Well now, I see this thread has taken a terrible turn for the worse since I last visited 
Ok, lets put a different spin on it.
I WISH THE NEXT KOF:MI WAS 2.5D WITH GRAPHICS LIKE THE PS3 NARUTO GAME.
There. Noones touching your precious 2d. Instead, I want MI to play EXACTLY like a 2D kof, but with nice celshaded anime style 3D graphics.
But why would people wanna play a 2d kof with 3d graphics when there are already 2d kofs with 2d graphics. MIRA does things different with the sousai and sidesetp systems to give it its own identiy, but if u want a kof98 with 3d graphics, just suck it up and playâŚ98?
I like nice graphics. I like classic KOF gameplay. But I also like a huge cast, lots of moves, costumes, and other extras, plus hi res and smooth animation. Only 3D can offer all of that simultaneously.
god lord :rolleyes:
looks at 98, 2k,2k1,2k2,2k2um especially,neowave,xi
Nokato:
> So basically to stay afloat, SNK should make a shitty looking game to appease people who donât have taste.
Your problem here is the concept of âshittyâ. Whatâs shitty to YOU might not be (and in the case of SFIV, not at all) shitty to others. If the majority of people playing a game love the way it looks, and a minority donât, itâs up to the company which group is more important to them. But you have to face facts: If SNK is a business - and last I checked, it was - itâs primary purpose is to make money, and thus it needs to do what it has to to make money. If SNKâs decisions prevent the company from making as much money as it can, even if you support those decisions, then they will eventually go bankrupt (again) and there will be no more SNK games.
> Good job. People like games that companies put less effort intoâŚthatâs retarded. People just hate on 2-D in this country because you canât see every poreâŚ
Why does making a 3D game automatically mean âless effortâ? 3D is generally more efficient in the long run, but the overall level of effort required isnât less. Unless you think that Tekken VI required just as much programming effort as Tekken 1, or Street Fighter IV as SFEX1, or Final Fantasy XIII as Final Fantasy VII, etc.
If anything, I would say that KoFXII is a wasted effort. Why should I give you props simply because you take 4 months and a whole team to make one character? Sure, the end result looks great, but itâs not so great that it blows me away, and you could have probably done it another method that looks almost as good wasnât anywhere near as time consuming.
> And yeah, I negged you because I fucking could.
Yes. Because youâre a bitchcunt.
> And donât fucking get angry with me because I donât agree with you. Iâm not gonna happily accept a game looking like shit just because it will âsaveâ them in the long run. Third Strike is a beautiful looking game and people are TOO FUCKING STUPID to appreciate it because oh it doesnât look like a shitty 3-D game.
Third Strike is indeed a beautiful game. It also failed, though itâs arguable that it was just running off the failure momentum of its predecessors. But donât forget: The OG hardcore didnât like SF3 either (and many of them still donât, and would rather play ST instead - whatâs your excuse there?) and, moreover, other 2D series like Marvel games and Alpha games did much, much better, so youâre wasting your time by bringing this up.
> SF4 is successful because it was shoved down everyoneâs throats. Its proves that a game could be incredibly shitty but if you hype it up enough people will fucking buy it.
You actually donât have a point here, because almost no game sells big numbers entirely on its own merit. This was actually proved long ago. Itâs the entire reason why the MK series has sold as much as it has. This is true regardless of the quality of the game. Itâs about fucking time Capcom learned it. Maybe SNK will too one day.
[butthurt 3S apologist crap deleted - no one cares]
> KOFXII looks great, but because its not 3-D people are fucking retarded and donât want to try it. Its also the fact the people act like they have to be fucking spoonfed every fucking goddamn thing that they could ever want so if its not plastered all over a fucking Gamestop window they donât think it exists.
You can rail against windmills all you want, but if thatâs the reality of the situation (and Iâm not disagreeing with you here, BTW), then SNK is even more retarded for spending vast sums of money on a project that is doomed to failure out the starting gate. Maybe they think theyâll make their money eventually like Capcom eventually did, but they have to be aware of the fact that KoFXII, as is, is going to get hammered on all fronts.
> Because SF4 was put in everyoneâs face they think it is the greatest goddamned game in the motherfucking world and it clearly isnât. KOFXII is a fine game that people will miss out on because it doesnât look like Kratos will be downloadable.
I could say the same thing about any number of games, but whatever.
