I asked many of my gaming buddies what they though were the most complex fighters ever.
number 2 was third strike.
number one were the virtua fighter games.
but they all thought third strike was the greatest because virtua fighter was too damn boring. (except one guy, who is obsessed with virtua fighter).
but I disagree on 3s not holding a candle to virtua fighter as far as close-range mindgames go. virtua fighter’s might be better, but 3s is right behind it. trust me, when you go high level 3s and play only guys who parry, red parry near damn everything, you will have to learn to severely mix your game up with some confidence,and the mind games can fuck you in many ways (maybe a good fuck…maybe a bad one).
He’s actually right. Sure, EX fireball/LOV and Gouki’s sets are pretty good, but when you think about it, fireballs don’t mean as much in terms of pressure as opposed to the other SF games.
I’ve played every Sf game since 1991. he did say ‘‘GENERALLY’’, so he is absolutely right, but fireballs can be very effective in 3s, but you got to be creative and use good mix-ups.
don’t try to eat the computer. it’s not chocolate. trust me.
and why do members that joined since 2009 generally suck so bad?
you are both right in the way you termed your statements. I am basically saying fireballs are effective in 3s and can be VERY effective if mixed up with a good player behind the motions.
but yes, compared to other street fighters where you can constantly abuse fireballs in many situations, I agree that 3s is not like that.
…so you posted to refute someone and then come back 3 posts later and say you’re right. Do you just like internet drama? I don’t get you, dude. Are you okay/all there?
Ibox is ANNOYING AS ALL HELL. Dud is really meh. Mak is like 100x more interesting. Twins used to be really really good, but now they actually fit in pretty well
I dunno about objectively, but subjectively: its fun.
it’s more that fireball have a different purpose compared to other street fighter games. Due to the parry system and (mostly) not so good frame data they don’t pose a threat in terms of damage / chip damage and don’t require a strategy solely to get around them, but they still have their quirks. Most normal fireballs are still decent as obstacles for the opponent / limiting his movement:
Urien’s Fireball in example is slow and is not threatening at all by itself, BUT opponents have always to think about it because getting hit off the ground with it leads to huge damage
Oro’s are annoying, he can’t properly zone in a sf2/4 sense but normal versions travel rather quickly and from most ranges are safe to throw out; the AA ones are specially good since Oro usually recovers in time to mix up the opponent who air parried one. EX fireball leads to nasty setups and works very well if the opponent has to chase him
Remy’s while doing pitiful damage and meter have good framedata overall; getting close to a remy who mastered the rapid fire is not an easy task if you haven’t a character with great obility or a super that just ignores them. Sure, you can parry them all and build meter, but Remy’s still in control of the space
honestly the only real bad fireballs are the shotos grounded non-ex ones, with long ass recovery and unsafe even on hit. And still the have their uses here and there, though I think Ryu at least deserved a slightly better non-EX hadoken
They are totally different characters. Dudley is meh, Ibuki is good but for all different reasons compared to 3s, Makoto keeps the idea of explosive damage and high risk/high reward, she can be effective but I think she feels watered down for any 3s Makoto player.
It’s not just the lack of parry system, it’s the whole game engine that makes them a differet matter
Ken is not top tier. he is at best worse than 3 of the characters, and maybe worse than that. if you want to complain about balance in 3s there’s legitimate arguments but Ken is not a problem. in any case, games can still be fun while being unbalanced. balance can make a game more interesting competitively but it only has a small part to do with how fun the game is. I suggest SSF4 and SSF4 AE 2012 as examples. Both generally praised for their balance, both kind of boring to play. On the other side, I’ll mention Warcraft 3 TFT. that game has some matchup balance issues - Orc v Undead is hella onesided, and Orc vs Human is so dumb you can basically guarantee a tier 2 tower rush. game is still fun as shit.
the SF3 characters in SF4 are not nearly as fun. I don’t get the same feeling playing them at all. I agree that Makoto is closest, but even she’s still pretty far off.
only like two of those things are true. yeah Chun is a bitch. most of us just accept that she is and play because the game is fun.
the game is mostly not a long range fighter, but even then there are exceptions. Remy can play the long range game pretty well.
as far as bait fests and empty jumps, yeah I don’t agree. that’s a pretty big mischaracterization of how the game functions most of the time.
characters with good confirmable supers are good in terms of character balance, sure. but “they need it to stand a chance” is definitely not the case.
I think a lot of this can be summed up as “this is what the game looks like to people that don’t play it.” It’d be like watching a ST match and declaring “characters without fireballs and uppercuts can’t compete, this game is just projectile spam game tiger tiger tiger tiger.” there’s plenty of Youtube comments like that about ST written by people who don’t play it very well. I’d expect better from actual FG players but it seems like 3s receives the most criticism by people who don’t seem to play the game and only have a vague idea of how it works.
No, Ken is deservedly top tier and Top 3. No matter how many times Makoto kills a Ken or Yun or Chun, she’s never going to be as consistent as those characters(though I DO consider her to be top tier as well, just behind those characters).
As for all the talk about balance, talks about strategies being obsolete/nerfed, etc etc…who the hell cares at this point? Just play what you feel like playing and have fun.
