Hey, how can Gief punish a blocked EX buttslam from Honda? Sometimes lariat works and sometimes he recovers in time to block. Maybe I’m doing something wrong. Either way, I’d like to know if there’s a reliable way to punish that.
In fact, what are some good options to use against Honda on wakeup?
SPD/Atomic Suplex/super/ultra
Those should always be your punishes, not lariat.
Preshate that. And what about wakeup options?
I curious the ex messiah, i was a 100 percent sure the first part was punishable by spd on block but a recent tourney i played in made me doubt that, so i was wondering if it was punishable and how one should punish it. What i do occasionally is try to bait it out then neutral jump headbutt but every now and then they catch me blocking and i would love to punish them consistently for mashing that shit out.
My answer to blocked ex-messiah is:
Simplest answer is to mash ex-hand. If they follow up with lk or hk, you escape and take no damage. If they follow up with mk or lk fadc, you tag them.
Now you could punish lk follow up with some commmand grab afer block or mk follow up with command grab (after the first part), but this becomes a guessing game. If you mash spd during block, you get hit by hk follow up, and if you wait for lk follow up, you may end up blocking mk followup.
Let me know if I’m wrong - I don’t play enough vs. rufus
Aight bro ill test it all out. Thanks for the feedback.
Ok. You’re wrong.
First off, you want to do damage, not merely “get out” of messiah kick “mixup”
The noob answer is to mash lariat. beats HK/MK enders but loses to delay LK ender.
Focus also beats HK/MK enders but loses to delay LK ender.
EX GREEN HAND DOES NOT PUNISH MESSIAH FADC BACK!
Nothing punishes LK ender->FADC unless rufus or gief is in the corner (which leaves him closer) Then you can do anything under 7 frames or so.
LK ender- Punish with anything incl Ultra
delay LK ender- beats lariat/spd
LK ender FADC- safe unless cornered.
MK ender- safe, 5 frame startup
HK ender- punish w/ super/ultra. hit out w/ lariat
Well to the extent that Rufuses still do random ex messiahs, imo
–Mash ex hand most of the time until you see lk ender come up. Ex hand punishes no ender, beats low ender, flies safely under high ender, beats delayed lk flash kick ender, does nothing because you’re still in blockstun if immediate lk ender. But if immediate lk ender, if he fadc’s back then (as above) he’s safe unless cornered, and if he doesn’t fadc back, you get a free command grab
–The only reason to not do this is because your Rufus opponent might catch on and do the high overhead ender more so as to escape any punishment. To keep him honest, occasionally mash lariat.
This is a real bad guessing game for Rufus if he doesn’t have fadc meter. It’s worse for him to be knocked down than it is for you, it’s worse for him to lose an ex stock than it is for you, the percentage of his lifebar you take off if you’re successful is more than the percentage he’ll take off if he’s successful, and whereas your negative outcomes are only whiff (ex hand under high ender) or trade (trade lariat with late lk ender), his negative outcomes include two knockdowns (lariat against high ender, ex hand against delayed lk ender) and a whiff (ex hand under high ender). Once your opponent figures this out, expect to see fewer ex messiahs.
Forgive me if this is common knowledge or has been discussed a billion times before.
I often get caught by cross-up D+LK into command throw. Doesn’t matter if the J.D+LK is blocked or not. I tried looking up possible escapes in training mode - I could just jump out of it, or FA absorb the J.D+LK and then backdash away. But I’m not a Gief player, so I have a feeling I’m not doing the setup right which is why I could get out of it so easily.
So, what is the right way to get out of crossup D+LK into command throw?
j.d+lk is 8 frames of blockstun or 11 frames of hitstun. If you hit it pretty low, it is possible to follow up with a c.lk on hit, which is 3 frames startup, but the timing is pretty tight.