> The only fucks that have been whining about KOFXII have been Americans complaining that it doesnât look like every other shitty American game that they fucking play.
So tell me: Why arenât the JPN playing it then? Why did Famitsu give it 5,5,7,5? Did Famitsu hire Americans when no one was looking? Is there a contingent of American thugs (Shady Negros?) hanging out in JPN arcades preventing players from playing KoFXII?
> You have a problem with me because I donât choose to just let people shit on things that are goodâsimply because its the trend on this forum. Its not ok for me to express my opinion but its perfectly ok for you disrespect me because you like SF4âŚok.
I donât disrespect you because you disagree with me or even because you donât like SFIV. I disrespect you because youâre a tool whoâs not worthy of respect. Thereâs plenty of SFIV hate to go around, here and in other forums I visit. The only reason I jumped into this particular thread was to not let you off the hook for trying to rewrite history with your dumbshit behaviour.
> If I was all for SF4 and hated KOFXII, you wouldnât have a problem with me.
Actually, Iâd probably be hugely indifferent. Despite the online glitches that still plague me and the horribly inconsistent art, HDR > SFIV. Iâm still waiting to get my hands on BB as well.
On this note, Iâd also be hugely indifferent to you if you had shut the fuck up the first 189712387 times you posted how much you hated SFIVâs look. Newâs flash: I donât hate KoFXII. I actually donât give a shit about KoFXII. I donât give a shit about any KoF, because Iâm not a KoF fan. In terms of SNK, Iâm a huge Samurai Shodown fan, and Iâd be all over a HD SS in a heartbeat (SSSen is absolute garbage, which I predicted from the moment I first saw it, only confirmed by just about everyone who played it). HOWEVER, I would also be worried, because I would have the wherewithal to know that an HD SS, while extremely appealing to me, would probably be a very bad idea for SNKâs bottomline, which would probably mean no more SS games. Very few KoF fans seem to be thinking along these lines though. I find it to be rather selfish and myopic, but eh.
I honestly thought this thread was over but looks like it still going.
*Your problem here is the concept of âshittyâ. Whatâs shitty to YOU might not be (and in the case of SFIV, not at all) shitty to others. If the majority of people playing a game love the way it looks, and a minority donât, itâs up to the company which group is more important to them. But you have to face facts: If SNK is a business - and last I checked, it was - itâs primary purpose is to make money, and thus it needs to do what it has to to make money. If SNKâs decisions prevent the company from making as much money as it can, even if you support those decisions, then they will eventually go bankrupt (again) and there will be no more SNK games.
*
**So again, essentially, buying into the American market meansâdumbing down the aesthetics to appease them as opposed to staying true to their roots (SF4). You are still confirming that for some reason people respond more to an ugly game JUST BECAUSE its 3-D; because simply put thatâs the only thing people in the country respond to: big, shiny, things no matter how fucked up they just might be, and that somehow something is wrong with ME because I like things that look better (KOFXII, 3s, Blazblue, or any other CPS2 game that has come out prior)
Visual aesthetics should be just as important as competitive gameplay aspectsâjust because someone appreciates art shouldnât mean that somethings wrong with them.
**
*Why does making a 3D game automatically mean âless effortâ? 3D is generally more efficient in the long run, but the overall level of effort required isnât less. Unless you think that Tekken VI required just as much programming effort as Tekken 1, or Street Fighter IV as SFEX1, or Final Fantasy XIII as Final Fantasy VII, etc.
If anything, I would say that KoFXII is a wasted effort. Why should I give you props simply because you take 4 months and a whole team to make one character? Sure, the end result looks great, but itâs not so great that it blows me away, and you could have probably done it another method that looks almost as good wasnât anywhere near as time consuming. *
**So KOFXII is a wasted effort because its hand-drawn (which looks better) and because people are too stupid to appreciate it in this countryâŚwow. A better looking game gets punished because people are brainwashed to like shitty things. 3-D is usually cheaper, easier to produce and allows for deadlines to be met faster in some cases. Somehow, SF4 wasnât able to have that luxury and the game still looks like complete and utter shit. For anyone to say that SF4 looks better than 3s simply means they donât have eyes or are just predisposed to liking shitty art. Again, if people can hate on anything anime inspired on this goddamned site I have every right to defend something that I like out of preference as well. It is what it is.
