This is the trial that I’ve never been able to pass in SF4. The closest I’ve ever come is doing it ONCE with s.lp so this is good news. =)
yeah, FFF is slower now. I burned a lot of EX in my matches because of this. Flook thanks for the info man, keep it up.
The Zangief match will never be free for Viper, it’d take a lot more than a new Ultra, buffed crouching MP and damage nerfs to make THAT match free.
anyone know if the game is slightly faster? I personally couldn’t tell but Chun-Li seems faster and I don’t know if they increased her foot speed or the game. Also this might sound weird, but Chun seems taller too? I think the go-to Ultra combo with Ultra II will be the Standing/Crouching Fierce, SJC, Ultra II (Less damage scaling than Standing Fierce, EX seismo, SJC, Ultra II). But, It seems it’s main use is for punishing anti-airs and helping Viper control the air more. i just hope it beats Hondas shit.
Anybody watch that stream with DevilJin in it? He was playing footsies with a sick chun player just because C mp with that good haha. It is maybe the fastest recovering non light attack in the game it seems. Like no recovery on whiff.
Lol, just noticed DevilJin tossing out cr.mp repeatedly against that Juri. BTW, DeviJin is pro with rapid feints, serious Viper man. And what is up with the damage on that ridiculous EX Pinwheel?! Nice job on FlashKick FADC sunglasses too.
Oh yeah, the last 2 trials for Viper are cake walk. The SJC Burn Kicks are now just regular SJC Burn Kicks instead of instant burn kicks. The last trials is the same last trial as SF4.
Oh yeah, I want to make mention of this FTK feint business. As I and other people have mentioned the timing on Fierce Feint Feint is slower meaning you have to delay your feint by quite a bit. I don’t think this quite translates to FTK being slower in general as I didn’t notice it coming out slower at all and also the feel of doing c.Strong and c.Forward into FTK Feint felt the same for me. What this could mean is that Capcom may have altered the timing for FFF altogether. In terms of it comboing that’s not going to be an issue but doing something like Fierce, Feint, walk up throw would seem more like a nerf because the opponent has more time to recover and react to your throw attempt. It’s not that big of a deal and means you just have to get use to the new timing. That being said I did Viper Hard Trial 24 in 2 tries and I would have nailed it on my first if I timed Burst Time early instead of later.
The timing on Seismo SJC FADC c.RH feels awkward like I have to do it slower now? I felt like my old timing was too fast because I kept getting FADC instead of SJC FADC. Confirmed that the hit box on c.Forward is not fixed and I didn’t really notice too much of a difference in its speed but I didn’t get extensive testing with it. I think it’s still 7 frames but it also wouldn’t surprise me if it was a 5 frame start up now but it seems less likely as from the development blogs Capcom felt c.Forward was too good of a poke. lol
I didn’t get to test the safety of BK’s but I believe other people posted their findings on the nerfs to BK. Overall, Viper feels better in this game, imo. That c.Strong buff is definitely a huge positive to her game as she can really spam it and fish for good counter hits into EX Seismo SJC Burn Kick Ultra 1 or 2. Speaking of Ultra 2…I reallllllllyyyy dislike that Ultra. It’s just seems less versatile as Ultra 1 even though it has different ways to land it. I didn’t like SJCing into Ultra 2 that much since I was pretty comfortable doing EX Seismo, SJC Burn Kick, Burst Time mid screen. I also like the corner pressure with Viper with Burn Kick tricks into Burst Time. You lose all of that with Burning Dance and I don’t like that trade at all. It’s probably an Ultra I would use for specific match ups like Honda or Blanka. I can see Ultra II being really good against Blanka because 1 blocked Blanka ball and it’s a free Seismo SJC Ultra II punish. However, that being said I think Blanka is going to be a retarded match for Viper. Blanka’s walk speed and command hop speed have been increased giving him better footsie and poking capabilities on top of adding to his pressure game. ALL Blanka Balls deal 200 stun except for EX versions dealing 150 stun. Blanka slide also deals 200 stun. In fact the stun on all of his moves have been altered and mostly for the better. Your defense has to be really tight against Blanka as he can stun you very quickly. His Ultra II does incredibly good chip damage and you can’t jump over it because the duration is long so if you jump in reaction to the Ultra flash you’ll get hit on the way down. The ground version hits full screen so you have to block it and the chip damage on it is just stupid. I tested it against Ryu and the chip damage off of a full Ultra II is slightly more than the length of Ryu’s name underneath his health bar.
I’m not particularly concerned about the Dudley match up. His up close game is really good and he has stupid easy damage from it but he can’t handle the Viper pressure that well.
No more getting random’d out by Sagat because the damage nerfs are really bad. Comboing into Angry Scar is ridiculously hard guys like it feels like a 1 frame link. No scrub is going to pick up Sagat and get away with the shit he got away with in SF4. You have to put in a lot of work to get those Angry Scar combos to work out since it’s a qcbx2+p command. Viper’s going to fuck up Sagat unless they know how to combo Angry Scar properly and if they fuck up they get TU instead it’s a free FFF for Viper after wards.
I see the Ryu match up being a 5-5 instead of a 6-4 now. The damage nerfs are enough to put it to a 5-5 because Viper is going to survive those random hits for FADC Ultra and she will have a strong footsie game overall. This is going to be fine.
