Yang Changes in 2012?

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
101

So we nerf potential now?

Is this where we are in games? Fuck letting anything play out… shit looks like it might be too good a year or two from now, so let’s nerf it now.

That’s garbage.

It’s obvious that Yang has more upside than Yun does. It’s obvious he has a lot to his game.

Why is that bad? Why does that need to be nerfed? If a character has some shit that takes a long time to learn, and implement into a player’s game, let’s not let them actually go through that journey, and enjoy the fun in that… no… let’s cut it out.

And for all this FREE shit he gets, he still has more than a few very tough fights. Throughout the cast, he has tough fights, and there are a couple of characters that COMPLETELY keep him in check.

I just don’t understand the philosophy here. We have a complex, complete character… you can have him for less than a year… in some cases… what… 2 months? after that… let’s NOT have a complex, complete character. Fuck that.

102

The problem wasn’t that he was complete… the problem was that 98% of the cast wasn’t.

I would’ve honestly preferred if Capcom just buffed everyone up to their level, and just do a couple slight nerfs here and there. They didn’t though, they took the lazy way out and just nerfed the shit out of them… I don’t agree with that, but that’s the route they took. I do prefer this upcoming version of AE than the current one though… At least you can play any character you like and have them be viable for tournaments.

I know people are gonna bring up how “balance doesn’t make a good game” and shit. I don’t care, that shit could fly 10 years ago, it doesn’t now. When we see a game with thirty-somethin characters, we expect to at least PLAY thirty-somethin characters, not just 5-8 of them.

103

Yeah whatever. It’s not like I have some sort character loialty.

Whenever the better player still manages to win, I call the balance fine. Yang wasn’t even in top 32 at EVO, so he absolutely is not giving anyone free wins.

I reiterate my point that the worst part of his nerfs is that they don’t make sense at all compared to Yun’s.

To the above tier questioning:

104

I just do not feel that it is any more flawed than Vanilla or Super.
I can name tons of problems for both. And AE just now seemed like peopel started figuring things out.
AE 2012 may end up be not just the definite version but of the best fighters ever, as finetuned versions of solid games usually end up.
I just do not like how we were led to it.

105

This is exactly what should have happened .

Now i also don’t get the new stun nerf.Is he such a mixup monster?!The command grab mixups are good but yun has it too,plus he has better range and his stun remains the same.The fadc slashes to st clmk mixups?Sakura can do same mixups ,wasting only one bar, not two and her mixups can be as ambiguous or even more than yang’s.Plus she deals more damage and stun than yang could ever imagine.She still has 1000 stun.Wow now he has 900 stamina and 950 stun,just like ibuki.But ibuki has a vortex and better mixups imo…
His okizeme game sucks, except if he has the opponent in the corner.And he has to start a new offense from the beggining to get in.
Everyone says yang is s tier or as good as fei and yun.But has he ever won an official tourney in japan?Yun and fei have.What about yang?
And if he is as good as yun why are there only 2 yangs and 8 yuns in the top 20 list?
Anyway i’m not saying that yang hasn’t got any tools or can’t apply some safe pressure,or that he hasn’t got some decent mixups, but these nerfs are too much.Whoever can’t see that just didn’t play him in ae.Hopefully they won’t apply all these nerfs, because then yang’s main purpose will be to keep the symmetry in the character select screen.lol

106

I obviously played Yang in AE and these nerfs are not ‘too much’. This thread saddens me :[

107

These games are def being deaded way too fast. Less then a year and it’s happened almost three times already. I guess as long as there’s a market and some type of money to be made they will keep churning out updates and “balance changes”

108

Is there any way we can truly give feedback and let them know these changes are ridiculous?

109

this just in, yangs stun value is changed to 950 in the new patch. things keep getting better and better for yang doesnt it?

maybe because hes still leagues better than he was in 3s?

110

He’s better than 3s Yang for sure even with the nerfs. How much, I’m not sure… probably not by much since 3s Yang is an incredibly good character anyway. Off topic.

111

http://nsa27.casimages.com/img/2011/08/26/110826090343739968.jpg

112

I just hope Nemo, Sako, and Ojisan still stick to Yang. It’s way too fun watching there game-play. Heck, I learned everything from them.

113

With the way others are getting buffed up, I really have my doubts.

Wonder where they are going to go after this shit.

Hopefully they can smack capcom around a bit and tell them this shit is stupid. Were they there at the testing event?

114

I agree with you hav. why the fuck did he have to get such a harsh nerf? We were just all figuring out the potential of yang and now capcom decides to essentially break his back. Some nerfs, like palm and even command throw shoulda been nerf. Hell i don’t mind dive kick being nerfed, but nerfing standing short?! WHY? because yang can’t have a 3 frame poke?! Cause he already has one in cr.lk?? Also, i hate how they destroyed u2 effectiveness, +3 more frames of start up?! Might as well take away his movement, shit. If they were going to harshly nerf him like they did, they should at least give him 950 hp! We all know this is a crime to the character, it’s only because he’s a twin, plain and simple. Maybe they’ll reconsider some of these nerfs.

