“safe drill”
“use forward throw”
cammy uses LK drill
Oh.
LK Drill lost to every crouching normal f. MK f. MP and sHK so I thought I was wrong and tested HK Drill after.
I was saying if you want to test against safe HK Drill, the range at which it is safe is where she gets up after being hit with Dudley’s forward throw.
if it’s safe
it’s unpublishable (sum minus 1/2 shiz)
idk wat ur talkin about
You can swipe it on reaction with crLK crLP and sHK easily from that range. It’s not safe because it’s slow.
I’m gonna drop this “chip drill” topic.
If any of you guys are in LA/Long Beach there’s a player here named Black Juan who has an extremely solid gief. If I can beat him 3/20 its a good day. Challenge him at wednesday night fights, or at my place on thursdays and see if we can download this matchup. I’ve been workin on it for like a year and all I figured out so far was what’s been stated in this thread. ZanGrief amirite?
- Don’t Jump, seriously. Lariat > green hand to vortex all day.
- Footsies forevah!! Give up as little ground as possible, try to push Gief back. Optimal range is just inside green hand range, so you can punish it with backdash if you read it.
- Punish Lariat with ducking upper. its 100% you just need to choose the right duck and be careful of short lariat baits. If you have meter you can focus dash the upper into jab to start a combo and get some major dmg shutting down the meter building game completely and shutting of random lariats.
- Green hand shenanigans. In footsies with gief a lot of normals get thrown around, if you use safe normals sometimes gief might try a random green hand, if you can backdash it (at the correct range) you can punish, if you block it be prepared for FADC.
There is a lot on this matchup, if anyone has specific questions I can try to answer them. I think I’ll start writing a matchup guide to this and have everyone here help me make corrections. I tend to get lost between character matchup and player matchup… as in strategies apply to BlackJuan, not Zangief in general.
if you block cr.mk/st.hk/cr.hk punish his *** with st.hk! I have a gief close to here that comes to my tournaments and in the end the only way I can win is being a character space out of green hand but enough to challenge his mix ups and if i block anything that moves him forward like I described above, Punish him hard. Once he respects it he’ll rely only on st.mp and a jump in every now and then + EX green hand.
To be honest most Giefs know better than to try to hit with any of those normals. They will cancel them into SPD’s right as you’re about to punish and smash your head. Buffering cr.mp with mp.mgb defeats the st.HK, and cr.mk beats his cr.mk/cr.hk clean for a free knockdown/mixup. I wouldn’t count on the move being blocked to punish thats too dangerous. Punishing and maximizing damage is definitely the way to go on this matchup.
Jump in: If Gief jumps at you he has 3 really good options his d.HP? (body splash) and his j.HK? are both lethal, but you can beat them clean with st.mk <3. If you beat him enough times he will switch to j.lk which makes st.mk whiff =( oh noo… but you usually have enough time to backdash away before he can do anything really, but you’ve given up quite a bit of ground. If you see it coming use Fierce punch, it trades brilliantly and actually allows you to move forwards a bit.
Range: I approve constantly moving inside and outside of green hand range, this is optimal because it allows for st.HP, f.HP, cr.MP, cr.MK, f.MK, and f.MP to be used as pokes safely. Also moving forward and tick-blocking is very intimidating against a Gief because it causes them to walk backwards which can sometimes force a mistake like a jump in or random green hand. I wouldn’t count on either of these as legitimate strategy though, be READY for them but don’t count on them. The best case scenario is they make a mistake, but you can make them walk backwards and that is amazing in this matchup.
oh yeah, forgot to include this. Everyone should know this but Ultra 1 to make him have fear of whiffing lariat/command grab. I usually love doing the f.hp FADC back thinking they can command grab me out of it, doing the ducking straight actually gives u + frame when you dash back so they are in hit stun longer. Using the f.hp and then fadc is a mind **** and they have to make a quick decision if they want to grab u.
Also OFFLINE zangief is alot easier.
- you can hear them before you even see the move coming
- your combos actually work
- offline
- the number 1 thing I love about offline, you know when they are mashing, you know when they are mashing jab so you don’t have to go off guesses, and last but not least if you DON’T hear them mashing anything while your doing combos you can go for a reset.
Dudley offline is broke, you hear everything and once you hear mashing you’ll set up for a counterhit so easily or a SSB.
Sadly I feel like i’m the only one that has mastered this and since doing this it’s made me forget all about option selecting and actually reading your opponent on the game.
