mix ups. Only a fool would block high after a corpse hop Cosmic Heel. Blocking invalidates a lot of your “vortex”.

You corpse hop? Big deal, block low and tech if you see the throw coming. The worst that you can do is throw, and im willing to take the chance of you throwing me and then spending more meter to only take ~150 damage to put me back in a situation where all I have to do is block a safe jump and worry about teching properly.

You safe jump? Big deal, block high and go to low. Rinse and repeat.

Blocking invalidates half the stuff in your video. The other half is Magneto style cross ups that are hard to react to and are simply left right mix ups, and even then, if the opponent knows you are going to go for cross up FBA, there are ways out.

This isn’t a vortex, these are 50/50 set ups because you cannot interchange all 5 possible outcomes (Cosmic Heel cross up, JB.HP, Tick Throw, cross up FBA, low attack) at once.

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But please, do try again, these “conversations” are always fun way to spend time.

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AS for the the AA Scarlett Terror.

Does he need it?

Yes he does,

But there are other things he needs more than a non FADC reversal or a down back thus limiting space management non FADC AA.

It would be nice to have them for those specific situations, but he won’t die if he won’t have them, and it won’t certainly make him a tournament favorite. Because people are still going to safe jump you and not give a damn about your non FADC reversal because they know the risk is still heavily on their side.

[Rizhall]

Vortex is a word the community made up for ambiguous, hard to read mixups with a lot of options that are hard to block. Vega has those, just not as effective or free as Ibuki or Akuma (designated “vortex” characters) so please stfu and stop acting like an arrogant jackass.

I hope they nerf Vega.
Hmph.

[pedoviejo]

Vortex is a word the community made up for ambiguous, hard to read mixups with a lot of options that are hard to block. Vega has those, just not as effective or free as Ibuki or Akuma (designated “vortex” characters) so please stfu and stop acting like an arrogant jackass.

I hope they nerf Vega.
Hmph.

no it was invented by Sabin when he went to Japan to study up on Dhalsim to define what a real Zangief, Akuma, or Abel player did when he got in.

Essentially, if you got knocked down, there was more than two modes of attack, very ambiguous, which if successful put you back in the same situation or worse, and they mostly had primitive OS to keep you from back dashing. essentially forcing you to either block or jump at a huge risk regardless, because escaping successfully yielded no results for you except space, of which he could easily win back.

The community just took the word and bastardized it applying to everybody because it sounded cool. So no, Vega doesn’t have a vortex because the only hard to read mix ups he has is cross up FBA or Cosmic Heel. And because his other options do not yeild the same results as real mix up characters nor are they even remotely as safe as the others he doesn’t have a Vortex. All he has is 50/50 mix up games.

Don’t confuse objectivity with arrogance.

Vega has mix up games, but he has no Vortex.

[TriasNT]

Don’t confuse objectivity with arrogance.

bwahahahaha

come on dude, you aren’t even trying.

really? bwhahahahahaha.
that isn’t vortex son, its high low mix ups or left right mix ups

But please, do try again, these “conversations” are always fun way to spend time.

bwhahahaha
good luck on your Barlog/Bison clone.

And you stop confusing arrogance with objectivity.

Now, if you have the least respect for in this thread, stop polluting it with jackass speeches which don’t interest anyone but your ego. Oh yeah, and about the « son » thingie you like calling the others :

And let those speaking about ideas for a v2013 Claw debate like grown-ups.

[star]

but the vortex origin report was quite interesting…

[TriasNT]

It was, but that does not justify what he wrote before.

[pedoviejo]

no, im poking fun at you for making statements that are not valid.

I told you he doesn’t have a vortex and you insist. I told you that they where 50/50 wake up mix up games that aren’t as strong as other mix up characters because the 5 modes of attack cannot be interchanged freely, and when succesful, it doesn’t put you in a position of real power like say Zangief.

I was being an asshole which =/ arrogant.

[Francys_Pai]

Liking the post because it contains tea and being fabulously British, I now want some. On how I now feel about this thread in it’s entirety; Yare yare daze.

[Th3_JoK3R_J]

I think I agree with pedoviejo about the regular mix ups and vortex difference thing.

[TriasNT]

no, im poking fun at you for making statements that are not valid.

I told you he doesn’t have a vortex and you insist. I told you that they where 50/50 wake up mix up games that aren’t as strong as other mix up characters because the 5 modes of attack cannot be interchanged freely, and when succesful, it doesn’t put you in a position of real power like say Zangief.

If you would have said it that way there would have been no problem at all.

The fact is, there is no right or wrong between those saying Claw can have a vortex playing style (Rizhall (Hi man !), and me), and those who say he doesn’t (The Jok3r and you). Just 'cause there is no strict definition of what a vortex is… so one can make a restrictive or a large meaning for it.

