You’d be surprised.
So how would you want me to rank the matches?
3/7 - 0/10 = Good
4/6 - 6/4 = Fair
7/3 - 10/0 = Bad
Or something like that?
EDIT:
Ok, I just fully read through that list and you’re gonna have to do some explaining. Specifically how is he at an advantage against Game & Watch, Ice Climbers, Kirby, and Luigi?
^^That’s how the matchups are listed in ST so yeah.
Yeah I know, I actually posted the ST tier list in this thread from Sobat Carnival before. I was just checking if he meant the same thing.
well let’s see
vs G&W-
advantages- better smashes, SHFF avoids dtilt, shield roll avoids ftilt, bombs + air game beat nair, nair edgeguard beats pretty much all of his recovery tech
disadvantages - dtilt and ftilt can cause worries, sausage trickery, up+B covers more distance, close range nair can stuff a lot of your game
vs ICs-
advantages - smash and sword range >>> mallots, better projectile games, sword plant > their sideB, bomb and projectile game easily force Popo and Nana apart
disadvantages - ICs chaingrab / grab game >>>>>>> Link, he has to run away and keep bombs and arrows coming which is not necessarily a hard thing to do
vs Kirby -
advantages- center of the stage favors Link, SHFF fair beats Kirby up+B with good judgement as does nair while edgeguarding, mallet can be outprioritized / bombed / grabbed
disadvantages - kirby has a better edge game, if link leaves the center of the stage he creates an unnecessary risk of being tossed off the edge with a backthrow and forcing edgeguard situations but unless kirby is stupidly good it’s hard to force a smart Link to leave the center of the stage and get around his projectile game
vs Luigi
advantages- sideB is sword plantable, zoning game is MUCH better and optimal to avoid being hit by perfect range coin jump ( aka shin shoryuken ), SHFF air game is highly in Link’s favor, luigi side smash is easily dodged or shield grabbed
disadvantages - grab combo attempts are mostly escapable due to his floatiness, dsmash priority is silly, if Link is itemless and in point blank range ( which a good Link should NEVER BE ) he has to guess between Luigi’s neutral A, dsmash, grab or sidesmash
you can rank stuff however you want, really, by the end of the year all of those preliminary rankings will probably have changed
vs. G&W- How does Link have better smashes? G&W’s Fsmash and Dsmash have more knockback than anything link gots.
vs. IC- Again how does Link have better smashes? Projectile game hardly spreads the IC’s apart, and have you ever tried to spam projectiles against the IC’s doing desynched ice blocks? Try it and see how you’ll barely be able to get any projectiles off.
vs. Kirby- This ones up for debate but I think it’s more even if anything else.
vs. Luigi- When will Luigi ever use SideB in a match for you to swordplant? Again I see this as more even than in Links favor.
I think we’re just having different views, but I agree with most of your other match-ups, I’ll add them in a bit.
well it’s just based in my experience with the game so far online and off, i didnt get to play in the C3 tourney but i guess we’ll see how the April one goes
i honestly have yet to play a good G&W
fuck i forgot about desync - isn’t it harder to do that now though? and if they’re desyncing ice blocks cant you still hylian shield and grab?
and i should have specified that Luigi probably will only use sideB for recovery, and it probably is a little more even but then again i’m Link biased :V
G&W- Well I’ve seen a few G&W players make top placings in some tournaments already.
IC- Desynching isn’t really harder like most people thought, lots of really easy desynchs have been discovered already. And their more useful in Brawl because of how slow the game is which allows for more elaborate setups. And if their desynching ice blocks at a good distance it will constantly interrupt Link whenever he tries to throw a projectile. And grabbing the IC’s in general isn’t very useful since you’ll always be interrupted by the other one.
Luigi- I think he has the better air game, and his up close game consists of mix-ups between jabs, throws, and UpB.
sobs
My Samus…she’s been robbed of her power! I can’t believe this is happening, I think I might carve her name into my arm to show my devotion before switching to ZSS, unless the tiers in Brawl aren’t like Melee’s tiers. I hope to god that something happens to make Samus not suck. I have so many memories of Smash 64…memories I have no desire to relive.
Yeah as a near-exclusive Samus player for 7 years in Melee I was caught offguard by the unnecessary nerfing Samus got in Brawl. I still can’t understand why the Charge Shot, a move designed with a risk/reward system to KO at high % can’t kill until you reach close to 150%. It’s not like Samus had a impressive set of KO moves to begin with.
And then G&W can kill with his Forward Smash at freaking 80%!!! This game is freaking loopy.
grabbing isnt that bad vs ic’s. it was the same way as melee. cancellling shines with jump cancelled grabs into quick fthrows and shit was a really good way to seperated the ics effectively.
any quick throw will seperate the ics well.
That’s because the match is 2D as well, so it cuts through you like Kurare from Batman Beyond. (Speaking of 2D aspects, the way he’s animated when you grab him or he goes flying is really loopy as well, pun not intended.)
As for Samus, yeah, she really needs something else at this point. Same with Mario and maybe Falcon, but they seem to be the only ones that really nerfed right now.