Youâre not giving props for it taking longer, someone should give it props because they didnât wait on hand and foot for people who donât even appreciate the games that came before and nor do they even really appreciate SFâthey are just GLAD that it fits in with the rest of the other shitty games that most people play.
**
*Yes. Because youâre a bitchcunt. *
**Iâm a bitchcunt because, I donât agree with Ultima and I donât like SF4 graphically, or rather Iâm not giving into the Nazi-esque regime of liking the game because there is a â4â in the titleâand because I donât like a game because Jessica Chobot or Adam Sessler tells me to. Youâre just as much of a âbitchcuntâ as I am because we both donât agree with each other and it brings out irritation on both sides.
**
*Third Strike is indeed a beautiful game. It also failed, though itâs arguable that it was just running off the failure momentum of its predecessors. But donât forget: The OG hardcore didnât like SF3 either (and many of them still donât, and would rather play ST instead - whatâs your excuse there?) and, moreover, other 2D series like Marvel games and Alpha games did much, much better, so youâre wasting your time by bringing this up.
*
**Its also because no one in the States really wanted the changes that 3s brought and it was later that the US got inspired to play the game. It was still a shame that people overlooked the 2-D mastery that the game was simply becauseâŚit wasnât like SF2.
As I said before, this country ALWAYS shits on anything that isnât American because companies donât like when someone points out shit that they donât/canât do. Thatâs where all of this bullshit comes from in the first placeâand a viral trend starts to hate on everything that is not Uncharted, or God of War.
**
You actually donât have a point here, because almost no game sells big numbers entirely on its own merit. This was actually proved long ago. Itâs the entire reason why the MK series has sold as much as it has. This is true regardless of the quality of the game. Itâs about fucking time Capcom learned it. Maybe SNK will too one day.
**So Capcom should make shitty games and shove them in peopleâs facesâdisregarding any artistic integrity for the dollars in the States? You know, when people do create something they usually want to be proud of what they makeâoh wait thats companies that donât exist in the United States for the most part, sorry. Capcom USA owns the rights to SF IP right now, remember?
Iâm so glad that you feel that companies should cater to stupid people who donât know what good art isâŚbecause everything will be ugly, everyone will feel included and American companies wonât have to work hard. Yay. **
[butthurt 3S apologist crap deleted - no one cares]
**Exactly, because its all about shitty thingsâŚyep.
**
*You can rail against windmills all you want, but if thatâs the reality of the situation (and Iâm not disagreeing with you here, BTW), then SNK is even more retarded for spending vast sums of money on a project that is doomed to failure out the starting gate. Maybe they think theyâll make their money eventually like Capcom eventually did, but they have to be aware of the fact that KoFXII, as is, is going to get hammered on all fronts. *
**So in other words, your reiterating the point that right now, shitty looking games are selling because 2-D isnât even in the equation of the current generation of gamers. IMO, its a sad state affairs and as someone who appreciates 2-D art it enrages me to see people shit on something that is good. With that being said, yeah I came in this thread angry as fuck, just like I did in the SF4 threadâam I justifying my tonality? Nope, I just wanted to express my opinion and I was tired of the constant slander of products that were better in my opinion and others.
Its a shame that people donât appreciate hand-drawn artâit just is.**
*
I could say the same thing about any number of games, but whatever. **
**Youâre absolutely rightâyou very well could. No point in arguing it.
**
*So tell me: Why arenât the JPN playing it then? Why did Famitsu give it 5,5,7,5? Did Famitsu hire Americans when no one was looking? Is there a contingent of American thugs (Shady Negros??) hanging out in JPN arcades preventing players from playing KoFXII?
*
**There very well could be. All jokes aside, I wasnât aware that it wasnât well recieved in Japan either. That aspect is new news to me, and its something that I have to consider in terms of how I base my opinion. Iâm dumbfounded that Japan isnât receptive to it since it looks great but, oh wellâshit happens. Even my rage about it isnât going to solve anything. Iâm just dissappointed that the game isnât being recieved well and it means more shitty 3-D games are on the way.
**
*I donât disrespect you because you disagree with me or even because you donât like SFIV. I disrespect you because youâre a tool whoâs not worthy of respect. Thereâs plenty of SFIV hate to go around, here and in other forums I visit. The only reason I jumped into this particular thread was to not let you off the hook for trying to rewrite history with your dumbshit behaviour.
