You think you're hungry? You're not

After taking SeattleVersus, you may have seen that I’ve taken posting much differently then I have in the past. Obviously, to maintain an image, I choose not to post at the first sight of something that I disagree with now days. How can anyone motivate or influence when they are looked at as a jerk? When I was being called “Northwest’s #1 hater” I had to take a step back and understand what it was doing to me, as well as what it would do for my name as SeattleVersus as well. SeattleVersus stands for more than just myself, it stands for our entire region, so if I’m ever going to be making anything out of it (and us), I need to be on my P’s and Q’s.

I wanted to take a break from posting in this manner and talk about something that I think needs to be said. I’m for once going to let down this image, and post in the real “Mickey D” way that I did in the past. This doesn’t mean that I’m going to come out the wall with guns blazing and offensive, however understand that the tone of this post will come across very different than most of my posts.

This post is about our scene, our status, my personal opinion on it and what you want to do with it.

After people came back from NorCal Regionals, people were surprised. They got a taste of reality and saw that (and I quote) “people down there are much hungrier than us.” I’m glad that the people who went down to NCR were able to get that experience and were able to go, however it urked me a bit to see that people were taking this notion as a problem…the problem being that Seattle isn’t as hungry as the other regions are, hence why we’re not as good.

To go further into this, all I really have to say is “Your just figuring this out?” There has been no doubt in my mind since Evolution this summer that we were never as hungry as any of the other region’s. I’ve had multiple discussions with other people from other regions recently where they flat out said “You guys have the heart, but it just seems like you guys don’t really come to play…more or less to show your heart and be friends.”

Now with that, let me just say that I appreciate what you’re doing Frank and I think it’s great for the community. However people in this scene need to start realizing where we stand in this fighting game scene…we’re not the best, we’re not that good, and we’re not working to even become good…so to say that we’re not as “hungry” as the other regions is an understatement. We will always be that region who has “team spirit” but nothing more…Look at the Seahawks for further representation. What more, we are some what fated to have this fall upon us. We are SEATTLE…people who are passionate for their hobbies, close knit to their friends and communities and our self entitlement gets in the way of our ego’s to show us our true colors. We are prideful, yet have nothing to show for it.

The best people in our area don’t even PLAY together for God’s sake. WE don’t even play together as a scene. If you want to make the excuse that we “meet up once a week for tournament wars” let this be me saying that it isn’t enough.

I see all sorts of posts about what we need to do for the scene, however never once have I seen action until Tournament Wars. People have sessions at their houses and open up, and please don’t think that I’m not grateful for that, I truly am…however let this be a reality check that it is not enough for the “goal” that you’ve put yourselves at. You can’t call yourselves hungry until you’ve truly put in the work. You want to get better? Throw sessions! Organize events and tournaments! Become **serious **about playing.

I personally don’t even look at myself as a Street Fighter player any more…I’m more or less someone who just enjoys the game. It’s not like I practice, it’s not like I try to figure something out in the game, how can I call myself a street fighter player? There’s no fire and that’s the problem with this scene. We’re all just friends who have casual games with each other and nothing more.

Let this be a reality check to all those that say that they “play Street Fighter seriously” because aside from a handful of you, there aren’t many who even play this game like that. So how are you going to start the want to play? Or do you even WANT to play? Drop the self entitlement and do something for your scene if you want it to thrive.

  • Mike Davis

We are lacking alot right now but after going to Nor Cal we’re behind but we aren’t that behind…in the sense that yes they are better but they aren’t un-beatable…mike, eman and I challenged some of them to MM’s and yeah we got beat but we held our own we got some matches and were by no means free. I like that we at least have a start in Twars as I hear more and more about people who did not enter Twars disappointed that they didn’t/ are looking forward for season 2. We need more gatherings/tournaments. Seriously what happened to PnT or Gameclucks? It’s awesome to see ed and eman hosting some tournaments…good shit guys!. Honestly I hope the dojo gets started up soon and with what I’ve been hearing idea wise it would be pretty awesome. We are down now but not out…we are the NW be fuckin proud and lets show’em what we got. For those taking this game seriously I hope this is sort of a wake up call and for those not taking this game seriously just disregard all of this because this isn’t for you.

I haven’t been here that long nor should my opinion be that weighted but I am crazy competitive and pretty observant… just my 2 cents.

Also I want to head up to BC again soon if you want to go hit me up…the best time is Friday nights…we’d probably leave at 4-5pm and e-spot closes at 2am so we’d be back early morning. If this sounds interesting to you PM me.
(passport required)

The truth!