I’m actually concerned about the Adon match up because Adon’s s.RH is an incredibly footsie tool and punishes a lot of whiff normals and has got better range then any of Viper’s normals. Jaguar Avalanche can act as an anti-air so it can put a stop to poorly placed BK’s and he can FADC Jaguar Kick into Ultra. Adon’s walking speed and throw range is ridiculous and his mobility in general is really good. He’s someone who can keep up and maybe out run Viper in her antics so he’s someone to watch out for. He also hits real hard off of simple links.
Agreed with cr.mp being really good now, I was interrupting makotos pressure with it getting good results. Also, careful against makoto, dont do a lot of BKs cuz she can EX fukiage them for free and it WILL hurt. I didnt noticed that much disadvantage on the BKs on block, so maybe its just 1 or 2 frames so its still useful. Burst Time seems to me the ultra to go, its too good and it still deals pretty good damage.
Glad y’all were able to catch that stream. My younger bro was the juri player and inerd was the chun player. Basically the best chun player in the local area. We had a lot of people there so I didn’t get a ton of games in as viper but glad to get in what I did. C.mp is pretty gdlk now and the ability to fish for counter hits will give her lots of opportunities for ex seismo and c.mp links. Basically well have a much better chance of landing huge damage off medium attacks now. I was thinking about just kinda dropping viper for a while and going for ibuki solely but the small changes to viper make her that much more of a threat. She still does more damage and stun per combo than most anyone else in the game and the other herp derp characters have lost damage. Definitely gonna test some sjc ultra 2 setups on when I get a chance.
Btw inerd will be doing another stream on Wednesday with some other. Top players confirmed to head over. Including top 3s makoto/sfiv sagat player Eric Kim/ramza. This guy has a long history of placing top 3 with makoto or winning at major east coast 3s events and one of the few people to send justin wong to losers during 3s history. His sfiv sagat is also very solid and has placed well at majors like sb4 and nec10 where he put puerto rico balrog into losers. He said he will be going back to makoto for super sfiv so it’ll be a treat to see him come up with things now that his old favorite is back in. We used to go back and forth in tournaments all the time ibuki vs makoto and it should be great to see that breakneck pace fight play out again in super. ill post the link up on Wednesday.
Stream was hyped. I did alot of shoutouts. I think like 100 of them lol. Some to dumb stuff.
For me, Viper and Seth were sleeper hits. People rant how they were bad or dropping them but then when played, turned out for mostly the better.
Didnt catch the seth work but i caught the viper work and she looks better not worse.
Lol at the shoutouts,after a while i had to mute you bro i could not pay attention to the matchs.
Holy crap you, you guys weren’t kidding when you said Ultra 2 was trash lol. I’m watching the recording of DevilJin’s Viper vs iNerd and that Ultra 2 passed right through during what should’ve been a blatant air to air AA.
ok so again with regards to Vipers health. My friend has tested it. She has EXACTLY 950. No Bullshit.
…Seriously? 950 health? That’s awesome. I’m surprised as to why they’d give her that kind of health though.
I think this kind of thing makes the game more offensive. Ryu, Sagat etc… won’t be able to lame it out as much anymore. She is clearly an offensive character as everyone in this thread knows, now she can attack more and the risks are pretty much worth it (obviously not all) don’t get me wrong there are things that hurt a lot vs Viper still. Juri’s EX wheel kick, hurts, EX Snake strike hurts, Honda hurts. But DP’s are funny now. You can follow up a blocked EX Seismo with a Forward/Roundhouse BK and beat non EX DP’s clean. Subtle changes have really helped Viper in this game.
Are you sure she has 950 HP?
Flook on the last page said she had 900HP and 950 stun.
Again I talked with Mr.Wiz and he said 900. Either way, the point is like Dj said u can actually take risks and apply real pressure with a character that has 900 health without worry if 600 of it is going to go away once the opponent has 2 meters and an Ultra. Plus now that regular shoryus are kinda ass that allows for better BK pressure on wake up.
I know what he said. It’s confusing me too. But my friend tested it today. I asked him yesterday, he did it today and he said she has exactly 950 health and I believe him. I think it’s best if I get him to record the process of him testing and show you guys. Proof once and for all lol
Yeah, Viper is looking like a real strong contender in SSF4. I don’t see her being high tier at all due to the nature of the game and how good the new characters are shaping up to be.
I dunno what to believe anymore, lol.
And yeah, we can start taking more risks with offence now. Now when I’m up against Sagat, I don’t have to worry as much. It’ll still hurt, but at least it won’t be like 720 damage, lol.
Out of the new characters, I don’t know who exactly’s going to be a threat to Viper. I’m looking at Juri, and I don’t see anything scary about her, though her damage on that EX Senpusha/PinWheel is pretty sick(I’m sure people will correct me on this and say she rapes Viper or something, lol.) And I heard Dudley’s crap on wake-up but also keep hearing conflicting stuff about him; one person says he’s nasty, and another says he’s overrated. I know he’s got loads of nasty mix-ups and stuff as well as good normals.
I think it’s going to be the usual suspects like Gief, Honda(though I’m hearing this match-up’s better now) etc.
I fought a Dudley the other day. I have no experience vs Dudley whatsoever as I never played 3S. I just went crazy and he was like WTF? Dudley won’t be a problem like Gief, Dictator or Honda but in the right hands he WILL be deadly. He has options coming out of his ass. But hey, so does Viper with Ultra I especially. It’ll be an even match probably…honda is still hard. but I didn’t use Ultra II as I’m not comfortable with it yet.
I think she reach High tier. But IDK Japan will get the game sometime this year. They can make a more accurate tier list.
Too early to guess tiers as the game as it isn’t even officially out yet.
Gief’s lariat and Jump got nerfed so that should help.