What are some good tips on beating Dhalsim with Chun-Li? I am completely lost in this match up.
you can punish v-trigger spiral arrow with cr. MK->MK SBK but you NEED to make sure you do straight down or you will likely get overhead.
In general your buttons are a bit better and she can’t buffer a DP quick enough unless she is really looking for instant air legs so that is good.
b. HP on reaction to her spinning back fist.
Be solid on your anti-air game and punish blocked spiral arrows with cr. FP->LK legs->cr. jab->LK spinning bird or harder.
Block low on hooligan or st. jab her out of it on reaction. She is negative after a normal divekick most of the time so cr. jab afterwards isn’t the worse idea.
Really anti-airing her is pretty simple outside EX Divekick which you just gotta sniff out and if you aren’t low on life I recommend just eating the throw unless they are super predictable since the CH combo of it is beefy.
Before she has meter she actually has to respect your kikokens since she has garbage jump-ins and spinning back fist is too slow to do on reaction. Don’t do it often but it is there.
Her sweep is bad so you can go a bit crazy with the buttons without a lot of counter-poke fear and b. HP is a great stuffer of her st. MK.
I’m batting a win against most Cammy’s at the second, feels pretty even at the second.
To add:
Block divekicks standing, she will be more negative and maybe even punishable if they misspace their divekicks. And don’t go too crazy with sweeps unless you see that the opponent has trouble punishing it. Cammy is one of those characters that can punish sweep at any range without meter (spiral arrows).
Also, if you see Cammy do a raw vtrigger (it’s -8), you can punish on reaction with super or EX lightning legs, LK legs works too if you’re close enough and don’t want to spend meter.
Can’t comment on Laura as I haven’t ran into her too much, and the ones I have either run a train through me, or are just the jump happy buttons-y players that I get to run over. Dictator, I’m somewhat more familiar with. People on both sides of the MU complain about the buttons, but what I think really makes the match up is spacing/where you stand and walk speed.
Bison’s walk speed and movement is practically Makoto from USF4. His walk speed is garbage tier, but his dash is god-tier. As such, I play it in a similar way. There are only two ranges where I’ll try and stand, just outside his dash range or right up in his face. From just outside his dash range I’m really just trying to scope his dash and punish accordingly with a cr. MK xx legs. Conveniently at that range is also the perfect anti air range for both his jump ins and head stomp which should be easily reacted to.
When in his face, just pressure according to his tendencies can’t really give a do x,y,z as each player has different habits defensively. I typically start with a cr.jab x2, st.jab string to see if he likes to press buttons. He has no 3-frame normals so you’ll likely hit first, and Chun can hit confirm 3 jabs into EX legs.
Lastly, so many of his moves are plus on block, that it makes memorizing the negative ones simple. Challenge every blocked scissor kick - his safest one is -2 is the HK version. Punish the infernos on block. If you ever get cornered by him, you’re in for a long and rough ride if the Bison plays it patient and safe, so try not to walk back too much.
That’s all I have on the Bison match up. All information is based on people I’ve played at my current rank (2.2k+) and things might change at higher ranks, but Bison hasn’t been one of the rough match ups for me. Feel free to add/comment more as discussion is always welcome.
Edit: words.
Against Ryu specifically (and possible Ken), I found some sort of set up that you can go for after SBK (On the Chun Li thread, I mistakenly highlighted EX Lightning Legs as well but the thing is, there is a much better set up off of EX Lightning Legs. So, what I am going to say is going to specifically apply to the Spinning Bird Kick).
On the training mode, set the dummy’s wake up options up so that they will use Dragon Punch+MP, cr.MP (or any quick normal), and a throw.
Wake Up ~ DP+MP (or EX+DP)
Wake Up ~ cr.MP
Wake Up ~ Throw
Wake Up ~ CA
Note that these reversal attempts will still apply if the Ryu dummy quick-rises.
Instructions: After perform a combo that ends with SBK… (Although, keep in mind that it is better to go for this set up after a SBK. Because, EX Lightning Legs will leave the opponent too close).
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Immediately dash forward.
