Yes.. there is actually a noob out there that still has the balls to play

Lots of good information both linked and given in the posts here, at the end of the day to really start on the road of understanding fighting games at any age you have to do your homework if you do want to up your game some.

Think of the videos, the guides and the individual player advice as basically how it worked for us lot dropping our pennies into the arcade games. It’s just the same knowledge and player interaction evolving with the advent of the internet.

Now i don’t really play any more but will renew my interest when AE 2012 hits, and Skullgirls, SCV as well as SFxT will probably sit in my PS3 some time in the future. I enjoy the genre and thing the majority of the community is one of the best in gaming, actually one of the best “scenes” overall. The willingness to help those willing to help themselves in the fighting game community is encouraging for new players and old ones wanting to see new blood enter the fray.

Fighting games are a different beast, like someone mentioned before, you learn by playing. You also learn good habits by playing and you will learn bad habits that you have to curb but all the guides, videos and information you’ve taken in, well you are going to find out the hard way that while you’re great at “Theory fighter”, it is going to be quite some time before you are actually good at “Practical Fighter (2 electric boogaloo)”.

Fundamentals win games, spacing, basic punishes and a solid ground game, but this isn’t going to click for you right away because at first you’re going to look for the flashy aspects of the game even if you presume you wont. You’ll be more focused on your special moves and looking for big damage chunks than actually controlling the pace of the fight, loads of us did it.

You’ll get outplayed. Outplay yourself, overthink things and lose to utter randomness that has you gritting your teeth; this is why players who are superb at training mode cry about losing to “no skill cheapness” because they are so one-dimensional in their gameplay that they force an opponent to dumb down and use an equally one dimensional counter tactic that nullifies that particular approach.

When you actually do start to get a feel for how the game is played, and when you do actually match up well against other equally capable players who force you into all kinds of mix-ups and mind games…you’ll lose to someone who plays genuinely poorly. This isn’t because you have no future in the land of fighting games and all that practice is for nothing. It’s because you’re used to the flow of a “real” fight and understand the do’s and do nots now, then walk right into several “do nots” in a row because it’s so random to do something so unsafe. You beat these guys with no frills fighting, and essentially punish every inevitable mistake without trying to mix things up. There are no mind-games vs mindless opponents.

You’re as good as your opposition but will have to find that level where you are not overwhelmed at first, where you can actually learn from your losses and see where you are improving. Getting outclassed and used as a training dummy is fine in that it often shows you what can be done in the game, and gives a benchmark to work to each time. At the same time however you do need some breathing room as you learn.

Enjoy and play really! :slight_smile:

Just like you said, you will have to adapt because people will find any possible way to deplete your health bar to 0 as fast as possible. That is the goal of the game after-all lol. Perhaps long combos isn’t your style and you may need to find a character that doesn’t do a lot of combos but good damage. Either way, you’re going to come across some players that will utilize a high damaging combo and you will need to learn defense and punish them. Defense IMO, is probably the one thing that people need to learn the most. Not combos. lol

I agree with Kano. Defense is so important. The moment your opponent does not get in on you, thats when they start making mistakes. Just don’t be afraid to block. I feel like alot of new players just feel the urge to attack non stop and press buttons during block strings.

@Raas
I just gave him all the tools I used when I was just getting started. I agree the footsie handbook will not improve his gameplay just yet and is still way out of his league. But it can be helpful when trying to analyze high level play (it did for me). And it’s interesting to read imo.

Here’s a great story about cheapness.

First of all, GO OFFLINE. Quit worrying about Ranked matches. Sit down in Training mode after watching videos (IN YOUR CHARACTER THREAD FOLDER, THEIR SHOULD BE A THREAD SAYING VIDEOS, SIT DOWN AND WATCH THEM), try to implement the stuff that people in those videos are doing into your gameplay. It takes years to become good in a Fighting game but it is more rewarding coming first in a local tourney than saying I BEAT DEMON SOULS IN 7 HOURS!!! ALL HAIL HAMBLAR THE GOD OF HAMBURGERS! I BEAT DEMON SOULS IN 7 HOURS.

Sit there, play your matches, level up. Pick a top tier as that will help you out, unless of course you want to wait longer to be good with your character. The way that you post up seems like you don’t have the 4-12 Hours a day to put into this game. Listen to the WUSRK’s on the front page when they pop up. PR ROG said he sat in Training Mode for 8 Hours a day most days to practice combos. He lost at Evo to somebody who spends more time playing Marvel and that would be Viscant. I don’t know what you really want from us to tell you. Watch streams, watch matches, go to training mode. Lauren aka Fanatiq said he would do a combo 100 times until he got it down. Justin Wong said he would do a combo 100 times until he got it down. If he were to mess up once, he would go and start it over.

