after this, you really just need to stfu and stop commenting. and what fucking world is yang solid in after these fucking nerfs? nobody but your stupid ass is convinced that yang is solid. and you felt dirty for punishing an nj from almost full screen? wtf kind of scrubby shit is that? if anything you just taught those guys not to jump.
Yang has been killed.
He’s not going to be competitive anymore, because Capcom is not able to take good decisions for balancing a single character.
Most of nerfs on him are stupid and unjustified, he was a little too good, and now a lot too bad.
I can’t deal with those nerfs, nobody can say “the nerfs are ok”, RIP Yang and thank you Capcom.
its the same way i feel about yun, i admit he was ridiculous in some ways but now i just cant see how he will even be competitive. and the people who are sayin the nerfs are fine an justified can only say that because they dont use yun or yang so dont even understand how there gameplay is hurt. yuns dragon kicks now have more recovery and people are saying its fine because he cant mash it out now…like it was such a good wakeup option in the first place. they dont see that his okizeme is probably crippled and it was big part of his game. capcom went overboard with yun and yang, i really hope the loketests show them this.
That list is pretty fucking long but isn’t the location later today? Let’s at least wait until we get some type of reportage from there before claiming he’s completely dead. They did nerf pretty much all his tools but I’m just trying to stay positive eh.
Ok, people seemed to have ignored my post, so:
-3 frame low normal that messes up a lot of CH setups
-actual uppercut [if the fadc being -4 sticks then stick to backdashing boohoo]
-safe slash pressure
- free, FREE offense after slash fadc. I don’t think how many of you people actually understand that once an opponent blocks a normal - you’re in. He can’t touch a button simple because he’s +6 after block.
- a divekick with good hitstun. Are you going to complain that he’s a little more negative on block now? From what the tests determined, Yang was at 0 if he hit the opponent at around the neck area ON BLOCK. 2 recovery frames would make that -2. Am I doing the math wrong here?
-far reaching s.short that’s STILL usable for the ground game. 5 frames or not, the reach on that normal is incredible. And guess what, it cancels into slash.
-retains CH setups
-still has a crossup
-EX grab still seems to have some sort of throw invul
The list goes on. Granted his damage got nerfed across the board but that’s because he’s SO FUCKING SAFE. Does anyone realize how safe this character is? You can’t focus him reliably on the ground simply because low forward -> slash beats focus. His Ultras have been nerfed 30 points.
…
30 points. That’s the damage on his original low short. That’s 10 points more damage than his new low short. That is nothing. Both ultras retain the ease of comboing into them as before [except now you can’t do low jab link into U2, boohoo].
Rolling kicks losing their projectile invincibility sucks. Those’re my thoughts on that. Edit: At least there are still EX rolling kicks available.
Command grab slower and less range, ok find trickier setups? Here’s a setup that most of you probably didn’t know and probably never used:
c.jab -> s.jab into
- EX grab
- low short
Guess what that does? 2 beats jumping and backdashing. EX grab beats throws and jabs and blocking. Airtight setup. And it’s gone now. T_______T
The palm adjustment of course was going to happen. Palm stayed out there way too long and did too much damage for how long that move was active. Many characters can’t punish full screen palm and so Yang gets to whiff a special that built incredible meter and randomly CH people trying to stop him. Palm was bullshit.
And also realize s.short was bullshit too. I’d say they should have made it 4 frame rather than 5, but that’s how shit is now. How often did most of you , and I’m asking for you all to be honest here, play a legit ground game with this character? I’m pretty sure that most of you did not, and that most of you jumped and divekicked your way in. And because of that I’m sure most of you will never know the difference.
Seriously, most people didn’t even use a lot of the actual bullshit he had available to him, why miss it?
Yep, Yang got nerfed pretty hard. Of course he’s worse, but the way everyone is being so drama-queen about it is pretty sad.
Edit: Also, people need to stop being so fanboy/crybaby/drama queen about all of this. Think about it logically and compare to see what tools he STILL has. Wow.