*
**Iâll admit my behavior in the SF4 threads was uncalled for, no matter how much passion I might have had about them. In terms of rewriting history, that wasnât my intention I just really hate hearing so many bad things about KOFXII, besides the online being terrible. Me being a tool, is a bit of a harsh comment butâI canât really put up anything to combat someoone thinking that way because when I get passionate about a topic, I donât have much concern for other peopleâs opinion unless they agree. So if you think Iâm a tool, fine.
**
Actually, Iâd probably be hugely indifferent. Despite the online glitches that still plague me and the horribly inconsistent art, HDR > SFIV. Iâm still waiting to get my hands on BB as well.
Blazblue is a beautiful game and I recommend that game to anyone for various reasons.
On this note, Iâd also be hugely indifferent to you if you had shut the fuck up the first 189712387 times you posted how much you hated SFIVâs look. Newâs flash: I donât hate KoFXII. I actually donât give a shit about KoFXII. I donât give a shit about any KoF, because Iâm not a KoF fan. In terms of SNK, Iâm a huge Samurai Shodown fan, and Iâd be all over a HD SS in a heartbeat (SSSen is absolute garbage, which I predicted from the moment I first saw it, only confirmed by just about everyone who played it). HOWEVER, I would also be worried, because I would have the wherewithal to know that an HD SS, while extremely appealing to me, would probably be a very bad idea for SNKâs bottomline, which would probably mean no more SS games. Very few KoF fans seem to be thinking along these lines though. I find it to be rather selfish and myopic, but eh.
**Me âshutting the fuck upâ after the first few posts wouldâve been in my best interestâbut I clearly didnât do that at the time and I didnât feel that I shouldâve. Do I regret that? Yeahâbecause it served no pointâŚno matter what I said everyone has a right to an opinion and it didnât need to be imposed upon on either side. So yeah, in retrospect in the SF4 thread, I was an unreasonable dick and I can admit that.
From a marketing aspect (which no matter what, is the important aspect from a business perspective) youâre correct. Iâm a 2-D enthusiast and I just hate the state of the industry on an international scale. I feel that companies have to cater to the larger continent with more money and parallels to the visual entertainment industryâsome Yoshinori Ono said heâd been eyeing himself. I miss the days when Noritaka Funamizu and Okamoto were at Capcom and CPS2/3 boards were still being used.
Seeing games that I think would be better in 2-D than 3-D being held so highly just doesnât strike a proper chord with me but its the reality of the industry. I donât agree with it so sometimes I get angry and stand on my own opinions which I right to within reason.
Its obvious Iâve calmed down from the previous posts, but I know how SRK is so that means, youâve won Ultima.
I still play KOFXII with the 3 people who still play it online, regardless. That and Blazblue.**
I still stand by my own opinionsâsans the aspect of Japan not recieving KOFXII very wellâbut obviously 2-D isnât whats in with gamers, and its disheartening that a beautiful is depreciated by the current generation of gamers. Opinions are opinions so, eh. And as someone who draws comics, seeing something drawn so well not be appreciated is bound to make people like me angryâbut this is a fighting game forum. It just seemed like with earlier games people still appreciated the art to a degree.
I think you guys should settle this grudge match in a set of KOF12 and SF4.
Nokato, hey i feel you man⌠i really hate this everything must be 3D turn the industry took long agoâŚbut i guess the only good part is, we can appreciate the few 2D games more now.
If thats possible Iâd be down for that. Should be fun.
Just enjoy the game for what it is, and just understand that youâre in the minority. Me? Personally I would love all games to be 2d. I like them. I like them in 2.5d and 3d as well.
That makes me, in the end, a winner⌠because I get to enjoy a grand variety of media for what it is while youâre stuck looking at perhaps 1-3 games this year. 
But thatâs ok, because in the end, itâs the gameplay that matters.
As long as 2d gameplay can be done with 3d fighters, then I will always be happy. This is why I bought KOFXII despite the fact it wonât sell well and the online sucked and none of my friends will buy it (Oh, and they didnât buy it because itâs KOF, not because itâs 2d. They all own Blazblue.)
SNK hurt themselves a long, long time ago by not caring for the console market and basically not understanding the console market. The barebones of this game is self evident. This is a company used to porting to an arcade machine that could be played at home. This KOF is no different than switching your KOF98 cart for the Neogeo from Arcade to Console. Hell, actually itâs a bit extra⌠itâs got a training mode on it!