Ever heard of the phrase Practice Makes Perfect? In video games, that applies as well. Poongko plays for 16 hours a day. People still find him to be one of the best.

Do you have what it takes? I don’t think so. Quit whining and play, or leave.

Right, in SF, and all fighting games for that matter… you want to do the most damage with the least error possible.
Everyone who plays Ryu should always be looking for SRK, FADC, Ultra. Everyone.
To call that a ‘boring combo’ is silly… it’s a dynamic of the character design and if he didn’t have that, well he wouldn’t be anywhere near as scary.

As you come from a ‘strategy game background’, um, you have a couple of build orders and that’s what you do.
You very rarely if ever change them up because they’re tried, tested, and true.

Same goes for combos. You have a handful of them and that’s what you use. You don’t try to come up with new ones mid-match.
eg: a standard punish combo, a standard corner combo, a standard poke conversion combo, standard reset combo, standard post-knockdown setup.

For many characters these also overlap, so you may feel like it’s ‘bland’.
Fighting games are as much strategy as they are reflexes and execution.
I came from strategy games into fighters because I wanted more than ‘memorise build order and macros’.
I’m still mediocre in terms of execution, but it gives me something to work on, in addition to reaction and adjustment to my opponent.

If you’re looking for ‘interesting ways’ to fight, well… you might be a bit disappointed in SF, because it’s a game of meter management and spacing. If you’re looking to style on opponents, it is usually a poor use of damage scaling and/or meter. Top players very rarely do the same, because mistakes can cause you a lot of life and potentially the match.

If I were you, I’d focus on fundamentals. Pokes, footsies, spacing. Normals. It seems like you can do special moves no problem, so that’s not the issue.
The issue is to know when to use them and that you have six buttons that all have uses in the right situations.

So play a match and make your goal solely on one thing. It doesn’t matter if you win or lose, but you have to practice the principles.

  1. Anti-Air all jump ins.
  2. Play a strictly grounded game
  3. Execute a bread and butter without mashing, and get this each time you go for it.
  4. Block all cross ups
  5. etc, make up something you want to improve on
    When that is over with… post back.
    Some videos of your play would be useful for us to critique where you’ve gone wrong and to point your mind in the right direction.
    It’s a long journey, but will be worth it if you stay in there.

BTW, where do you live? Do you have a local scene nearby?

No local scene nearby that im aware of. hell, the game stores out here dont even sell the arcade sticks anymore… its almost as if the game has died for all but the people who kick royal ass at the game (this is only confirmed by the fact that you dont see anyone online without 10 million battle points anymore lol) which is why im trying to maximize my friends list with people who play so i can go into endless battles with them and hopefully find some people with mics who can give pointers and explain what im doing wrong. I know that, speaking for myself at least, winning against newbs is no fun. easy wins are no fun. i like being on the brink of losing because thats the only satisfaction i can receive. knowing this guy thought he had me, and almost did, but i pulled “greatness” out of my ass at the last minute and pounded his face into the dirt… (one of many reasons i love Evil Ryu… his shoryuken ultra is just brutal lol such a confidence building ultra if landed into a KO)

As for my “demons souls” bragging, get used to it. those of you who are great at SF brag about it because it was a long and grueling process to get to where you are, and believe me my skill level in that game took time as well, and** ive earned every right to brag about it**. I kick ass both offline and online in that game, and anyone with the balls to test that theory can look me up. we can go red stone all day long. i got millions of souls like this, so im not trippin lol
(end rant)

as for me harping down on the SFK>FADC>Ultra on Ryu, i only mean that the combo seems so easily done and overpowered and often over used that IMO its boring… i dont mind being tanked by a better player. I would just rather see someone smoke my ass with a string of normals, tatsus, srk’s, hado’s, etc… than sit there and play like a noob the entire round barely able to beat me and then at the last minute pulling off some easy to do combo that wipes me out. i dont mind losing, i just dont like losing to easy to pull off shit. ive seen vids of people doing these ridiculous combos that put my jaw to the floor. as a wise man once said, “its not illegal… just immoral”. these cheap combos are definitely part of the game and not in any way glitching or cheating, and i expect to see it. I just wish I would see more variety. Its like why would someone aim only to be good at one thing with a character? im aiming to be versatile with Ryu and have an arsenal fit to change up my play style at any given moment, inspiring awe in numerous situations with numerous strategies and moves. why aim only to win? its so boring. its why i stopped playing MK9…