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The very moment Chun Li stops in her tracks from the forward dash, tap cr.LP to make it whiff. Then tap cr.LP one more time. Make sure you’re holding back to block as you do this.
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If the Ryu chooses not to quick-rise, you can tap cr.LP for the second time make Chun Li take (almost) one step… pause (stop moving) and then jump over the opponent as if you are going for a cross-up. As you jump forward, press j.MK.
If Ryu does Wake Up ~ DP+MP or EX+DP, it whiffs. Free punish. Get that CC damage.
If Ryu does Wake Up ~ cr.MP or a throw, Chun Li just crosses them up.
If Ryu does Wake Up ~ CA, Chun Li will end up behind Ryu but the j.MK may not connect. -
If Ryu DOES quick rise in front of you as you whiff the first cr.LP (make sure you are holding back as you whiff the cr.LP), DP+MP, EX DP, cr.MP, throws and the CA are either blocked or whiffed complete (in the throws case, it whiffs because Chun Li is not close enough). After SBK, you shut the opponents wake-up options down and then continue the offense from there.
This is going by the assumption that you had to end your combo with a regular SBK.
As for the Ryu MU itself…
Spoiler
vs smart / somewhat intermediate Ryu players:
Retain about a 4~5 character width spacing.
After getting close, low/throw mix ups are plausible.
Be sure to finish your block strings with a normal that is advantageous on block or with Kikoken (or even EX Lightning Legs, sense it is safe on block).
I haven’t really fought that many “good” Ryu players offline or even online…
vs weird / awkward Ryu players:
These players are more than likely going to jump a lot, even from further distances. Eat them alive with jumping back j.KP, st.LK and/or b+HK (I love that move…). When you get in close ranges, these Ryu players will often go for sweeps or press LP or either medium normal to keep you out.
They are more than likely not going to acknowledge anything that relates from data. Frame trap them with cr.LP to st.MP or just go for st.LP or st.MP into throw. If you are far away, chuck plasma at them and see how they respond. If they block, you can slowly draw yourself a bit closer until you corner them. When they get cornered, be ready to counteract whatever they do from there because being in the corner automatically puts them at a disadvantage. If you notice the Ryu player jabbing or neutral jumping a lot on wake up (especially, in the corner) b+HP or (from certain ranges) st.HP will mess them up. Don’t be afraid to use df+MK or walk-up throw because these players crouch a lot, often so without doing much of anything in the neutral.
Many players in this category are often easy to beat but can be unpredictable. But, such as the nature of the game: Read the opponent carefully.
There is literally no reason for Chun to lose to Laura ever lol. Chun outranges her and can’t be punished if Laura blocks her sweep at most ranges. If Laura gets in on Chun at any time, the Chun must’ve fucked up hard.
For a lot of us it’s not that simple
It’s like Makoto in SF4 imo. In paper it’s easy to frustrate her and keep her out. But in the chance that she gets in, the damage can snowball
My problem matchups are Birdie, Nash and Vega. I’ve never fought a F.A.N.G but i think he can do well vs. Chun. You guys have any tips on how to fight these characters? Especially Birdie. If Birdie doesn’t jump and sticks to the ground, i have a tough time fighting him. His buttons are longer :’(
Laura can easily kill any character instantly, well timed whatever into combo into two mixups into dizzy - dead. For sure in Chun favor but don’t sleep on these maulers, sometimes there is just nothing you can do about psychic.
b+HP is what you use in the few situations where you’re struggling to beat buttons. It’ll counter poke the majority of Birdie’s buttons.
Honestly I haven’t had a problem with Vega. Air legs combined with solid anti-air so they are forced to button me on the ground has done well. His long range pokes like st. MP and cr. MP just don’t work super great against chun’s st .FP and other long range standing pokes and kikokens if you stay unpredictable with them. Her cr. MK isn’t the best poke in that matchup if you rely on that. Air legs lets you rush him down hard and his bad anti-air really hurts him against that pressure.
Birdie I feel you have to do the same since air legs will eat cr. MP if not timed well since the hurtbox / hitbox seems really good and it is so quick a lot of people don’t react and do it preemptively making it super baitable. His fastest normal is 4f so you can rush him down extra hard even after a f. throw.