You canât keep blaming this crap on American sensibilities. Even Japan ignored the game. You can count the number of located KOFXII machines in Japan with your available fingers, you wonât even have to use your toes, I promise! You need to look deeper than just the graphics or youâre no better than the 3d whores. Thereâs more to it than that, but this is a moot point.
Weâre arguing about artistic appreciation here, and that my friends is a path to nowhere. In the meantime, letâs all agree on one thing, weâre gamers⌠and as long as games continue to push the envelope both in 3d and in 2d while not ignoring the key fundemental: gameplay, we all win in the end. If thatâs not enough for you, hereâs a fucking tissue. Because youâre not going to enjoy the future of gaming at your pace.
I approve of this message.
Believe it or not folks, I think weâre winding down!
Nokato:
Note Iâm replying to stuff as Iâm reading it. Donât worry, compared to our last few exchanges, this is downright civil. 
> So again, essentially, buying into the American market meansâdumbing down the aesthetics to appease them as opposed to staying true to their roots (SF4).
WHY does going 3D automatically mean that theyâre âdumbing down the aestheticsâ? That is a false premise and discolours everything else youâre opining about.
Query: Are you saying itâs impossible to create a 3D game that looks good to you?
Me, I prefer 2D over 3D in general; I was impressed by Virtua Fighter 3, but not enough to play it. The only 3D game that made me go âWow, that looks so good I need to play that!â was DoA2, which curbstomped every other game visually at the time (onpy played it for 2 weeks before it got old). I was also really, really impressed by the Soul Calibur on Dreamcast, I wasnât interested in its engine. Thatâs about it though. 2D art > *.
However, weâve reached a level where 3D can produce graphics that do a a sufficiently good of mimicking 2D that I donât hate them (Arc System Works showed the way with Battle Fantasia), and some games are amazing to watch (Ps3 Naruto, for example). I think SFIV and TvC also really good looking, even fantastic at times (SFIV does animate a little awkwardly at times), though I can still see lots of room for improvement. I really wish they had used Kinuâs clean SF3 full body artwork as a base rather than Ikeno.
Would I have preferred if SFIV and TvC they were hand drawn? Absolutely. Because I love 2D artwork (I draw myself BTW, though Iâm fucking terrible). But I would also think Capcom would have been fucking crazy to do it, because it would have been a financial dead end.
> Visual aesthetics should be just as important as competitive gameplay aspectsâjust because someone appreciates art shouldnât mean that somethings wrong with them.
I agree. But I canât ignore the business aspect of these things, and thus, one has to accept that a certain visual style that makes the most sense financially might not be what one would ultimately prefer.
> So KOFXII is a wasted effort because its hand-drawn (which looks better) and because people are too stupid to appreciate it in this countryâŚwow. A better looking game [snip]
Two things:
KoFXII looks better to you. It might even look better to me. Iâm 100% positive that it does not look better to the majority of fighting game players, and definitely not for the non-fighting game crowd. At a distance and to the untrained eye, KoFXII barely looks better than its predecessors, while SFIV is a noticeable leap in quality. You may not like it, but this is reality.
KoFXII isnât a wasted effort because itâs hand drawn. Or rather, not simply because itâs hand drawn. If KoFXII was just like KoFXI with a few more characters, I wouldnât call it a wasted effort. I call it a wasted effort because theyâve been working on it for 4 years, and have produced a cast thatâs smaller than KoF94, has no boss, no storyline (it should logically have finished Ashâs saga), no special intros, and other assorted shit that KoF is known for. They could have made 2 regular KoFs using the old recycled sprites, or about 3 new MI games in that time. Now if KoFXII makes more money than 2 regular recycle-sprite KoFs or 3 MI KoFs, maybe then it would have been worth it but, as I have stated since I first learned how ridiculously long they were taking with the project, that KoFXII is hardly likely to do much better than its predecessors in terms of sales, and in terms of profit itâs likely going to take a massive hit just because it cost so much.
As I said, maybe they think theyâll make back their money in 5 years time like Capcom did with SF3. But Capcom didnât like how that turned out, so Iâd be surprised if SNK is happy with such a gameplan.