I do agree defense is the most important part of a good strategy. it wont matter if you can do a 200 hit combo if you can never get it out because you are too busy with someones foot up your ass the entire match. ive learned to block high then low on opponents jumping in with that standard HK>low sweep and have won matches based simply on avoiding those annoying situations. I still have bad habits im trying to break like going for sweeps on blocking opponents or trying to counter sweep after a blocked sweep. lots of bad habits im noticing on my part but in time i will break them. the anxiety and pressure really do affect your judgement, but its why i play this game. I like the fear associated with the potential of losing (and in my case, the almost inevitable fact that i will lose lol) so i need to get my calm going in matches which is only a matter of time learning all the characters attack patterns and how to deal with them. at that point it becomes purely a matter of reading the opponent to figure out which attack he will use and dealing with it accordingly. im just still in the basics of this stage and need to learn the attacks ill be dealing with. I smoked a 5000+ player using zangief just by keeping my distance and pissing in his face with hadokens and crossing him up with sweeps, backing out again and then baiting him into command grabs and other attacks, slowly whittling his health down until i eventually won the match. this knowledge came with getting tanked 100 times with zangief and learning that his moves are all close range and can be easily avoided if the proper distance is maintained throughout the match.

You live in California…I doubt it should be hard for you to find a scene.

I mean if i was super into the game i guess i could drive the hour distance to San Francisco, but im really not trying to do that often enough for it to actually help me. thats what makes the internet gameplay so beneficial. buy a mic, and its no different than being right next to someone (almost i guess… if you like to dance like an idiot every time you win, and would like to show it off to the loser i suppose you would be shit out of luck lol)

No. Not at all. Drive that hour. Buying a mic does nothing for you. You aren’t right next to that person. You aren’t fulfilling what fighting games are about. See, some people think that being secluded will get you good at fighting games but in person interaction will get you leveled up much, much faster.

how so? i mean if i found someone willing to sit there and show me combos face to face yeah, i can see that. but the inherent “douch-ness” of most strangers (in my area at least…) means they are probably more concerned with talking shit than being friendly. and thats cool, i just dont want to have to fight the urge to start a real life street fighter event in the middle of an arcade… lol i dont like unfriendly shit talkers. i think id probably get hauled out of Evo in cuffs lol i dont aim to go tourney level so im not too concerned with person to person interaction outside of my circle of friends. and im not exactly overflowing with money so that kind of journey is a bit much for me. plus, i hate San Francisco lol too crowded, and driving through it is a bitch.

Are you shitting me? YOU LIVE IN NOR CAL. Do you watch streams? Finest KO is always wanting to have people learn. Go to hookups. Also if you don’t aim to be tourney level, why do you want to learn? People who want to win consistently usually are tournament players. Whether its your local tourneys to major tourneys, they play to win. Go to Southtown on Sundays. Go to RamNation Hookups. Go to your arcades. GET PRACTICE. Filipino Champ (FROM NORCAL) said that was how he leveled up totally. Ask him for pointers. He won’t be there tomorrow, because he is in Canada representing team USA.

in the majority of instances, if you go to gatherings or places with high level players with an open mind about getting better, this will never happen. there are assholes in every fighting game community but i can just about promise you, ANYONE that is worth the time to talk to will be patient, responsive, nice, and most of all, helpful towards you for learning this game. nearly every post i’ve seen you make in here has emphasized you wanting to learn combos, and that is absolutely not what you need to be focusing on right now. building your fundamental game is the most important thing you can be doing, and you will learn more about the way you play this game playing offline with good players for one night than you will from playing online for a month, that is a promise.

Why do so many people insist on referring to my ignorance as some cosmic paradox despite my own admission that ive only been playing for damn near 2 weeks? No i dont watch streams, no i dont know what Finest KO is, hell i dont even know HOW to get into any sort of local “scene” and as stated, im not really interested. Wanting to get better has nothing to do with me going out and winning tournaments… i just want to get better so i can get better and be better and win matches and have fun challenging other people. reputation is over rated. there is probably someone out there that can smoke Daigo like he was an amateur… and he probably never shows off that talent by going out and making a big “thing” of his talent in formal events. Never know… but that doesnt make him any less of a player, does it?

Not to be rude, but i think your view on things is rather narrow minded. “go pro or dont go at all” just makes the community seem unforgiving, unwelcoming, and IMO… un-appealing… i do hope you dont actually perceive things to be this way. or moreover, that others dont perceive the game to be this way. Once again im not trying to be rude or belittle your opinion, its just very disheartening. Luckily for me, i have skin thicker than tank armor so ill continue to press on regardless. I just fear this attitude on a mass scale might be why the community of casual gamers online is (from what ive seen) non-existent lol

