1/4 block auto-block and 1/6 block auto throw tech: effective destruction of SFxT

Classic Fighting Games Street Fighter x Tekken
181

Dude, like people have said, why would they jump? Especially if they have the lead? Also, not everyone can get good damage off an AA. If that’s your only option, well, shit… you’re going to hope they jump A LOT.

Adapt? Honestly the best way to adapt is to pick these gems too. I think they are far and away the best gems in the game. Sure there’ll be a gem-metagame about building meter and picking characters that can do it and stay safe so they always have meter, but in the end I just see it making runaway and defensive play even stronger, leading to even MORE timeouts.

182

I see what you are saying, that sounds frustrating, Im just trying to think of ways to beat it, or at least counter it.

How long do these gems last? Maybe try even harder to get damage in when they have little meter or before/after they are activated and adjust play as the match goes? Or is that just too hard?

I am asking because I really dont know, I am waiting for the PC version.

Well that makes sense, why wouldn’t you if they are THAT good that everyone hates them?

183

I mute people who use assist gems or have bad connections then kick them or leave if they show up again. When i play ranked matches the only people that seem to use them are the bad players, so i don’t take many losses because of them. I honestly cant remember playing a ranked match where i blamed the loss on the assist gems, but when i do eventually run into a good player who decides to use them i wont have to worry about playing them again if i dont want to. They should add an option like on SC4 where the armor effects had their own mode online. The most annoying thing online for me right now is kens air tatsu.

184

You would have to win the match within the first 10 seconds. At that point they would have a bar.

Also, if you are trying to force them to make a mistake, the build bar while they are blocking you normally.

The previous gems were overpowered as hell, but it was feasible to drain all their meter. With the new gems they literally build it faster than you can drain it.

185

I dont even know how people defend the original auto block, auto tech gems, people act like your going to stop blocking and let the gem block for you and waste meter, what makes the auto block gems broken is if your good enough player with solid defense you’d rarely be wasting meter constantly on the gem, it helps you as your going to opened up, its inevitable your not going to be able to block right all day even pro players like Daigo is going to get opened up, what the auto block gem does is it becomes your safety net in case you mess up, i rather waste a bar of meter than eat 40%+ combo that’s what makes those gems dumb.

186

The entire concept of assist gems like these are fucking retarded.

Crutches like these will do nothing to help a player in the long run, and only serve to frustrate players already into the game.

187

As it is, without any modifiers (i.e. tournament rules to ban them, agreement between players not to use them, etc.), the new gems completely destroy any competitive aspect of this game.

188

Sounds like some community brainstorming is needed.

I’ll make an anti auto block/tech thread.

189

Reverse psychology over voice chat: “I’m really glad you aren’t jumping right now.”

190

I wish I had autoblock/tech against Seth and Viper.

anti autoblock tech? Wut? The only tech there is available is burn all their meter so they can get hit again. The point people are making is that you CAN’T open them up at all against characters that have mixups so long as they have autoblock and auto tech. (The exception I would say is command grabs). If they have auto block and auto tech they should set the limit to like only 3 blocked attacks or something and the gem disappears.

191

Capcom actually went and made the scrubbiest game of all time. I’m impressed, they actually went several leagues **LOWER **than what MvC3 did to make it scrub friendly and it isn’t 1/100000000000000000000000000000000000000 the scrubby game this is. Fuck Capcom, stop supporting their pieces of shit, seriously.

192

I agree and disagree OP

I can say that Capcom made this “Babbies First Fighter” for everyone, probably because of the popularity of the titles, to pull people in.

But honestly, your complaining about players abusing a system designed to be abused. And yet you are not? Its a matter of analysis and exploitation.

I will use these gems too, and both of us will play Throw Fighter cross Meter generation edition 2012.

You and everybody might hate time outs, but i guarantee you i will zone a block, throw them until they are empty, mix them up, and land my 400 damage bnb once, and then wait for them to try* and mix me up before the time runs out.

Its a resource management game, it is unlike any other fighting game, and yes anyone can play.