Honestly, the reason I started hosting Thursdays was because when I went to Cali in the summer, I saw how they had solid session practice every week. What they’d do is go to someone’s place once a week, play in a garage with 5+ setups, and just grind it out game after game, back to back. No MMs or matchup dodging, just playing as many games as possible within 2-4 hours and learning what you can. Most, if not all the top players are there, grinding it out with the less skilled players.

I’m actually more interested in T6 now than SF4 because they seem to have sessions rather than practicing with absurdly long lines at gameworks. I dunno about you guys but playing 1 game every 30 minutes at gw is not very efficient. Though I have no tourney credentials in the FG community here, I know from previous experience with competition in quake/sports that the only way to get better than the best is to practice as efficiently/effectively as possible. Sure talent can makeup for lack of practice at times but to be consistent, work must be put in.

My 2 cents!

Real talk.

I don’t see as much drive from our scene as I used to, I’m hoping super 4 will bring back some of the fire we had. I’m still ready to play and I feel like more than ever I’m ready to win, but I know theres still so much father I have to go. I wish I could hop in the Japanese arcade culture because I have the drive to play but not the lifestyle to accomodate a lot of it.

I know Super 4 is (for once) Capcom mainstreaming Street Fighter for America, and I’m happy for that, but we don’t have the same structure that facilitates the greatest innovators and brings the top level play in to question. With that said I still think America, and even Seattle, is trying to do what it can, but its the honest truth to say we dont have the same drive as other regions do or even a portion of it.

If I had the space to host sessions I would be doing so, but I don’t, so my play time revolves around practice, casuals, and making it to what sessions I can reasonably make.

edit: I laughed a bit when I saw the title since I just ate a roast beef sandwhich and like 3 sliders.

I wish portland and seattle got together more often. We’re starting to see some unity in a small way now that versis has closed. Hopefully we can maybe make a trip up to seattle at some point. Right now a lot of people are finishing up finals in school so its not the best time.

Stop beasting Micheal Davis.

Your post really says one thing to me, and it’s basically a cry for help. You justify your “hunger” by doing well in a few money matches? Which by the way, you lost…yet you’re saying that you did well, and that’s enough? So let me just reiterate what you’re saying…that you’re justifying your loss because you DID WELL? That’s like giving a kid a toy for getting an C+ on a test! The fact that you even have the mentality to justify such things makes me realize the plight of our community.

Gatherings and tournaments is one thing, but it’s a state of mind. You say “we’re nw be fuckin proud and show em what we got”…it’s easily broken Carlos. You’re from NW and have nothing to be proud of as far as fighting games go…be proud that it rains here? Show everyone that we’re a bunch of “spirited determined players?” Wake up Carlos, it’a mentality issue that we in Seattle don’t have, it’s not about sessions or tournaments.

Here’s an example of what Carlos meant: I played a money match against Leviathin’s Akuma who placed top 8. We started the match with me getting 2 matches to his 1 match, with the 2 I won being completely in my favor. He then proceeded to get up but I told him that we were doing first to 3. I end up losing the next to matches by pixels. After the match he told me I was the best Bison player he had ever played against. Although I lost, I feel GOOD about the loss because I know I’m not that far from being right there with the best. Hell, I even BAARAELY BY PIXELS lost to Dagger G who is the best (or second best) Guile player in the world. I don’t care if I lost, being able to say I could hang with the best of the best is an accomplishment to me.

Mike, what you’re saying I presume is in the context of tournament play only and working together as an entire scene and not just doing well against a few good people. I agree that we need more people to be serious about SF4. Ed’s example of people grinding out hours of games in a garage is perfect. The key is that the best players show up and help other players. They show up to any session they can to play. We need that. Our regular top 10 at Zach’s don’t even show up to tournaments let alone sessions. I don’t think we need to rely on the hype of Super4 to rejuvenate our scene. We need to just get serious here and now.

Give a man a fish, feed him for a day. Show a man how to fish, feed him for the rest of his life.

Said it before and I’ll say it again. People don’t like the way something is

Do something about it. Action before talk.

Rather than comment on the MM’s, I would like to talk about our actual tournament performances, because at the end of the day that is what really matters. We all went 3-2. We could look at that and say ‘at least we weren’t 2 and out’. But honestly, that isn’t the mentality to have if we want to reach the level of the people who made top 8. Our focus should be on how we can improve so that the next time we travel to a tournament we do better.

As far as top players showing up to events, I do agree that playing more often with the best guys in our area would help grow the scene (and also help them, since they don’t get to play with each other that often either). That being said, it is an ‘if you build it they will come’ situation, in that we really haven’t been having many tournaments or serious sessions lately. All of us can shoulder the blame for that one.

There are two tournaments coming up soon, one this weekend and one the next. I really hope that people show up to both of them. It would be awesome if Portland or BC could come through.

