Ouch on block
Where did you get the frame data and how did you test them?
Quick question: can you negative edge kara karakusa? or is the range from light not worth it anyways?
kara light after fierce hayate is fine but pretty much whenever light karakusa kara would be ideal EX should be used to beat jab mashing as on wakeup if your taking the risk might as well do RH version.
so it -can- be negative edged right?
I’d think that’d be a lot easier than a raw kara input
I don’t believe it can unfortunately.
I’m recording at 60 FPS with an Intensity Pro capture card and I’m using KMPlayer to view the recording frame by frame. After I execute the move I make both characters jump (I make sure the characters are identical, in this case both Makoto.) I measure the frame data by taking one distinguishable frame from one of the characters and counting how long it takes for the other character to reach that identical frame.
Here’s a fun fact about taking startup data, if you turn on input display in training mode, the button appears on the 2nd frame of startup.
As an example, here is Ryu’s LP SRK, shown frame by frame from startup to active:
http://img169.imageshack.us/slideshow/webplayer.php?id=srk1a.jpg
Wait, SRK hits on 4th frame now? News to me.
can anyone check if you can cross up meaty with fukiage since her hit-box is kinda behind her?..mostly want to check if something like FA2->fukiage->j.FP->dash under->HP/MP fukiage will double cross up…shit would be incredibly mean
or maybe you can double dash?
does a tsurugi re-cross up after dash under?
check FA2->FA1->s.FP->hayate…does the s.FP just whiff. if not, will the hayate go under?
also, does f.RH cross-up in corner? does it only cross up point blank (only seen point blank…kinda sucks since she moves really far away after the cross-up)
I’m pretty sure that the first active frame will generally not show the opponent in hitstun state. So it isn’t until the frame after that they take that animation.
Great stuff Mienaikage, I appreciate the frame data.
Could I make a request? I’d like to do this kind of work myself, however I don’t have the utilities (nor the game) to do so.
Anyways, if your up to it could you figure these out so we could have concrete numbers instead of previous guesses…
- s.mp (startup and advantage on block/hit)
- s.hp (startup and advantage on block/hit)
If you could get to that, man I’d really appreciate it!
really curious now to see that backwards kara rofl
Found something very interesting tonight. Im no Makoto pro (you should see my first post on this thread) but I was playing around with kara throws. Instead of using f+lk to kara I tried using f+hk to kara. Apparently, if you do the kara with f+hk it brings you backwards. Kinda like a dash back throw? Sorry if my terminology is terrible. Basically f+hk kara will set her backwards and throw. Strange?
Ill post a vid in a few and show you. I could be just doing something retarded…
EDIT: Here is a vid showing the strange deal…
[media=youtube]biy-T1lUqsg[/media]
isnt f+hk supposed to push you back a bit?
f+HK moves you forward, but I guess that the hitbox moves backward during the kara period.
Oh sweet. Could you test the start up on karakusa and the frames after block on tsurugi?
Nice stuff, Mienaikage. Better than having to judge it visually.
I’ll leave the framedata stuff to you then, at least until I get a copy of the game at home 
Edit: AHA! I see why I was off by a frame earlier. It seems if you charge the Hayate for even a fraction, you get an additonal +1 on block/hit.
No you can’t her hit box won’t work, however, if they are in reset animation you can meaty it by going for the crossup and it will hit them (however it won’t actually be a crossup) so it’s pointless.
I’m really hating fukiage as it doesn’t seem good for doing much besides punishing nuetral jumps, and even than some of the beastlier nj. attacks eat it. Really hitting fukiage seems to be unlikely unless its combo’d into. cr. MK, st. MP, st. FP, and st. Mk are your anti-airs fukiages just aren’t reliable at most distances.
However, I know you can hit a fukiage on cammy, juri, and thawk after an EX hayate and that shit HURTS.
Corner only I’m guessing?
Fukiage was never a good AA though. She has more than enough good AAs seriously. :lol: Won’t give you huge damage like fukiage but at least you aren’t free on jump ins.
Really?, so hp, mp hayate charged should do more damage and could get you in better frame advantage, correct?
nah not complaining just putting out information so when people are on their day 1 they aren’t surprised they don’t consistenly get 350 dmg punishers off jumpins.
Also ya its corner only, someone said you can hit it on akuma also which would be nice but I haven’t been able to. On a positive note almost everyone can get hit by an lp hayate if your quick enough, except rufus who falls like the fat ass he is.
On charged hayates do you get the MP spacing? only the fp hayate puts you at a spacing where you can really be threatening giving that up would really suck.
Edit: Alright found something cool her st. LK gives her a kara throw also not as good as f. LK but still very noticeable works so you can do st. MP into backthrow kara to train them to want to tech.