People think Hakan is going to be a bad match? Are you guys serious? He has a low jump, his normals suck, and he seems to have a hard time getting close. Also on top of that his normals seems to suck as well, and all of his stuff seems unsafe. Like what possible answer could he have against a character with Guile’s zoning ability?
Hight damage, oil slides into grabs, high health…sounds like a version of Gief to me.
Also, we have no idea about his normals. You can’t judge anything by watching gameplay of people who don’t play SF and make a call.
Actually his damage seems to suck, and he doesn’t appear to have any reliable ways to close the distance. The vids I have seen of him shows he has a short jump. He may be hard to anti-air onces he’s within range because of that, but he doesn’t seem entirely hard to keep out. I do see that he he has a slide that goes nearly full screen, and may be even worse if he’s oiled up, but if all he has is a slide to close distances then I’m not worried. Anyone with even basic zoning skills could probably bait it all day, and it doesn’t look really safe either.
I agree, he does seem the most gimmicky of the new cast and very unsafe against zone characters. Short jump against Guile isn’t that bad if you have something to follow it up with though (Gief or Gen style).
Problem is, we don’t know his frame data so we’re not really sure what he can do in the hands of a competent player. Remember what most of us though about Elf?!
For about 2 months I laughed at Elfs face. I don’t laugh anymore.
But I’m not too concerned about Hakan. Ibuki and Jury, on the other hand, scare the crap out of me. Brings back memories of Viper
I’m not sure where you’re getting “unsafe normals” from with Hakan. When he’s oiled up he has outrageous range–he can tick throw with his standing roundhouse… We’ll have to see when people actually get to play him, but the reason Gief isn’t to bad to handle is he’s fairly slow and needs EX to really move up on you quickly. Hakan’s slide is already very fast and EX covers just about the entire screen, he’d have to be d/b’ing it in the corner for it to not hit you. Presumably there’s a range in which it’s safe to use, the speed at which it travels -might- let you block it but that depends a lot on which boom you pressed and how quick his reactions are.
If Hakan can kara his command throw which I get the feeling he’ll be able to (on top of it’s already -disgusting- range when oiled up), he’ll be a pain in the ass to legitimately zone. Maybe not when he’s not oiled up, but otherwise, his normals have significantly more range than Guile’s and they’re a hell of a lot faster (perhaps minus s.fp). I don’t think he’ll have any issues closing distance with his low arc jump, if anything that helps him get past projectiles like Gen’s did.
I think we’re all jumping the gun here. Killian said Guile’s biggest changes are going to be in minor frame and hitbox tweaks. I think that’s exactly what he needs, and when combined they’ll make a world of difference. I’m not giving up hope. I can keep my shit together for another month.
Yeah I said short hop is a problem within range. Still, I don’t think he’ll be within range that often. As far as the slide goes, it doesn’t look any better than Blanka’s slide. And we all know what happens to slide happy Blanka’s.
Seriously, I don’t think he’ll have any more answers to fireballs than E. Honda does. Zone characters are going to be a really big issue for Hakan. His so-called damage (don’t even see where he does a lot of damage honestly, his command grab does laughable damage at best) isn’t anything to be scared of. And he doesn’t appear to have any real pressure at close range, definitely nothing that keeps you guessing like Gief. But this is based on a few vids I’ve seen,and of course no one knows how to play him yet.
I’m not Gilly, but his normals look incredibly laggy. Especially a lot of his jump-in moves (which are what a Guile player should be worring about). Hakan obviously can’t stay oiled up all match, and oiling up means he’s giving up valuable space. Slide is nothing to worry about, it seems so easy to telegraph. And I believe his oiling up wears off after some time. I think a strong Guile turtle will give Hakan enough issues.
And what’s this about Kara throw? Let’s not jump the gun and overspeculate. We don’t know if he has a Kara throw. As far as I know, there has never been a way to kara throw grabs. Well except Makoto in 3s (who really didn’t need it) and Zangief in A3 (but it makes sense due to his nerfed SPD range in that game). Considering how little damange Hakans command grab does, there doesn’t seem to be anything scary about him. I did read that his oil up goes away if he whiff certain moves.
And his normals better than Guile? Umm, what are you smoking. There is no way Guiles normals (in their current form at that) look nearly that bad. Guile has a good jab, cr.mp, cr.mk (it’s not godlike, but it’s better than people give it credit for), st.FP. And even his standing FK is a good move considering how much range you get from it. Guile has some of the best footsies in SFIV, not better than maybe Chun, but better than shotos (they just overcompensate with cr.mk). I mean at this point I think you’re just disagreeing to disagree when you say Hakan has better normals than Guile? LOL
Did you compare his damage oiled and non-oiled. Seth said he does more damage with the oil on no? I don’t give two shits about Hakan besides he looks better than I thought he was going to. I just want the shit to drop already so I can see if I wanna main a new character.
If you guys were smart you would trade in your bum ass copies of CODMF2 to Gamestop. I went on Sunday and they had a deal where if you trade in any game you get 50% extra so i traded that bitch in and got $40 bucks instead of $25. Not bad considering I only went in to just reserve the game, instead I payed that bitch off and bought FFXIII. FTW!
I’m not too fearful of Hakan myself. The ones I am afraid of are the Third Strike characters. These are the ones that will be the new bane to Guile’s existence. But if they really did nerf his s.hp, there better be one damn good reason for it. Either you can link it twice or combo off of it with maybe a fearce/ex boom. And his new taunt could actually play well into a mind game. Before, my best mind game option was to back charge and then walk forward without punching, making them think I was going to boom, only to smack them with the back of my fist or airthrow. Now it’s going to be the same thing, only with the hope that I keep my charge and can punish out of it with a fk, sb, super or ultra.