I feel a lot of her ‘problem’ matchups get better when you get more aggressive with air legs and abusing her 3f jab confirms.
Nash … ya … i’m with you on that one. His runaway is a problem. His rushdown is pretty easy to deal with but his chucking booms into random anti-airs / dash button or throw is really hard for me to gauge at the second. I don’t ever feel I win this matchup without significantly outplaying my opponent.
Just going by my experiences vs Chun. Laura has a shit time getting in, and Chun has every tool in the game to keep her out… It seriously seems like one of the most lopsided matchups in sfv so far.
I’m already getting annoyed by all the turtling from Nash players. And when they get in they just won’t step pressing buttons. Urgh.
One tip I have on the bison matchup is don’t be afraid to take a throw. I have a vid against tampabison from a week ago where I made the mistake of not sitting on a life lead. I’ll have to watch it again, but if I did anything decent in the match I’ll upload it lol.
Edit: here’s the match. Nothing special, but fireballs and commit to blocking when he has his +frames going seem to be the way to go for this matchup. My reactions were ass in this match too though. No AAs and didn’t react to punish his dashes.
Having trouble with the Nash vs Chun Li match up
For the rest who are, all I can say is once you get in close don’t let him get away. Make sure your AAs are on point so if he tries to jump out that’s his ass. They love doing V-Reversal, so bait it and throw to beat it out. Punish hard, and st.lk CONSISTENTLY beats the start up of all versions of moonsault, so be able to AA that at all times.
Be patient with the boom game. Through your kikoen and move forward. Play defensive if you’re winning and WATCH HIS METER. Take chances with jump ins when he doesn’t have it, don’t when he does because EX scythe is damaging and consistent. When he has full meter REALLY don’ jump and be careful with your fireballs because CA will beat all that easy. And of course, watch out for the trigger.
I’ve played against really good Nash’s and I agree with what you’re saying. My 2 cents on the matchup:
I think that Chun has a slight advantage in that matchup. She can get away with a lot more in the neutral and can basically determine the pace. You can punish a lot of stuff that he misspaces like f+hp, the scythe’s, etc with st.hk/EX.lightningLegs/Super/etc. You can even throw a fireball and follow it and if Nash throws a fireball back or tries to use his vskill you can punish that too with st.hk.
And like you said st.lk/st.lp anti-airs are really really important in this matchup. st.lk the vtrigger, be ready for it. This is how Nash will make a comeback after you dominate him in the neutral. Delay the st.lk a little bit, don’t instantly use it, because he’s invulnerable first few frames. Also, B+HK doesn’t work, don’t try it.
also: Meaty’s work wonders against Nash. Cause they stuff his vtrigger activation when he tries to go for it and he wastes his bar in the process. Nash players usually use this on wakeup to avoid pressure situations.
If you just hover around max c.mp range what is Nash going to do? It becomes a poke fest where you throw FB’s and he is scared to. I know it is much harder than that, but if zoning plus dash in/AA/moon is giving you issues just take a walk forward and dash when you can approach until you get into your range.
What are some tools that Chun Li can use to fuck up R. Mika? I always lose to Mika players because I can’t seem to punish the majority of her moves.
Basically you just have to zone her out with fireballs and your superior normals, and never let her get close to you. If she gets in, you lose. That’s the matchup. She has 3 options to get close to you, and you need to be aware of all of them at all times and react accordingly.
- She can Jump at you: antiair with st.lk
- She can slide (under fireballs): Whiff punish it, be aware of the range and always stand outside of it.
- Heavy kick (charged). She crutches down and charges for a short while and then does a short hop. If you block this, you’ve already lost. Because she’s + and now you’re in a mixup. Will she command throw? Will she frame trap? etc… it’s all in Mika’s favor. You have to prevent this move from ever connecting and you can do that in several ways;
---- Neutral jump (hard to do, because the charged move can come out quickly),
---- b+hp (crush counter), cancel into heavy lightning legs for more damage.
---- and my personal favorite: cr.mk to lowprofile it, and then punish with a st.mp, cr.mk xx MK SBK combo.