[stuff about railing against SFIVâs looks deleted - we get the point]
> Youâre not giving props for it taking longer, someone should give it props because they didnât wait on hand and foot for people who donât even appreciate the games that came before and nor do they even really appreciate SFâthey are just GLAD that it fits in with the rest of the other shitty games that most people play.
So if someone else comes out and takes 10 years to make a fighter, should I give them props just for that? Donât forget, I think the final product in KoFXII looks great, but not enough to convince me to play the game. Garou did a much better job with a lot less.
> I donât agree with Ultima and I donât like SF4 graphically, or rather Iâm not giving into the Nazi-esque regime of liking the game because there is a â4â in the titleâand because I donât like a game because Jessica Chobot or Adam Sessler tells me to.
More railing at windmills.
> Its also because no one in the States really wanted the changes that 3s brought and it was later that the US got inspired to play the game. It was still a shame that people overlooked the 2-D mastery that the game was simply becauseâŚit wasnât like SF2.
Or perhaps they thought it played like garbage and had too many characters they didnât like and not enough of the characters they did like. Iâm pretty sure everyone thought it looked great though.
> As I said before, this country ALWAYS shits on anything that isnât American because companies donât like when someone points out shit that they donât/canât do. Thatâs where all of this bullshit comes from in the first placeâand a viral trend starts to hate on everything that is not Uncharted, or God of War.
More railing at windmills. Fact: SF3 bombed everywhere. Even in Japan, the game was not considered a success. 2I and 3S were Capcomâs last ditch efforts to salvage the hole that NG put them in. STOP TRYING TO MAKE IT SOUND LIKE THIS IS EXCLUSIVE TO AMERICA.
re: hype = sales
> So Capcom should make shitty games and shove them in peopleâs facesâdisregarding any artistic integrity for the dollars in the States? You know, when people do create something they usually want to be proud of what they makeâoh wait thats companies that donât exist in the United States for the most part, sorry. Capcom USA owns the rights to SF IP right now, remember?
Wow, this paragraphs has words in it, but they make absolutely no sense.
Iâll just state that, regardless of a gameâs quality, it needs to be hyped in order to get sales. Good games with hype = sales. Bad games with hype = sales. Good games with no hype = no sales. Bad games with no hype = no sales. So having a game shoved down peopleâs throats is irrlevent - SFIV could have been the second coming of Jesus in gaming form, but if Capcom didnât hype it, no one (aside from the hardcore) would have cared.
> Iâm so glad that you feel that companies should cater to stupid people who donât know what good art isâŚbecause everything will be ugly, everyone will feel included and American companies wonât have to work hard. Yay.
If only a tiny minority is displeased with the product because theyâre super anal pixel art lovers who automatically think "polygons = teh suckâ, then yes. And again, stop bringing âAmericaâ into this. Last I checked, 3D games sell well in Japan and Europe as well.
> So in other words, your reiterating the point that right now, shitty looking games are selling because 2-D isnât even in the equation of the current generation of gamers. IMO, its a sad state affairs and as someone who appreciates 2-D art it enrages me to see people shit on something that is good. With that being said, yeah I came in this thread angry as fuck, just like I did in the SF4 threadâam I justifying my tonality? Nope, I just wanted to express my opinion and I was tired of the constant slander of products that were better in my opinion and others.
Actually, before you came in here full of PAIN AND RAGE, no one was slandering anything. Everyone pretty much agreed that KoFXII looks great, though the OP thought it would look better (and I agree with him to an extent - the animation is uneven and the sprites arenât as hi-res as I thought they would be). About 2 or 3 other people think KoFXII could have been done differently, and most people disagreed with them. âThinking they can do betterâ != âshitting on 2D artâ. Thinking that SNK could have used a different style - one that produces results almost as pleasing (and, moreover, would be pleasing to more people, even if not to you) and allowing SNK more time to put in the features that KoF is famous for is also not slander.
> Its a shame that people donât appreciate hand-drawn artâit just is.
Yes it is.
re: KoFXII not doing well in Japan
> All jokes aside, I wasnât aware that it wasnât well recieved in Japan either. That aspect is new news to me, and its something that I have to consider in terms of how I base my opinion. Iâm dumbfounded that Japan isnât receptive to it since it looks great but, oh wellâshit happens. Even my rage about it isnât going to solve anything. Iâm just dissappointed that the game isnât being recieved well and it means more shitty 3-D games are on the way.