I also want to make it clear that I respect this game. It is the first non-gimmicky fighting game that does not have underlying circumstantial strategy that keeps new players from playing it, and to be honest, if you think about it, this will only help fighting gamed by popularizing them.

And we will have the new generation, entitled as they were with SF4, coming to take our money, and I am pretty sure we will profit from that as well.

Dont like it?
Its only one game out of many that has been recently released that is excellent.

Even if you are from the Tekken Team, TTT2 is coming out, so stop complaining.

193

I commend your attitude, but can’t feel optimistic that anti-assist gem tech even exists, if the meter gain doesn’t change when using them. It would make a distant kind of vague sense to allow them if the meter gain was disabled or greatly stunted while equipping them, but that’s not the case, at least as far as well all know.

There are literally only 4 ways to drain your opponent’s life bar in this game:
-Hit your opponent when he/she isn’t in the proper blocking state
-Hit your opponent with a move that does chip damage if he/she is in the proper blocking state
-Throw your opponent and not have it teched
-Land a command grab

If auto-block and auto-tech gems take away two of your options, you can only hurt your opponent with chip and command grabs. If you don’t have a projectile, safe on block special, or command throw, you have no way to deal damage at all, and consequently there is no fighting game happening on screen. And this is because so many of the counter-arguments in favor of the gems are assuming that the player using the gems literally does nothing but stand there, no directions or buttons being pressed. If they can hit a button, they gain meter, and if they can block with even the most elementary competence, they gain enough meter to keep the cycle going until either time runs out or you put your fist through the TV in frustration. How is this fun or competitive?

194

What I’d they made it to where auto-block gave the attacker mad frame advantage? Enough to where you can stick another OH out safely? I think that’d be fair. That way it can only be used DEFENSIVELY. Mix-up characters will still be viable since the opponent still has to guess which way to block or forfeit their meter… idk…

/Mango

195

^ Pretty much this. I’m wondering if Capcpom will nerf this bullshit at all in the future. Personally I’d love to see gems out completely or a no gem mode. Aint gonna happen though.

196

I think there’s a good reason we haven’t heard from Seth for a long time. He knows this situation sucks, and there’s nothing we (or he) can do about it.

Also, people are mentioning “you have to get them to burn their meter” as the only solution for auto-block… I suppose that’s true, but even supposing you had enough time to drain their meter, and even supposing your mindgames were so sick that you could force them to block incorrectly a bunch of times in a row, many of your attacks will be unsafe when autoblock is triggered. And if your opponent has any game knowledge at all, they will block against the high-low mixup that is most safe, FORCING you to use the unsafe option to burn their bar.

Then they will punish you and build that bar back.

Auto-block literally kills over half the roster from being effective. Only solution is command grab (I guess Gief’s stock just rose until whatever anti-command grab gems are in place), or playing the chip game. I don’t see how Guile is not instantly unbeatable top tier with autoblock. You are forced to watch him build meter with booms, and he’s doing damage to you (through chip) while you try to get in, and he has excellent punishes to unsafe overheads that are triggered by autoblock (flash kick), and good ways to push you out when you get in.

I don’t see how people can think there is any anti-autoblock technology. It’s impossible to exist, because the game is programmed for it to beat every option outside of command grabs. If you don’t have a command grab, and I understand frame data, you literally cannot win if I have full meter, a life lead, and 40 seconds on the clock. I will never jump, and I will never press a button (apart from autoblock punishes). Try and hit me.

197

Thanks, there are enough brains here to come up with something. In the meantime the thread I created remains dry, awaiting ideas and the inevitable smart remark I am sure. :wink:

198

I applaude your moxy, I really do.

But I’m not hopeful. As Infil said, the gems are infallible by design.

199

It really is hard to beat a game’s programming. Usually technology against something strong relies on abusing stuff humans can’t meaningfully react to, or trying to put them in situations where they must assume some type of risk.

Neither of these are possible when the game’s programming overrides all of that. And it’s why people have such a vehement response to the auto gems. It’s no longer about you vs another human and his game knowledge and reactions, even if that person is using a top tier character or some strong technique. It’s about you vs the game’s programming repeatedly telling you “no”. What possible counter is there to that?

200

Good! Online was too free anyway.