I read my opponents reaction the way he is gripping/sitting/facial expression. I can never read my opponents well if it’s online or cross cabinet game play aka “arcades on both sides”: I’ll lose everytime but if your sitting next to me, you’ll be panicking like a little kid. Only reason I do so well at tournaments is because I can see how your taking things in certain situations.
“played a ton of poker and card games”.
So yep at the end of the day when I complain about online play and my opponent also says “it’d be the same offline cause i’m also better”, which is referring to links and combo and never dropping them.
I gain all of that plus reading your emotions offline which has won me and been keeping me from being pot monster. The only char I can’t read is C.viper.
I use pad… they can’t hear me mash.
Also U1 every should know it beats Giefs Lariat right before he stops spinning. U2 has good for Gief jump ins if they keep jumping in on and jet upper / st.MK doesn’t scare them which is should. duck straight > giefs lariat well spaced. f.HP, st.HP, st.HK, st.MP beats gief’s lariats. cr.HK beats gief’s lariat if you’re just right under it before he stops spinning. So many ways to be a grounded lariat. It’s just a matter of space.
also, f.MP > st.HP combo poke > gief so hard. I still feel this matchup is disgusting for dudley if gief has u2 stocked.
Dudley’s wake up vs gief is SSB > FADC on block
anti air is duck upper every single time.
beats everything better than jet uppr
kind of hard for me to jet upper unless i anticipate the jump in which is almost never so I use st.MK, because gief’s j.MK has sick range and it hits almost instantly as soon as gief is at climax range in the air. bug hitbox, hard to jet upper on reaction for ME. yeah, i used ex duck upper on gief before. I’d rather EX DP, more damage, and for some reason it just has faster startup than HP DP. idunno why. maybe cuz it’s EX and he shoots up fast? iduno.
Any good info for El Fuerte? After watching evo and seeing the number of Fuertes being used I think that is a matchup that I need to get familiar with.
Is SSB that reliable on wakeup? imagine you wouldn’t do this if he was jumping in but would this beat green hand or be safe from a backdash?
Or wakeup lariat
… this complete lack of understanding short swing blow
Thanks for participating.
I explained SSB so many times.
Dont use vs characters with wake up that has a lot of active frames (chun, gief lariat,)
Dont use vs characters with tons of start up on their wake up (Cody, ULTRAS,
Dont use vs characters that have wake up with tons of horizontal range (Bison Psycho Crusher, Honda Headbutt, Rufus EX Messiah, Sakura EX DP)
Use as an anti throw (empty jump short swing blow is good ( Abel’s Wake up))
Use as anti DP/Dragon kick ( Fei, Twins, Shotos, Gouken
Use as an anti backdash (catches Gouken’s Cody’s Sagat’s Abel’s
Mr X when I make the last part of Level 2, I’m including short swing blow.
That part alone.
mind blowing.
mind blowing dawg
mind
blowing
Seriously I wish people would use training mode for these sort of thing.
Did you know SSB beats Abel’s Ultra 2 
It’s like Cody players that sitll use f.HK as an anti throw
also when i said wake up i meant anti tick SPD.
Now I see why you use 1st ultra vs yun, cause it makes SSB that much more viable, cause if they whiff ex,heavy, medium up kicks when you use SSB, you’ll be able to use ultra 1 right away to punish them while if you did SSB and dudley has Ultra 2 you wouldn’t be able to do anything in time.
Also of course yuns amazing back dash.
I seeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
sonIamproud.png
that only took 2 months to figure out
lol
w
no
well, right when you included using SSB against yun as a option against him, I quickly realized how viable ssb can be once you have ultra 1. SSB can Shut down his command grab, possibly back dash. Then when you said up kicks I Thought you can just block then walk up ultra 2 him for free. But I was missing SSB as the last puzzle against his up kicks. Usually I notice yuns about to throw up kicks but using SSB can make it better for me and not having to guess instead of and having a high chance of getting hit by his upkicks/EX command grab.
But yea, you didn’t detail using SSB against yun you just mentioned Ultra 1 being good against him but didn’t say in detail how you can make other moves to make U1 that much more viable against him.
I used U2 cause once I got inside I could do mad dmg and him being afraid of using Dive kicks against me, but now with U1 he’ll be afraid to do anything which gives me even more pressure once I get the knock down. So I shut down all his wake up game with SSB once I have u1, I use ssb and I already just canceled out up kicks/command grab/ Back dash?
Explain ur shit thirtyfour lol.