is it just me or are many of the dive setups whiffing on hakan ? (in the hakan mirror)
i think there should be a little more comprehensive testing … it might whiff on others …
(back to the lab)
^
i agree. even in ae i had some difficulty landing uncrouchables
additionally i’ve had some interesting wiff situations occur:
ex squeeze on blanka->j.u/f, land lk dive
this setup made blanka’s reversal u1 mistarget and wiff.
similarly,
in corner, ex. squeeze on sakura, backdash, rk dive
this setup made sak’s ex. dp wiff and mistarget on wakeup.
for hakan vs hakan, even in the last AE version, the setups are specific as hakan is classified as irregular size character just like zangeif and claw where the regular setup dont work.
so if you find any setup against hakan please post and i’ll add to character specifics.
does this means it’ll catch blanka if he wake up and crouch still?
does this mean that it wont dive sakura if she wakes up and crouches?
lol i just tested both scenarios in training mode and yes, they are still uncrouchable.
what i’m suspecting is the leniency they added raising the collision boxes allows for reversals with initial low lying hitboxes to wiff entirely
additionally i attempted the jump->lk dive on sak, doesnt work.
Just a question about oil dive set ups. Do the moves have to done back to back frame wise or is there a window of so many frames where you can complete the moves within?
Yeah remember Hakan has on odd wakeup time, so a lot of setups have to be specific against him, he wakes up a lot slower than a lot of the cast. And as for the timing ^ the window seems to be a lot larger than before, it’s way easier to eyeball your oil dives now.
Found some useful new setups yesterday, will post them up in a couple of days. Nothing groundbreaking but should definitely prove useful.
I’m signing off for now, have a good Christmas everyone!
In the corner: mp rocket, lk oil, lk dive. Merry Christmas!
I found some useful stuff … Might even add an extra edge to hakans shenanigans … I haven’t seen any1 mention it here so hopefully you guys will find it useful
I noticed a lot of times I do slide, backward FADC to be safe and it would hit but I’m stuck with a short duration untechable knockdown with no followup … So I’ve come up with a few:
After slide Backward FADC:
-f.LK, HK/EX dive
-f.MK, MK/EX dive
-f.HK, LK dive
-cr.MP, EX dive
Using this same untechable knockdown I also managed to come up with a safe “on block” slide setup as follows:
Side, backward FADC, cr.LP, LP slide
I’m sure you all know already that you can add a oil rocket input after the safe slide to get a garanteed grab on normal pokes and backwash …(but punishable by throw invincible reversals and jumps of course)
Another situation I came across a lot while playing hakan was slide without press, particularly when I go for a safe slide after knockdown and it actually hits…
So after side (no press):
-f.LK, MK dive
another thing I came across which I find extremely underused is landing garanteed meaty rockets after knockdown… Meaty as in the opponent cannot jab out with a normal like in crouch teching for example… Ofcousre they can jump or backdash or even reversal … But still this is a very useful option at many points to change the flow of hakans pressure game, not to mention the fact that because it’s meaty, it eliminates the need for an EX grab which gives you more meter options for other things.
The following setups will guarantee meaty rockets:
- after MP rocket: MP slide, rocket
- after HP/EX rocket: LP Slide, rocket
- after slide-press: MP slide, rocket
- after (oil) f.HK: LP slide, rocket
- after cr.HK: f.HK, rocket
- after (dry) slide backward FADC: cr.HP, rocket … ???
- after air throw: f.HK, cr.LK, rocket. (or cr.HP, st.LP, rocket)… ???
- after dive: st.MP, HP slide, rocket
I’d like to add that these same setups work great for Meaty normals which make them anti jump, anti grab and good for punishing back dash with an option select, they are also great for baits as they leave u completely safe if u do nothing.
How’s this for a dirty Oil Dive setup:
In the corner: LP Oil Rocket, LK Oil, EX Oil Dive
CANNOT BE BACKDASHED, CROUCHED, OR JUMPED OUT OF
LOLOLOL
Edit: If you don’t want to spend the meter, you can do LP Oil Rocket, CC, HK Oil Dive, but unfortunately this won’t catch backdash, but even so the odds of landing it are high. In any case, why you wouldn’t want to abuse the hell out of the EX dive setup above I wouldn’t know, unless you don’t have the meter. So get going, try it out!
Got a couple more corner stuff:
MP Oil Rocket, Jump up EX Dive (Won’t catch backdash)
OIled MP Oil Rocket (dash back, dash forward, EX/MK Dive) EX one has to be pretty quick. Catches backdash
Have to credit Mordie here btw, I completely forgot to test out corner setups, and thanks to him we have even more stuff!
Wow, not sure if anyone posted this, if so then my bad, there’s so much new stuff it’s hard to keep track. But Oiled/Unoiled Dive > Forward dash, jump over, HK Dive is an all-purpose oil dive since it catches crouch, backdash and jump and sails over the opponents head if you do it wrong. The last parts important because the timing isn’t 100%for me yet, I’d say about 85%, so if it goes wrong there’s a good chance you’ll be safe anyway! Might need to practice this a little.
Oiled/Unoiled Slide (no followup) > backdash, MK Dive, catches crouch backdash jump.
is there a list of safe jumps anywhere?
and weather the safe jumps are safe to 4 or 5 frame reversals ?
hakan has so many untechables i think it would really be useful to have them compiled … hmm …
anyone care to volunteer ? 