Some of the possibilities :
1- j.d+lk, command grab
2- j.d+lk, c.lk (to prevent from jumping out)
3- j.d+lk, lariat (to prevent from jumping out)
4- j.d+lk, block (the dumb genius option)
Since any jump has pre-jump frames, the other guy will get caught by the low kicks if he’s holding up-back. So, then the gief player can just try to throw him since he won’t be jumping out. This is where that stupid j.d+lk mindgame goes.
To answer your question on how to beat that kind of Zangief strategy, it’s pretty much character relative.
Some examples :
Another thing that’s good to know is that the c.lk’s when blocked are not a real blockstring. There is a 2 frames gap between each kicks where you can throw out something invincble. Any seasoned Zangief player will know that he can’t poke for too long.
Personally, I don’t use the knees anymore. It’s way too risky if the other guy knows what to do to counter them.
it depends on how deep their D.LK is really. From my experience I do high ones against shotos to attempt to stuff a reverse SRK, but doing them high leaves alot of time from the actual hit to the ground, so you lose trip guard and they can backdash,srk, etc. Now doing them low as a crossup makes it a tad bit tougher to reverse, but I see alot of backdashing/jumping work in this instance after the initial blocking of the crossup.
At the height where the knees are an ambiguous cross up and can stuff certain DPs, gief is left at a zero frame situation even on hit. So DPs/ Backdashes/Jumps all would work there.
At the height where he can combo from them, it’s easier to tell what side he’s landing on and inputting crossup DPs are very effective.
Thanks for the replies!
I use Chun. If I have meter and see the big guy flying at me, I use EX SBK. The problem is when I don’t. Chun can really do nothing except eat or block the j.d+lk, and then from there 95% of the time I get command grabbed. I was playing against a high-level Gief last week and he used this on me multiple times, but I know I’ve been hit with it quite a bit in the past as well so I was wondering the best way to get out of it. I guess if it is jumpable, I will try that and hope I don’t eat a lariat or c.lk.
With Chun, focus backdash (maybe even just backdash) works, I think. As a sidenote, make sure you’re not spending that EX on EX-Fireballs or EX-Legs. EX-SBK is the strongest tool to dominate Gief with. Without that EX meter, you’ll be under severe pressure after a knockdown.
To BP Amoco:
Ok so last night we played and as u know the score was 20-5, sorry I couldnt stay and play some more but I had a few other peeps waiting to play. The only advice I can give is just as I told TKD Boosted is to work on those links. U had dropped it a few times and cost u the match. Ur ground game was not to bad as well as your mixup game when knocked me down but, again after a few games u became to easy to read. O yeah, man u was playing kinda reckless in the beginning taking unessessary chances. I mean you may get a lucky win or two in a mirror match playing like that but against a solid Sagat or Ryu player you will lose farily quickly. It seems like every gief I’ve played and seen in the U.S has these problem. Question, how to you fair up against other players? If u can post some vids up I can give u some advice on that if u want. But again GGs, hit me up if u ever want to play again.
Sweet. Thanks for the tips Vegita-X. I have alot less weapons to pull than u. I got lucky going 5 of 20. Might post some vids for tips but i doubt the commentary would be as entertaining as TKD.
Quesion what is the best way to buffer the 360 during crouching short strings do you do a back to forward down lk and then the rest of the way around and LP. I cant seem to get it down with more than 1 short.
Seriously how do you punish late wake up ex SBK from Chun. In practice mode all i can do to punish it is sweep which i know isnt a good option. I have seen vids with people landing ultra on block what am i doing wrong.
So pretty much how the F do you land a SPD or ultra after blocking a ex SBK.
Just watch Renegade’s video [media=youtube]pFXXS5BWwLE[/media]
willix and ultradavid( if you play online) i’d like to play your gief’s i’ve gained some knowledge of the matchup and need some dirty mixups because i know i havent seen it all
Quick blanka question:
Do I have to kara EX GH blanka to punish an up ball on hit during a wake up scenario or does regular ex GH work fine?
thanks in advance.