I cannot make the knees at Seth’s neck beat any of his srks. Anyone wanna tell me what I’m doing wrong?
Wow I must have been hallucinating thinking that a backwards dp could produce a hand. I was crossing seth up by mistake.
Viper’s HP Thunder Knuckle can also lose or trade with Gief’s jumping mk if timed or done deeply enough.
UltraDavid is god’s gift to zangief.
I’ve actually had an Akuma ultra me when I tried to wake up knee. The knee whiffed due to his invulnerability frames on startup and his ultra connected when I landed… Did I just miss time it or is wake up ultra a valid counter for knees? The game auto turns him too to face you as you are crossing him up.
You just mistimed it. If you’d used that timing on a dragon punch you probably would have lost too. Sounds like you might have done it too early.
Updated! Got some help from a few guys about a few characters, so I changed some options and added some extra comments. People who helped significantly are listed next to the names of the characters they helped with.
Also starting to expand on some things, so it might look a little unfinished in some areas right now.
why are some realy helpfull posts like this not sticky? can anybody please make this one sticky oh and maybe my tutorial althou 
good work i dont think that knees is the best way for ryu & ken becouse you can change the crossover to a normal overhead of the splash with a short jump but thats only imho great sourc for informations ^^
I was always under the impression that this was Zangief’s flowchart O.o… http://shameinnothing.com/data/lulz/zangflowchart.jpg
Sorry but I just have to ask. Can someone put a SHORT video showing the knees beating Ryu’s ex dp or any dp(fp lp ex) for that matter? My feeble and pathetic attempts are fruitless.
Ok I finally got the ex dp to whiff but it seems like if they delay the srk, not put it at reversal timing then it’ll hit gief.
Would it be too redundant to add the options after a ex hand for characters’ quick rise and neutral wake up?
Yeah, we need videos of these in action. And for this thread to be stickied.
Im pretty sure thats not true:
st. lk xx ex green hand beat counter 100% of the time, so its a very viable meaty attack.
Theres no escaping that shit except with ex demon flip.
But then you’re guessing that he won’t block. If he does block, you’re screwed. It’s still a guessing game. Not a completely safe option.
For the, “Characters who can be mixed up after 360k by regular/short jump mixup” Ryu is listed under walk forward and then jump but if you do that wouldn’t the jump not be at the timing of dodging the reversal srk? I thought the correct timing against to dodge Ryu, Ken, and Akuma srks was to jump as they wakeup?
As I said in the comments at the end of the Ryu section, yeah, you’ll lose to srk if Ryu does srk and you do that regular/short jump mixup. In general you want to go for the short knees right behind his head, because that’s safe. But the payoff for the knees is relatively small; Ryu has to wake up blocking, but after he blocks you’re basically back to square 1 of guessing what to do since recovers from the knees’ short hit/block stun so quickly. The payoff from that regular/short high/low mixup is huge, though. If Ryu expects to have to block (which he should eventually), then try that mixup out. The sick thing about it is that the opponent has to pick one of 4 ways to block where each way is about equally likely to happen, and if he guesses wrong he’ll take 20% damage and get knocked down again. It’s a great great mixup, one of the best in the game, so try it if you don’t expect Ryu to do a dragon punch. If you do expect a dragon punch, just go for the knees.
As for that Gouken solution, I think that’s a good idea. Presumably the short activates the counter and then Gief slides through it during ex hand’s invincibility? That’s cool. Crapface is right, we’re looking for safe things, but I don’t think we’re going to find them against Gouken. That idea is better than any I’ve come up with. Thanks man!
Thank goodness for this thread! These gief forums have been kinda lackluster, so it’s great to have these PRO tacts.
Exactly, even if you manage to block the st. lk and do it in between(which is pretty hard, youre still gonna eat the second hit of the ex green hand.
Also I posted that hoping you came up with an answer for me besides blocking, so no, lol, dont thank me!
I co-sign on getting this bad boy stickied, this is some serious gold in here.
And UltraDavid = Bruce Wayne.
I just figured out something cool. On those people who like to do wake up neutral jump attack and follow by low hit or throw mixup, on wake up, if you see them jump, hold back to block the high attack. While in block stun, rotate the stick from back to up to forward to down and end up at downback and hit punch. If they follow with a low attack, you will block it, if they try to throw, you will beat them with SPD. If you are gutsy, you can even try to rotate it right after block from forward and do a complete 540 and end up at the downback position. That way, either you block their attack or you end up super or ultraing them. This will make them think twice about going for those throw mixups. I see this particularly a lot with Blanka and Sakura players. Some Bison and Ryu players like to do it too. This might actually even work well in a mirror match when you’re under wake up headbutt pressure. But usually against gief, I try to just block and get the hell out of there. The only down fall of this is if they neutral jump twice. So I suggest waiting a split second to hit the attack button to see if they walk forward, attack, or jump again.
This thread is sick. I stole the o-s jab sweep and posted it in the Dictator forums, even if it’s not nearly as useful for him, or in general.
Props to UltraDavid.
I dunno how accurate this stuff is UD but you’re gross for compiling all of this, haha. Let’s play sometime, go to James Chen’s house on Fri. 