I’d also like to head up to BC this Friday, and if you can make the time I would strongly urge you to come with. There are a number of very good players there, and they pretty much all show up to E Spot on Friday night. It’s an opportunity to test your skills, as well as connect with other NW players.

Here’s the thing. I think it all starts with the sessions. I’m not talking about anybody in particular, but this is where things need to change. I think people need to understand what exactly it is that they want. Do they want the casual, lax, social type atmosphere (which is perfectly fine) or do they want an environment that facilitates seriousness and improvement. In my eyes, the only way you can have both, is in an arcade. You got a bunch of people there, putting up money to play. It’s a fun yet serious environment. An environment suited for the type of gameplay that pushes people to play better. Naturally a lot of issues to consider (equipment, wait time, etc) but that’s the only environment (imho) that can house both.

Now with that said, with this being a console driven era, I think the way sessions are ran have to be done differently if we’re expecting to be taken seriously. Smaller more concentrated sessions have to happen. Waiting however many matches before getting to play again does nothing. A lot of the times you don’t even get to play the person you lost to. This is one reason why I enjoy the current SFIV online system as it currently is. It’s just 1v1, as long as you both can stand playing the game. That’s why I can play 70-80 matches with one person in a single online setting. I can talk to them about their gameplay, and they can talk to me about what I’m doing. If the connection is fine, we’re going to make progress, we’re going to learn something. SOMEBODY will benefit from it. That’s the most important thing. Because if you take advantage of my mistakes and exploit my weaknesses, that’s gonna make me have to step my shit up, and believe me I will, because I hate losing. Trust me.

There’s no reason why we shouldn’t be one of the illest areas for SFIV, Tekken 6, Arcana Heart, what the fuck ever. We have the talent. We got talent by the boatloads, but is the proper mentality there? That’s the question.

Also, I wanna add something else while I’m thinking about it. Regardless of how people may feel about each other personally or whatever, we could all stand to gain something from one another as players. I don’t have to like you, but I would like to play with you. Maybe there’s something I could learn from you. Hopefully you could learn something from me. Because I would love to have someone emerge and start whooping serious ass because that’s another dope player in this scene. Another person that people can chase after and gun for. We don’t have that right now to be quite honest.

Anyway, great fucking thread Mickey, I agree.

That was insightful :tup:

I never really thought of how 1v1 for hours against Dugg, Carlos, Mike, or Elias have changed the way I play. They know my habits and they exploit them. I remember in norcal Ed Ma watched me play like 10 back to back matches then right before I left he challenged me to prove a point. He just punished all of the unsafe crap he saw me doing the last 10 matches then told me how to improve.

The point of the matter is that you’re doing the exact same thing that Carlos is…justifying and settling for mediocrity. All I’ve ever heard about was how you guys “did well” in matches, yet THAT is enough to be happy with your skill?

This is the entire problem with our scene…you have no fire. You’re content with “doing well” to whatever that standard means to you, and this ability to be content with mediocrity is what stops you from pushing yourselves to becoming better and stronger…not just for yourselves, but for the community.

For instance, I personally don’t play, because I’m not challenged. There are about 5 people in this scene who challenge me and push me to raise my skill when I play them. Do I lose to people? Of course! But does that mean that you’re pushing my skill? No it doesn’t…I’ve not been pushed in my own scene for a very long time and** that is a problem.**

I’m not going to argue about how well you did at NCR or any of that. The point I’m trying to make is that I see people saying that they’re hungry and I’m calling it out…where is the hunger? Because I sure in hell don’t see it! If you want to make this scene competitive, then do something about it…teach people, throw sessions, learn how to practice efficiently, do something with your community…

Get rid of this self entitlement and drop the self righteous ego’s. If you want to become a seriously competitive scene, something needs to be done…I’m just your wake up call to tell you that it needs to happen.

Well put. I agree I don’t feel that I’m at the level I want to be yet I just feel that I’m closer than I thought I was to that level. And yes we need to all do our part in helping the scene as you are doing with Seattleversus.

If the players around you can’t push you as much as you’d like, why not create a challenge for yourself? I understand you have success with Ryu and possibly other characters, but try and pick up an entirely different main?

The more exposure the NW scene gets from all characters, the better.

Games only get stale when you aren’t learning new things, or set new challenges to keep yourself interested.

I’m not trying to make this about me or my personal experiences with fighting games. I brought my own experience up because I know myself best, and I won’t speak for others. I’m not blaming my disinterest in fighting games because of the community…I’m saying that if they want to be competitive, it’s time to see something instead of just hearing about it.

