Guys, the frame data for Rog’s overhead is not accurate. Balrog’s overhead is only +10 on hit if they are standing. It is +8 if they are crouching. You can test this by attempting to link standing HP or standing MK on crouching opponent. You’ll never be able to link it. Another glitch I found with overhead is that for some reason the LP version and ONLY the LP version forces stand on counter hit. Every other version keeps them crouching.
Hadnt ever thought of this until you mention it. This is true. Actually now that i think about it a bit more, i think this is true for most overheads having different frame advantage on hit/block depending on if they were crouching/standing. I believe cody is a bit similar where it has more frame advantage on hit when the opponent is standing versus crouching.
So. Depending on how bad-ass you are with hitting counter-hits with significant back-charge, there are some NICE combos. If you get a CH cl.mp, cr.mk, cl.hk, you can link ex.ru (you can do so without CH, but CH will make it universal and possibly easier to confirm). Doing to ex.ru combos with cr.mp, nets you about 400/600+ dmg/stun
444/720
CH cl.mp xx ex.ru, cr.lp, cr.mp xx ex.ru, cr.lp, cr.mp xx ex.ru, cr.lp, cr.mp xx hp.hb
488/850
CH cl.hk, hp.ds FADC, cr.lp, cl.hk, cr.mp xx ex.ru, cr.lp, cr.mp xx hp.hb
Maybe someone can find something with this: lp.oh, FADC, cl.hp hits meaty on Akuma In the corner allowing you to link a cr.lp, but there needs to be another link to get enough back-charge. Probably works on most shotos in some shape fashion or form. Doesn’t seem too automatic a setup either.
I’ll test it out and get back to you on that. I’ve never really tried comboing LP Overhead > FADC > whatever, so it might get me some time getting used to. Then again, I doubt it’s as hard as the cr.LP > cl.HK > cr.MP link, which I consistently get now, so it might be okay.
EDIT: I’m crying of despair right now.
Jesus. Also keep in mind that some of his max damage/stun links (e.g. cr.lp, cl.hk, cr.mp or j.hk, cl.hk, cr.mp) don’t work a few characters. Like one or two in certain situations.
I’ve been experimenting with delayed cancel combos that allow you to get enough charge for specials when you otherwise would not. For example, if you walk to a crouching a character and hit them with close standing MP then IMMEDIATELY charge downback and link crouch LP to crouch MP, you won’t have enough charge to cancel into a special move. However, I figured out a way to make this work. If you delay the cancel of the special move until the LATER active frames of the crouch MP, it gives you the charge. Here’s a video showing walk up close MP, crouch LP, crouch MP - DELAYED CANCEL-- HP Headbutt
Another useful application of this is if you block Guile’s flash kicks, you can dash up, close HK, crouch MP – DELAYED CANCEL – EX rush upper.
This is extremely helpful for increasing damage output from a frame trap with close Standing MP. By comparison, here is the damage difference on a basic combo from a close MP:
Close MP, crouch LP, stand LP, Crouch HK – 169 damage / 274 stun
Close MP, crouch LP, crouch MP xx (delayed cancel) HP headbutt – 244 damage / 370 stun
That’s 75 more damage / 96 more stun. It also, let’s you jump over the corpse to potentially ruin the charge of other charge characters.
By the way 3nigmatic, even though close standing MP is +4 on hit, it is NOT +7 on counter hit even though it should be. When they changed the properties of the move on hit, they forgot to change the properties of the move on counter hit.
nice catch, unfortunate though.
This reminds me of when i was looking into combos for low dashes (smash and low). The main thing i found out, esp for comboing into them after an ex.ru loop was increasing your ability to charge longer versus an actual hitbox configuration. e.g. ex.ru, cr.lp, st.lp, cr.mp xx ex.ru, cr.lp xx lk.smash the keno special is just to hit cr.mp xx ex.ru at max distance so you have longer to charge. Maybe its possible that delayed charging can create more efficient combos and allow just ex.ru, cr.lp, cr.mp xx ex.ru, cr.lp/cr.lk xx lk.smash.
I’ll try some things out. Thanks!
I don’t know if this has ever been discussed… but I know I’ve tried to discover ways to juggle super/ultra into each other… and I know Jav1ts found some crazy ways with crumple/TAP etc. But was anyone aware you could midscreen Full Standing Ultra 1 INTO Super? The spacing needs to be SUPER specific. It’s really strange.
Maj did it a long time ago; that was the first time I saw it. I could never figure out the spacing since it seems only the second upper has juggle potential after U1 hits.
For other balrog combo goodies:
There isn’t anything too practical in the video except for combos into smash and proof that Balrog has juggle potential off of all of his dash punches (e.g. ex.smash into U1)
Hey guys, I noticed our general discussion has not been very active so if i’m posting in the wrong thread feel free to move this post.
EH posted the balance changes for roggy (http://www.eventhubs.com/news/2014/may/19/more-ultra-street-fighter-4-balance-change-videos-featuring-t-hawk-makoto-c-viper-yang-balrog-and-dan/ )
and it seems I was wrong about the ender for U1 only applying for his Super. This straight end juggle is great news for f.dash>U1 punishes so I for one am excited about this change!
So now i’m curious if it also applies to his Super? An ending with a uppercut would be great. Any insight would be welcome.
Guys, be sure to subscribe to MoffuMoffu’s YouTube channel as he has began to post his findings for Rog in there. He’s a very good Japanese rog player and he speaks English so be on the lookout for his videos soon now that USF4 is going to come out!
Here’s a snippet of something he found:
He’s also on twitter as @Moffu360
I don’t know if this is known yet (probably is) but on big characters when doing rush upper loops, you can get a st.lp in there to make the link to cr.mp 2 frames.
Keno special, works on every character except Abel, Blanka, Boxer, Cammy, Ken, Ryu, Sagat, Sakura, Juri and Evil Ryu (in most cases).
Thanks, saves me the work of finding who it works on lol.
I cannot land a red focus after any version of dash straight or dash upper. Tried after a TAP, and red focus was still out of range.
The only Balrog red focus combos that seem possible involve close st.HP > RFC and overhead > RFC.
Anyone have any success with red focus so far?
EDIT: Ok, actually MP dash straight is the only special you can consistently hit Red Focus after. According to Eventhubs (hate that site), they reduced the pushback for MP dash straight.
Sounds about right, the only thing Balrog could really hit focus after was overhead. I was hoping for straight RF to actually work, but as focus attack doesn’t work, i don’t expect it to. TAP FADC isn’t fast enough, it’d work, but TAP doesn’t have enough recovery i think. It’d probably work on CH or with higher level TAPS since they have more active and recovery frames.
A move’s active and recovery frames has absolutely nothing to do with it connecting to red focus or not. The only factors are how much hitstun a move deals and how far that move pushes back (potentially pushing the focus attack out of range). A move can have a million active and recovery frames but only deal 20 frames of hitstun.
As long as the move deals more hitstun than the startup of your character’s level 1 focus attack, it will combo.
When you focus cancel a move, you’re canceling it on the initial active frame(s) thereby negating the rest of the active frames and recovery frames.
HP dash straight > red focus works on Blanka, Sagat, and a few others.
Can you red focus cancel the shimmy in the corner and crumple?
Only if you shimmy with MP dash straight.
And on some characters HP dash straight works as well, according to @Jav1ts