I do need to work on every aspect of my gaming, but i DO have some basic fundamentals down. I know when to block for the most part, and i know to block high and low when reading opponents properly, i know when to punish aerial attacks (though sometimes in the heat of battle i cant always get it out fast enough… part of learning combos and getting comfortable with excecution if im not mistaken) and i know several baiting tactics such as spamming some mid range hadokens to bait people into either jumping in at my, or FADC’ing into me for a shoryuken punish, and a few other things. In general my performance i would say is on the lower end of “intermediate” or higher end of “novice”. I know things, just need to learn a ton more. I really wish a frequent poster here would contact me about a match so I can give them a chance to judge my performance first hand. While i definitely suck in comparison to the pro community, im not a TERRIBLE player… i do know i need plenty of work, but i think ive come a long way since starting and have been able to at least hold my own. Like i said before, i DO frequently manage to bring the opponent down close to death, and often take at least 1 round in some matches, so im not a total fuck up lol i just get my ass handed to me sometimes and whenever the pressure is high i lose my ability to perform the simpler motions and then there is the lack of ability to make truly effective use of opportune moments like post FA cumples with damaging links and combos.

I still have plenty to learn in all places. no doubt. but shouldnt i be aiming to improve in all areas? I mean im sure the “Akuma vortex” i hear about is way beyond me, but getting better with the “bread and butter” combos should be a paramount part of learning a character, right? Excuse ignorance on all levels. I hardly know the difference between links and combos and all that lol

Here is the thing: many more experienced players are trying to give you advice. Good advice even. You then tell them they are wrong. Naturally, they going to be frustrated. Let me try to sum up the advice you ought to listen to in this thread:

  1. There is no such thing as cheap, though you will hear some pros use the term ironically.

  2. Boring or not, every character has ideal bread and butter combos. Good players will try to use them on you. Frequently.

  3. It doesn’t matter how you want other people to fight you, they are going to play how they want to play (again, boring or not).

  4. Online play is not as valuable as offline casuals.

  5. You live in an area of the country with an incredibly vibrant SF scene. Many SRK users would love to have the opportunity to regularly play in your local area. You should take advantage of it.

  6. Lastly–and most importantly–you are new. There is a lot you don’t understand. Instead of trying to tell other, much more experienced players why they are wrong, consider trying to learn something from their advice. The SF scene can be quite welcoming to new players, but not arrogant new players.

This is actually an interesting point, but the wrong place to display it. While no one is forcing you to take the hobby to the logical extremes you are posting on a forum dedicated to the accursed thing in a genre that’s sole value is playing against other people. Still, what you do is what you do and I think you have a fair point. Just understand that unlike most other online friendly games there is a fairly real ceiling to what you can do just online with few if notable exceptions [WolfKrone]

You can always post vids if you have no bites in hands on lessons.

Or, go to a local gathering/tournament…in CALIFORNIA of all places…to test your performance so far.

California is a big place - I was lucky enough to live 30 minutes out of FFA but not everyone has that luxury. Not to put words in his mouth but this isn’t really advice. Chances are if he went he would get raped so there’s little incentive to go. Let him decide what he wants out of it.

@Warlock tho - people expect a certain dedication around here, if you don’t have it then things might get a little cold shouldery.

Really, you should play local casual matches with people.
http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?forums/pacific-north.116/
You learn and get better much quicker if you find a group of people than if you play online. Online people are have mics on so they can be dicks, or don’t have mics on.

I go to a weekly session with a group of people, and playing face to face with some cool people, you can actually talk about what just happened in a match, such as, “is that safe on block?” or “hey that move you just did, I can ultra II that on reaction.” or Dude you just fell for a frame trap.

Shit like that is how you quickly learn. You can discuss match ups and possible strategies, and possibly learn more on the spot than just grinding out online play.

For Street Fighter IV combos come second to fundamentals such as spacing and footsies and matchups.

When did i accuse a fellow poster of being “wrong”? If i did that then i apologize sincerely. I realize some of my questions can come out more like statements but its not how i intend. Im just cross referencing the information pointing out possible inconsistencies and actually HOPING to be corrected. I really wouldnt intend to correct anyone about anything in this game lol i mean unless its something stupid like someone telling me something isnt possible when ive seen it happen and/or it is a well known fact like if they stated a certain character wasnt in the game or something. The only thing ive outright disagreed with was the statement about “go pro or go away” because it doesnt make sense to me. I am a grown man with kids and obligations and financial problems all his own, and cant always run out for tournaments to practice and learn with other people. If i could find something local, sure.

But i spend more time on this game than im actually preparedto admit. Lets just say numerous hours per day, and more than just an hour or two lol its definitely not that im not dedicated. I just dont know if i will ever be skilled enough to do it at that pro level. why go out to Evo just to get my ass handed to me? sure its an experience ill never forget but for the wrong reasons lol id like to be able to say i held my own against them but i dont know if i have it in me with this game. im getting stronger by the day and with real help like ive been receiving here im going to get stronger. I just dont like being exiled for not wanting to go to tournaments… am i wrong for wanting to improve before i start facing an opponent face-to-face? its embarrassing getting spanked as it is… much less having to deal with the shit in person lol