… i might do it myself after new years if i find the time (have a few projects in mind… both hakan and non hakan related)
M
My Turkish Wrestler vid has a good number of safejump setups which still apply to 2012, none of them are 3 frame, just 4 frame and up. It doesn’t include every safejump though as I think there is a few others
Do you know of one for blanka? And Deejay?
EDIT: Chun too lol
in that case ill take a look at it as a main reference and try and come up with something thorough that would benefit us all … 
as for 3 frame safe jumps there technicly isnt any you can do with an air attack unfortunately … unless you consider empty jumps a safe jump … but they wouldnt serve the purpose of a safe jump apart from being bait … i suppose you can consider the ambiguous crossup that makes everything whiff a safe jump but … that also can be technicly punished with a late reaction with a 3 frame reversal … plus its character specific … although its great to know !
most viable ones would be the 4 framers … those would stuff almost everything from yuns up kicks to guile’s flash kick … and smack them with some good block stun on the head if they block …
the reason why i was thinking safe jumps would be useful to look into as they technicly become great setups for:
- either combo on hit…
- an oil dive on block !! (free fuzzy guard
) - or bait for a reversal on whiff
- can be fed with an option select for backdash happy people … (or most of the time you can even react to it and slide )
- if they focus … well … ur safe jump would be technicly at the deepest point meaning … u can probably rocket for free or keep the slide OS…
(… too much free time this vacation with very little access to an xbox 
… at least gives time to brainstorm lol )
@Drew the [ dive > f.dash > jump-over > HK.dive ] is somehow not consistence due to tiny frame available on their wake up to catch in this setup.
The more reliable version is the one in the main post: [ dive > f.dash > f.j.any-normal > mk.dive ]. This one has more frame to catch and tested never miss on ryu.
Also I’ve take my holiday time to test all the setup in the main post, and has made further adjustment to them, ill update it later today 
Keep up the good work guys~ keep em coming
@e_cow, I have list of the safe slide setup on my bible from AE which should still work fir 2012, I can add them to either post #3 or u can start new thread let me know.
@safe-jump 3f dp, not possible, BUT there was 1 setup for hakan vs ryu that fits this before. But its not very useful.
Theory is based on max distance of you kick reach against ryus dp hit box.
For hakan the better setups are safe-slide and safe-j.k on slide-press.
@e_cow
Ur meaty slide setups are not consistent due to the timing to input slide after say 360p setup. It requires a tiny pause before slide and often miss the safe/meaty slide advantages. Need more precise setups/timing~
Some of this maybe inconsistent.
For ppl who don’t know, when hakan whiff a move into dive kicks, we can either twist 360 from the middle frame of the whiffing move (OS-timing) or we input 360k when u see ur move completely finishes (Link-timing).
For the most consistent setup we usually use the os-timing for the “first available” input timing for consistency, also the first available timing to input the whiffing move as well.
For example I can always reproduce the same setup doing so, as below:
[ slide > b.FDC > s.mp > hk.dive ]
your f.lk > hk/ex.dive misses unless I ‘delay’ my 360k input, ie wait for f.lk to stick out and come back to standing then do 360.
So here are ur setups using first available timing links:
(all dry setup)
[ Slide > b.FD > b.dash/s.mp/c.mp/s.mk/f.mk > hk.dive ]
[ slide > b.FD > b.dash/f.mk > ex.dive ]
[ Slide > b.FD > s.hp/f.hp/cc > mk.dive ]
!!![ slide > b.FD > f.HK > Mk.dive ]
-lk.dive works better here if ur f.hk dont come out in the first timing
[ slide > f.FD > f.dash > b.dash > lk.dive ]
[ slide > f.FD > f.dash x2 > mk.dive ]
[ slide-nothing > s.hp > mk.dive ]
[ slide-nothing > b.dash > mk.dive ]
that’s all for now
thats the point !!
the slides are not meant to be meaty … they are meant to position you at point blank to garantee the meaty rocket !! …
they are all meant to whiff …
i showed the setups to drew online in some of my replays … maybe he can explain it better for you because i think he got what i was trying to do
basicly after the slides, you have the option to either:
- meaty rocket ( will punish all normals with no need for EX)
- block (will bait out reversals )
- meaty normal ( this will punish jump attempts except dhalsim in some situations because his jump is 3 frames so he might slip away )
there are a few things i didnt consider in this …
all the setups were dry … ( i forgot to mention that )
the other thing is you’re right … they arent consistant … >> sorry about that … i was away at my cousins place on a ps3 and a laggy monitor … >>
i thought i got the timing down right but … oh well … lol
thanks for pointing it out …
as for slide-nothing, f.LK, MK dive … its not consistant as well … i noticed that the timing is different if you do the slide from really close or from full screen … the timing changes dramaticly … so i dont think any reliable setup would work here unfortunately
for safe jumps … after a long time messing in training mode … here is what i got…
-
after dive
st.HK, nj.HK (safe to 4 frame reversals and higher) -
after slide press
st.LK, nj.HK (safe to 5 frame reversals and higher)
i have to say the timing is extremely strict … and the nj.HK has to be at the last possible frames …
if done correctly … the following would occur …
- if the opponent does a reversal ( depending weather its 4 or 5 frame ) hakan should be able to block intime if you were holding db to block
- if they dont … then your HK will either put them in heavy block or hitstun depending on what they try to do
- the opponent cant jump
- they can still backdash … however you can easily punish
- they can obviously FA your nj.HK… but your attack would be so meaty you have time to block or react with a rocket on landing
if you want to test the timing … i sugest trying it on yun first …
yun’s LK up kicks is 5 frames , and EX up kicks is 4 frames … ( it saves you the trouble of switching characters … lol )