Keep in mind I’m going based on what I see from the developer blog. And with that said, I still see Yang being a solid character. If there are any other more major changes that are to be discovered, then I could be entirely wrong. But again I [as well as all of you] are basing your comments/bitching about the blog.
Honestly son, you need to pipe the fuck down and start rationalizing. Everywhere you go you come with an avalanche of sodium and make it rain Mortons regarding these nerfs. I understand you’re pissed, sure these nerfs are largely unwarranted, but how about you just take a god damn breather? No need to lash out at people for trying to be optimistic.
And before you try to start shit- I play Yang as well.
naa i’m not gonna start shit. you’re right. i’ve been going on an rampage since i saw those changes. but honestly, some of the posters deserved the lashing. but on the real, you right my nigga. i’m just gonna keep it 100 and be silent for now. ain’t much i can do but deal with it.
Word, same here man. Just keep it cool. Wait and bleed I guess.
I hope that Capcom is just as willing to revert some nerfs as they were willing to give us those nerfs. I thought they were all in favor for a ***fun game that’s also balanced, not a balanced game that happens to be fun. ***Call me an idiot but I honestly think there’s a chance Capcom will revert some nerfs.
We just need to scream hard enough- just like the people wanting those nerfs.
brb sending Ono deaththreats
God I hate the majority of Cammy players
Good heavens. I thought Sagat got ripped apart from Vanilla to Super, but this…
This is the motherfucking limit, holy fucking shit.
Trollono: “Hey guys, EX Rekkas is a true blockstring now!”.
Yang players: "But it’s -13 on block."
Trollono: “Teehee”.
must not cry…:sad:
<goes to the akuma forums> Ah, I feel better already. :badboy:
Stay tuned, it is not over:
Yang
• Stun changed to 950, down from 1,000.
I am kinda upset about what I saw and I only started playing him last week… well I guess I will still play him and hope that the stuff that I was doing wasn’t affected to much … not that it was amazing or anything … and i was Using Ultra 1 any way so … whatevs…
Thank you
People that complain about his nerfs calling them “unjustified” or saying that he wasn’t THAT good to begin with, simply sucked with the character. Real Talk.
America is light-years behind in Yang technology, so we really can’t truly comprehend how God-damned good this character is. Most Japanese players consider Yang to be the better twin, yet there was NO Yang in top 32 at Evo… This just shows you how experienced we are with the character.
You guys shouldn’t dismiss how good he is in the current build. These nerfs don’t outright kill him, they just make him fair. I still see him being solid, it’s just going to take actual work. The fact that you can’t herp your way to victory doesn’t mean the character is bad.
I’m not gonna get into why or how the character will still be solid, just read De4dEyE’s post, he makes really good points.
Please.
Everyone talks about Japan, like he’s really winning over there. There are 3 Yangs that qualified for SBO from Japan. That’s not some wild number. Yun has 6 qualified… Sagat has 4. Bison has 3.
Show me a significant tournament in US or Japan where Yang made a great showing. Whenever anyone says shit about Yang, it’s all theory fighter. Oh… he can do this, he can do that… great… he can also get fucked up, and it seems like that happens way more often than not.
People love to bring up the argument that some players think Yang is the better twin… OK… great. I used to think that too, but think all you want; Yun is winning. Yang isn’t.
I’m not saying Yang is bad, by any means… but the idea that he is overpowered in AE is crazy to me. Yeah… he’s got a LOT of shit… and if you wanna take away something for 2012, in fear of what he might become… go ahead. Nerfing every single thing, including shit that already was only kinda useful, at best… come on.
Yeah, he’s still gonna be viable in 2012. A lot of what he had is still very good, but when you pretty much leave Viper, Fei, Ken and Sagat completely intact, I don’t see how you lessen the effectiveness of EVERYTHING Yang has, when he is definitely not on another level from those characters.