Choosing to pick up a secondary to make things “more challenging” is a bit reverse don’t ya think? Why would I use a secondary when they’re not going to be as good as my main? So I’m going to handicap myself by using a secondary instead of my main to give my community experience? I think I do enough to keep the game “interesting” by teaching others. Trust me, picking up secondary characters isn’t going to make my competition monumental. The game isn’t stale, the competition is.

The fact that people want to bring up “but we did this! And I almost beat him!” is a bit disappointing when looking at the grander scheme of things. People become content with hitting top 8 and not aiming for top 3 or even 1st place. People don’t have the urge to even practice, yet they say that they hit hard…or can even stand up to some of the best? It sounds like false entitlement to me. Maybe Seattle isn’t ready to become a competitive scene after all.

I’ll offer to host up weekly again for SF4, but it kinda sucks to set aside a night, then people that say they’re coming bail to GW, and then ask to roll through after around 11:30pm-12pm. Personally, I don’t go to gw because it’s not efficient for me (oh god economics side of me) for reasons stated above… and parking!

I didn’t grow up/with the arcade era so this is coming from my perspective. Waiting 20 min to play 1 game on 1 setup seems way less efficient in terms of improving than if I were to play on 3 setups. Sure I lose the mental “risk” of putting up money and time waiting in line, but I get to figure out what my faults as long as I pay attention to what’s wrong with my game and whoever I play points it out… and I get way more opportunities to do this. It’s all in the way you approach the game.

The “top players don’t play with me” shit is bs. Not everyone has the time/resources to play SF any given day of the week. Yeah playing with top players makes you improve way faster but if you don’t have that option, you gotta figure something else out. Make your sessions worthwhile and figure out what you did wrong, don’t blame it on the absence of a godlike player. There’s plenty of people in all sorts of games that have NO ONE to play with and they come out beasting when it comes tournament time. You make use of your session time… take and make what you want from it. If people only gather once a week, make it as efficient/effective as possible and keep that mentality when you’re there.

Being a “wake up call” doesn’t really do anything and it’s not something most of us didn’t already notice…alot of people can see that we’re not really competative as a scene and that the lack of sessions/tournaments/arcade time/console time is the problem…I work on a few of my combos everyday so when it comes time to preform I don’t have an execution error. I want to be competative and am working towards it by attending alot of sessions…We did alright at NCR which is alot more than some can say who didn’t go…at least we made the time to go down and put up what we had…we lost but we learned alot from it…you always learn more from loosing and not winning…honestly I learned more about my game in that one room with the Utah guys/leviathan/daggerg/ed ma/fatbear than I did in my past months here…and some more I can’t remember…I won’t not be proud of “doing well” against Philippino Champ or mike ross because we don’t have that level of player here. When I lost they told me some stuff and didn’t just throw out the general gg or next or just plain nothing I get from most of my matches here. We’re all but righteous we want to get better…If you’re not feeling challenge I throw you one I still want the ft5(3) whatever for $20 or $50 (maybe frank will allow it at the next Twars) I’ll show you a challenge as would I’m confident eman or mike would. You are only around so much and at least the top players in Cali are helpful. You point out this mentality aspect of the game when you actually have to be playing the game to have or develop a mentality.

When people would ask us who’s the best in out scene we couldn’t answer…no one here is on top (except maybe scrubby dan-but we don’t see much of him) and it was weird answering the question…we could give 4 or 5 people who usually place high or streak high in casuals or hold their seat at GWs but no-one really stands out…we don’t really have any “known” players outside of BowFlex Mike-dude somehow a celebrity in Cali. Our good players rarely show up to stuff or even the arcade at all. This Philosophical stuff is all good to write but we need to do something…one doesn’t need to be in a scene very long to see it’s slow and not very competitive. Again my 2 cents but trying to tell me I don’t have the hunger is insulting…I go to almost every session I xan and hit GW 1-2 times a week as well as heading up to BC and to top it all off heading to Cali for a fun 1-way 14 hour drive…don’t tell me I don’t have hunger I’ll show you my hunger come challenge me. I’ll MM anyone.

I don’t need accomplishments to have hunger nor do I need to be anywhere for any amount of time either. I like Mandel’s idea of I don’t have to like you to learn from you…I want to play against you Mikey…and Mandel…etc…online/offline/arcade I want to get better and I know I am. At Preppy’s I saw some of my gamestyle improvements quite clearly and also what kind of new mistakes they brought with them…yeah there was 5 people max in the rotation but it was awesome to get that kind of in person quality play…quality over quantity when it comes to mind games/ mentality in my view at least. If you want to be competitive execution should be standard then the mind aspect and footsie based game begins.

cue popcorn

Same thing in Portland. Top players in PDX are rarely gathered at the same place at the same time. No one cares enough, too busy, don’t like the particular game, or whatever else. Learning a secondary is fine but you’re just cheating the other players as well as yourself.