I still believe that izuna drop or CH-ST puts Vega in a position where he can apply his full mix-up range (block right/left/command grab/safe-jump) so that he gets another izuna knockdown and repeats the trick over and over till the opponent guesses well. However, it’s clearly not as ambiguous as Ibuki’s or Akuma’s okizeme game. So it’s weaker. Is that a vortex or not ? As I said, you could both say yes or no, and it would still be legit.

And after all, it hasn’t such importance. I’ll have to think some ways to make it more ambiguous, I’m sure it can be achieved with the corpse-hop part. =)

And about the british version of the stfu cup, I found it so classy compared to the soldier’s one that I just had to use it.

[Scarlet_Rabbi]

All this in-fighting, I love it. It has been way too tranquil on this forum the past couple of months.

This just doesn’t feel like the SRK Vega forum unless people are tearing each other’s throats out. Kudos to Pedo and TraisNT, keep that tourch burning.

[star]

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“Scarlet Rabbi”>All this in-fighting, I love it. It has been way too tranquil on this forum the past couple of months.<br />
<br />
This just doesn’t feel like the SRK Vega forum unless people are tearing each other’s throats out. Kudos to Pedo and TraisNT, keep that tourch burning.</blockquote>

And then… the forum went out for a week

[Haztlan]

Also, the removal of the move Claw Throw when you set Personal Action to “None” would be smart.

[Gross_Indecency]

I’m too used to his current status, I play well, and I’m mostly content with Vega and I know no ver.2013 will come. But I’ve always had ideas about additions to Vega but most make him like a new Vega. Most of these are fantasy stuff and has %0 possibility of getting fulfilled. So, don’t get nasty. Most of these are just some ideas.

1- The taboo: Just because we have got accustomed to using ST in its place and got accustomed to use other things as AA doesn’t mean inv.ST wouldn’t be greater. Hate me for this, but sorry: I’d love an inv.ST. If not, make all the versions’ start 3 frames so I’d at least trade with non-meaty jabs or punish jumpers better. If not, make its charge just back instead of down-back so it would have more use. But I’d love an improvement to ST. Please don’t let a new debate about inv.ST to start. I am accustomed to ST. This is just a wish, not many forum people’s favourite word to use aka. whining

2-cr.lp- 3fr. start-up

3- fix cr.hp’s hitbox

4- Vega’s inv. while going to the wall at U1’s start.

5- Make him hit the opponent while going to the wall at the start of Super so roll+super, CH+super, focus+super are possible.

6- U2 starts up 7 fr. again.

7- CH blockstuns return to the Super version again. The hitbox gets ticker, goes parallel to the upper part of his leg, remains the same below his leg.

8- PoM is +3 on hit (+4 if cr.lp start-up stays the same)

9- Fix exfba’s hitbox so that jhp+cr.mk+cr.lp+cr.mp+ex.fba hits crouching Rose no matter what.

-Now the more fantasy stuff- :

1- cst.hp: 6 fr. start. First hit does more blockstun to avoid interruption from the blocker.

2- Open at least one combo opportunity after normal SHC, so that there would be a reason to use it. For example it can remain the same on block but on hit, Vega drop in front of the opponent and its +6 on hit , so I can connect cst.hp but not Ultra (+4 if cst.hp remainst same so at least cr.mp can connect)

3- cst.mp pulls the opponent closer. 5 fr start up, +3 on hit (+4 if cr.lp start-up stays the same)

4- cst.mk is +3 on hit (+4 if cr.lp start-up stays the same)

5- cst.lk hitbox get lifted to more above his knee to stop divekickers better.

6- cst.lp is +3 on hit (+4 if cr.lp start-up stays the same)

7- PPP flip goes forward instead of backwards.

8- Assuming cst.hp becomes 6 fr start: ex.roll is +6 on hit. The others are +4 on hit.

9- far st.hp: 10 fr. start-up, causes knock down.

10- cr.hk is exfadcable.

11- The claw never drops or get removed. The mask never drops but can get removed. Once removed you cannot get it back until the next round.

[Gross_Indecency]

OMG one “post comment” and 4 posts how do you delete in this new design?

[Gross_Indecency]

OMG one “post comment” and 4 posts how do you delete in this new design?

[Gross_Indecency]

OMG one “post comment” and 4 posts how do you delete in this new design?

[Mr.Jack]

lol

Zeus just played on http://shoryuken.com/2013/02/13/next-level-battle-circuit-6-feat-ae-2012-umvc3-sfxtk-2013-streaming-live/

and i just heard from the commentators “vega needs a nerf” at least twice

i don’t believe in a 2013 update, but if we come to see it, no way vega is going to get some buffs u-u

[Haztlan]

^That was irony.