EDIT- Maybe it all just comes down to design philosophy. I like GOOD characters, and I don’t feel like the SF4 series has had a lot of them. SF4 has a load of fairly shitty characters, with a few complete characters sprinkled in. I was somewhat excited for the idea of 2012, since Ono said he was looking to improve characters, for balance’s sake, rather than nerf to achieve balance. My excitement was definitely tepid, and it’s because I didn’t really believe him, and I see I was right.
Is Yang still going to be effective in 2012, definitely… but he’s not going to be a complete, interesting character anymore. He’s losing dimensions to his game, and to me, that sucks.
EDIT2- Capcom just needs to rerelease CvS2 so I can have my good characters, and be done with this shit.
EDIT3- LOL @ Stun nerf… since we all know Yang is a tank in AE.
None of the japanese tier lists listed Yang as the superior twin. He was always one tier below Fei and Yun, paired with Ken, Viper, Akuma, etc.
My problem is not with the nerfs per se, but how he got hit harder, much harder then both Yun and Fei. Yun will still bnb you to 250+ damage and around 400 stun. How much will Yang do now? Maybe 120 damage and 200 stun? He got nerfs to his divekick, which was already worse, got nerfs to damage and stun, which were already worse, got nerfs to his normals, which were already worse. Have you seen the hitbox on Yun’s s.mp? His cr.mp? How about his s.lk that any half decent Yun player also uses to buffer lp lunge? They made his senkyuutai FADC -4 on block so he obviously couldn’t roll and FADC his way in, yet Yun kept the same option for one bar, at -1 he’s still safe.
The only changes I agree with are palm and his senkyuutais, because they completely nullified projectiles. Now you at least need to spend a bar or guess in advance.
End of discussion.
The fact that Yun is winning doesn’t imply that he’s better, it means that there are better players using him.
Yun is by far easier to learn than Yang, which again, means that more people are going to use him over Yang. Now, I’ve talked with a couple top players, including Japanese at Evo (meaning I’m not just basing this off my opinion, but a wide opinion in general) and they all agree that Yang has so much untapped potential, while Yun doesn’t. Yun is simple, yet effective, but moving beyond that there isn’t any more to him… He just has a couple really simple tools that fuck you up.
Yang, on the other hand, has multiple, complex tools that require time to master. He has unblockable setups on most of the cast but I’ve only seen like 2 Yang’s ever use them… His offense is by far the safest out of any character in the game… period. His actual footsies rank up there with the best… The fact that he has really solid normals, with a fast start-up (3 frames st.short?? Really??) and great properties, a dive kick, and safe rekka pressure, is more than enough to overwhelm most characters easily. Oh, and all this shit is safe, and I’m just talking about his footsies right now, I’m not even mentioning his extremely FREE offense and multiple ambiguous mix-ups that lead back into itself.
Yang reminds me of Viper in the early stages of Vanilla, where Japanese would think highly of this character, while we looked at her and just saw someone with bad pokes and a OK mixup. Viper wouldn’t win shit in Japan either, but they still though highly of her and saw this crazy potential that was still untapped. A year later, the bitch wins SBO.
This isn’t theory fighting, I’ve actually played against the best Yang’s in America/Australia, and talked to people that actually play against Japanese Yang’s or actually main him, and the feeling is mutual… The character is good…probably too good. Again, these are opinions from players that carry more credentials than anyone posting here, free. I’d be damned if a bunch of SRKrs or NAH’s dismiss their opinion as inferior, just because of their own, most likely limited experience.
But then again, this is SRK… w/e though, either you guys can continue bitching and whining, or keep on playing the character that you enjoy and just move on past those nerfs, since your character still looks viable.
Problem is, he was cut down before the game essentially even matured, and this is not just an issue with Yang.
So much shit in AE will essentially be unexplored/unnoticed.
As for Otori, almost any tier list/ranking I have seen from Japan has Yang in S Tier with Yun and Fei.
Dunno what you were looking at.
True, the game is dying without ever reaching a matured state.
There is nothing we can do about this though, and I feel it’s a better option to kill off a flawed game and replace it with something more playable early in its cycle, than continue playing a game that uses a outdated philosophy when it comes to balance.