I have not experienced the problem that you’re talking about with his cape, though, white shadow. And I still say that FLUDD isn’t as bad as people are definitively claiming it to be after two months, but, hey, whatever.
goes back to playing “Bottom Tier” Ganondorf and “Low Tier” Link
Samus has her aerial grapple.
Pretty good.
But yeah Samus herself = unimpressive.
I don’t see whats so bad about samus? She seems to have minimal lag on aeriels and good recovery with the new bomb dropping and grapple and decent projectiles. I don’t know. I’d say shes leagues above captain falcon and gannondorf.
Her projectiles suck.
Her aerials are good. No lag is always nice.
But she can’t kill.
She has good range on her tilts though and her smashes.
I mean when you look at her she looks like she ahs what it takes to be high tier.
But then you play as her and it’s like…O_o WTF did they do to Samus!!!
I think shes just a bit slow thats all. without wavedashing it’s a lot harder to space her tilts and jabs well too.
Meh. I would say Link does it better because even if his shorter, he at least has decent projectiles to back it up.
Better than Captain Falcon and Ganondorf…?
Ye gods, I wish. Then would mean that I could actually play Samus like I had planned to since I wanted to learn both her and Zamus…except that Zamus is the only one of the two that can kill people with them needing to be in 150% zone. :looney:
As EmblemLord already said, she has good aerials, including newly lagless Zair–the same with both Links (and technically Lucas, except that his can’t hit you at all for some reason) and almost no landing lag, but at the moment, that’s almost literally all she has.
The only other good thing she is turning into another character at will. She’s basically the new Melee Zelda.
As what the boons you’re talking about, assuming you’re not trolling again (especially since it is still April 1st), her new bombs suck. They don’t even explode on contact with people any more. And there’s nothing new about her bomb jumping, since it existed in Melee and was easier there, especially since you could tether recovery any part of the stage instead of automatically grasping for the ledge.
All other aspects of her have been drained of power, as if by Metroids. Her new Power Missle is slower, less powerful, and has a smaller hitbox. How the fuck would seem like a reasonable nerf if it were even necessary to begin with, especially when all the Space Animals get to keep their unlimited Blasters and Pit swoops in like a jackass?
Her Charge Shot has not only been lessened in power and knockback but also seems to get absorbed by almost every other projectiles in the game, including Pikmin (the yellow ones won’t even die from it since they are immune to electricity), when in Melee I clearly remember it going through at least some things.
She seriously doesn’t seem to have anything else going from her (that was added on). The few nice things she is stuff that they let her keep from Melee from the most part.
…Damn, all this talking about Melee makes me seem like one of those many people on Smashboards who couldn’t/can’t wait to go back it already.
But, seriously, Melee Samus should have never been nerfed, especially if top four above Samus are still fully capable in the game (and especially if people are [unlikely] correct about Falco being undoubtedly on top).
I guess that would explain why it kills so early and unexpectedly. His Down Smash also seems to have an invisible field that extends past the Hammers and can still hit you full force, took me a few matches to figure that out.
Oh and btw, it’s- “Curar”
She has the tools, but all tools and no SMASH makes Samus a dull girl. Oh and crappy power missiles that can’t kill at 250%.
The Cape is highly inconsistent, esp. in dealing with disjointed hitboxes. Moves like Snake’s F-Tilt, Link’s F-Smash and Marth’s D-Tilt have a weird way of hitting you in the middle of the Cape then being turned around, but you can’t take advantage since you’re careening the opposite direction. The priority has been lowered, just not to the point of uselessness. Regardless, you have to fret if your opponent’s attack might connect and own you, even if you Cape correctly.
Once the top tier playstyles get more refined the heaps of advantages that they have will culminate into the polarizing brokeness that we’ve all come to know an love in Marvel.
Exactly. Grapple is also overrated because floaty short hopping takes too much time to spam 100% in a heated match.
Lag canceled aerials to lead to interesting “combos” but the enders are lacking, 'cept Bair.
Her D-Tilt seems to be the premier killing move for light to middleweight characters, esp. G&W/Pit/Meta Knight and other characters who can recover anywhere on the screen.
Spamming Screw Attack seems to be the more prominent mode of close range offense for me, interrupts a lot of crap.
Fun Fact: Her jab hits behind her back during select frames.
I should still know that, but it’s been a while since I’ve seen it spelled.
…I miss Batman Beyond. :sad:
Oh, so your problem has been that disjointed physical attacks get through? I thought you were talking about projectiles, which is usually the only thing I use it for.
Anyway, I vaguely remember it being like that in Melee, though I’m probably wrong.
While I have no doubt that a visible gap will grow somewhat between characters, I highly doubt it will become as broken as Marvel, especially since Final Smashes are “out”.
Yeah, Screw Attack seems to be the one thing they strengthened, though it would be nice if they had made it so that the final hit can KO people like how it does Alloys/Wireframes.
Screwy.
Samus and Yoshi deserve to be bumped into “Low Tier” they aren’t THAT bad. Samus smashes and tilts are still great and her air moves are lagless.