115

Dude, we are in the same boat, why are you so tight? I spent months mastering this character too and you dissing me, couse i try to stay positive in this “dark days”? Yes, he is still solid, 'couse he still has the majority of his tools. Why do you want to convince yourself that he is done? Who knows whats gonna happen after the location tests? You bury the character and you wanna abandon it at the first sight of trouble when you didn’t even played the new version of it, and i am the scrub?

116

Ibuki seems really good in 2012 imo, Sako and Acqua will probably go back to her.
And Nemo will probably stick to Chun again because she isn’t that bad either in that game it seems.
I hate Capcom, if you compare the nerfs from the twins to Fei, its just laughable.

117

yea, my bad. i didn’t mean to direct my salt towards other yang users. it’s like you said, we’re in the same boat. our only hope atm is feedback from the loctests. until then, i’m gonna live it up with yang while he is still very, very, very good.

but damn man, now i know how guile users felt when he was raped from super to ae. this shit sucks man.

118

You guys are blowing my mind here -

With hard numbers, like the damage reductions, someone show me exactly why Yang is so terrible. Show me that the 10 damage nerf on low short, the 30 damage nerf on the Ultras, the etc. will make Yang one of the worst characters in the game.

Across the board, the damage has been nerfed. This means that he’ll require a couple more touches to kill someone. I’m not talking about abstract shit like what move will punish Yang if whiffs his new 2-frame-laggier- divekick, or how hard his crossup might be to land now. I’m talking about actual numbers. You can all see the list, just tell me how -huge- of a damage reduction Yang is going to get from all this.

I’ve already made several posts about this, explaining the tools he still has [as well as the tools he has lost, which is several, to be honest] and everyone seems to be skirting around the facts I’ve put down. I’m not looking for opinions here. I’m not looking to have someone compare how ‘badly’ Yang got nerfed in comparison to everyone else. I’m looking for someone to back up their idea that the damage reduction on Yang is huge, and that he shouldn’t have it, etc.

Face it, Yang on paper and in practice was -incredible-. S.short was retarded, seiei enbu [situational as it was] was retarded, even his ambiguous crossup setups are kind of retarded. Yang was -retarded-. He was so good that he made a lot of people look incredibly badass for knowing a few combos or setups. When your character makes you look good, that tells you something [myself included].

So now, someone show me the math. I’m pretty sure that damage scaling would render much of these damage nerfs inconsequential, but then again I may be doing the math wrong. Anyone?

119

I love the fucking tards that come into this thread talking about how twin player’s “tears” taste so good. The twins getting nerfed won’t make you any less shitty.

120

Fine, I’ll bite. Let’s start with damage, which you seem to focus on. cr.lk x3 xx HP Rekkas will do 147 damage (does 185 now). 139 if you end with LP Rekkas for better positioning (changes list only 60 damage for FP, I’m assuming the 5 damage increments remain the same). This gives Yang the least damage of the entire cast on his BnB. I won’t go as far as to do the calculations for FADCs into his ultras, because I’m not sure how the hits would count, but between those nerfs already in effect on the BnB and the reductions to the Ultra themselves, I’d be surprised to see it break the 300 mark or even the 250 mark (currently does U1 does 347, U2 does 321).

A 25% decrease on his bnb damage. I hardly call that damage inconsequential.

New extra frames of U2 won’t allow you to combo after a MP Palm FADC, which, if my 300~damage deduction for his combo into Ultra is correct, he’s not only the lowest damaging character in the game, but has also the least damaging combo into ultra, behind even Ryu.

Let’s take a peek at punishes too! Currently, his go to option of s.hp xx HP Rekkas does laughable 210 damage. s.mp, cr.mk xx HP Rekkas does 268. The former will do 196 damage in 2k12 and the latter 241. 196 if you don’t want to risk the 1 frame link! That means that Ken’s and Fei Long’s mashing that DP during your non chainnable cr.lks and now more frame disadvantageous dive kicks are only gambling on 6 damage! Oh wait, they have 1k health to Yang’s 900, now that’s some good risk reward. Find me a character that does less damage on a completely free punish combo.

And there’s more. Let’s not forget that Yang is blessed by having his bnb ender scaling his combo 3 times further. We all know that as the health bar depletes the opponent gets natural damage reduction, starting at 75% in the worst case scenario. This means that his combos will end up doing 110 damage at the end of the round!

Oh and Senei enbu…Currently, a full cr.mp, cr.lk loop starting of cl.hp xx MP Palm does 381 damage. I’d say 90% of the supers in this game alone do 350. There might be a few that do 300. This means now you either have to risk going for a reset to get as much damage as every other super in the game or simply nail the loop down for 75% of the damage other characters get.

I’m sure all these damage nerfs mean nothing to you, because you’ll just find your way in another 2-3 times. After all, you have been freely divekicking and rollkicking FADC your way in with no problem, right? Week 1 twins when people are dumb enough to not simply jab your rollkick is really fun!

I was gonna delve deeper than mere damage numbers, but whatever. I wish luck to whoever sticks to Yang.