You thinking that I said that is entirely on your end and might tell people a little about your own fears. I said that they look faster–the only two fast pokes that Guile has that match Hakan’s oiled up reach are going to be forward fierce and standing roundhouse–Guile’s roundhouse is slow at 13 frame start up.
Take a look again at [media=youtube]OjkUtS-uV8M&feature=player_embedded#[/media] – Check out the range and speed on his oiled up standing roundhouse, which hits low. It hit deep at about 3/5th of the screen away. Not to mention, despite whether the slide is safe, he can FADC it.
I’m just saying you shouldn’t be so quick to dismiss the character as a threat with your obviously superior zoning skills when the guy has a fucking half-screen tick throw. And yes, we do know what happens to slide happy blanka’s, you dismiss them as a scrub and move on to slide happy blanka’s that space it properly and don’t get punished because they’re not fucking idiots.
i think guile is underated,but he does need a buff.maybe his new ultra will make up for it
From the videos I saw hakan’s normals look pretty solid. If hakan has an easy way to score knockdown on guile guile is gonna be in trouble. Guile is in troubke in Super period. All of these vortex characters are gonna spin him round on wake up.
Bet you money Hakan will be a better turtle then Guile.
There are a lot of little Vortexes in ST, and Guile holds his own just fine in that game. I doubt Super will be introducing anything that a Guile player has dealt with in previous games. Normals, and a fixed flashkick really goes a long way.
And Hakan’s normals look like garbage. Sorry he doesn’t look any better than any other character Guile has to deal with. Apparently people just forgot how to zone with Guile. Most even halfway decent Guiles at Final Round this weekend never had much of a zoning style. I think I was the only one. So I just chalk it up to new school players not working a lot on their zoning game, which is why most think Hakan will be such a bad matchup.
Hakan’s normals aren’t going to be garbage. Whether or not you can compare them to Guile’s is one thing or another but they certainly look far from garbage. He looks like he’s going to have some Honda worthy normals at least that get buffed further when he oils up. Obviously Guile is going to be able to spam more shit on the screen than Hakan is to keep him out for a bit but Guile is getting fucked up if he gets in just like every other mix up/vortex style character does to him. Which is how his gameplay has really been since ST.
Unfortunately I couldn’t make it out to Final Round but how did you do?
Guile army, how does this pic make you feel-
http://www.shacknews.com/images/generated/4b7ebfd3225b2_featured_without_text_super.jpg
I feel it speaks of an inevitable future.
I did horrid. I went 0-2. I’m not going to say I could have done better, because I had a pretty bad bracket. I had to play against a local Rufus (probably our best Rufus here in Atlanta) my first game. And if I would have beat him, then I would have had to play FlashMetroid. In losers I had to go up against an Akuma player from Orlando and I believe he is one of the best Akumas from that area. I held my ground during the game, and actually had the akuma player beat, but he got a nice little clutch ultra with a pretty sly setup.
I did play Marn’s Viper in casuals and had him beat until he randomed ultra’d me. But overall, I’m highly disappointed with my performance. I’m actually going to be picking up Viper just to mess around until 4 comes out, to get my execution where it should be (I think I lost to Marn and the Rufus player because I didn’t have goood punishing combos for them when I saw an opening)
Hmmm…yeah that’s my thing about Guile. Like when someone does something stupid or whiffs something bad what do you guys usually punish with? Does Guile have anything that’s really damaging other than what he can do off a j.HK? I don’t think his punishment is as bad as Dhalsim without a super but it’s certainly not the scariest. Like I know Sagat can take a risk or 2 whiffing an uppercut against Guile cuz he knows normally Guile won’t make him pay that hard.
Oh and yeah sucks about the losses. I did pretty well at Winter Brawl but admittedly there weren’t as many hard hitters there as there probably were at Final Round. I took out some really solid players including one that normally wins tournaments in his area but I pretty much feel apart against Sanford and Dr.Chaos. Well I was about to win a match against Chaos but execution killed me and I wasn’t patient enough throughout the fight either way.
LOL. Marn is the king of random Ultra. He just knows where to put that shit I don’t know what kind of crack he smokes but I saw him ultra the first c.LK Ryder’s Abel went for after a roll. Dude just sees things I don’t know. Is the Rufus matchup generally considered even? Cuz that’s what I generally thought it was. Oh and good luck with Viper. If you get your execution down with her you can basically do anything. Luckily she doesn’t have as many tight frame links as some other charcters but you literally have to learn how to fly a plane just to use her special moves correctly. You have to spin the stick around a lot with Viper.
Oh and there’s always room to do better no matter what bracket you had. Usually in tournaments like Final Round if you get stocked up in a bad bracket during winners the losers bracket generally evens the pools out a bit so you don’t have to fight big nasty established tournament player the next turn.** I’m surprised you didn’t contest that first round match though**. They usually try to seed brackets by region (part of the reason they did pre reg this year) so you don’t end up fighting people you play with in your area first match. It’s not as interesting or worth the investment to pay to enter an event where the first person you play against is someone you could have played against anytime before or after Final Round. When you have people like Rico Suave coming all the way from the north east to compete you don’t wanna be fighting your ATL boy first match. I would have contested it at least unless I knew he was going to be a free win. That’s the only time I don’t contest same area battles first or 2nd round at a major.
[media=youtube]kNP_EEYN1z0[/media]
after seeing this match (i was at the tourny) its hard to say guile is underpowered, just boring to play.