As big a fan of the game as you claim to be, Iâm surprised you havenât been keeping up. Itâs been dead practically since day 1. More people have been playing KoF2K2UM I believe. Iâm a bit surprised myself, but not entirely - I think thereâs too much competition, SNK havenât really promoted the game much, and they shot themselves in the foot (or perhaps it was a backup contingency in case they were expecing this) by releasing KoF2K2UM not long before.
> Iâll admit my behavior in the SF4 threads was uncalled for, no matter how much passion I might have had about them. In terms of rewriting history, that wasnât my intention I just really hate hearing so many bad things about KOFXII, besides the online being terrible. Me being a tool, is a bit of a harsh comment butâI canât really put up anything to combat someoone thinking that way because when I get passionate about a topic, I donât have much concern for other peopleâs opinion unless they agree. So if you think Iâm a tool, fine.
Okay then.
But you have to separate respectable criticism from people mindlessly shitting on the game. No doubt there are people mindlessly shitting on the game, but I wouldnât say anyone was doing that in this thread. As I said, thinking KOF could have gone a different route with KoFXIIâs graphics, or even thinking the game doesnât look as good as they expected, isnât slandering the game.
> Blazblue is a beautiful game and I recommend that game to anyone for various reasons.
I admit: I wasnât intending to get BB at this point, but the game has received so much universal praise that I gave in to hype, which is extremely rare for me. But I do like Guilty Gear XX series, so itâs not stepping too far out of bounds.
No way in hell will I ever get Tekken VI though.
> Iâm a 2-D enthusiast and I just hate the state of the industry on an international scale. I feel that companies have to cater to the larger continent with more money and parallels to the visual entertainment industryâsome Yoshinori Ono said heâd been eyeing himself. I miss the days when Noritaka Funamizu and Okamoto were at Capcom and CPS2/3 boards were still being used.
I donât disagree with any of this. Iâd love it if Capcom could make 2D games hand drawn fighters forever. But the reality of the situation makes that not only impossible but foolhardy. The road that Capcom has taken with SFIV - even if you donât like the current results - is the best method for folks like us who love 2D artwork/gameplay. Itâs a compromise, yes, but one that will eventually allow for our tastes to be satisfied and for Capcomâs financial requirements to be met. SFIV doesnât strike your fancy, but maybe SFV or SFVI will. But weâll only get SFV and SFVI is we start with (a successful) SFIV.
> I still play KOFXII with the 3 people who still play it online, regardless. That and Blazblue.
I hope by the time I get my hands on BB that people will still be playing it. 
> I still stand by my own opinionsâsans the aspect of Japan not recieving KOFXII very wellâbut obviously 2-D isnât whats in with gamers, and its disheartening that a beautiful is depreciated by the current generation of gamers. Opinions are opinions so, eh. And as someone who draws comics, seeing something drawn so well not be appreciated is bound to make people like me angryâbut this is a fighting game forum. It just seemed like with earlier games people still appreciated the art to a degree.
Well, I donât know about anyone else, but the only reason Iâm even marginally accepting of 3D now is because itâs only fairly recently that 3D has become âgood enoughâ to produce results that I like. Certainly, Iâve ragged on the likes of SFEX series and CFAS because I thought they looked like absolute garbage ([especially in comparison to everything else that was out at the time), and I even thought Rival Schools and Project Justice looked awful. And if you told me, prior to seeing Battle Fantasia, that SFIV was going to use 3D graphics I would have howled and screamed like a madman that it was doomed to failure. Certainly if Sirlinâs SF Flashback project had gotten off the ground with those terrible models I would have angry as fuck. HOWEVER, I thought Battle Fantasia looked fantastic, and I think SFIV looks good enough, so Iâm satisfied with it aesthetically and I donât think sprites are ânecessaryâ anymore. But as I said, thereâs plenty of room for improvement. Your mileage may vary.
With regards to KoFXII, the reasons I would agree with the suggestion that SNK even think about going the 2.5D route is the same reasons that I wanted Capcom to go down that route with Street Fighter: It makes more sense financially, both from a time=money aspect as well as a lowest common denominator aspect, which means that more KoF games would be likely (in a timely fashion that is) AND they would likely be more popular (you wouldnât want to play the same 3 people online ad infinitum would you?), and the graphics can only improve in the future. It wouldnât be because I think 2D art is bad or not good enough.
I just miss 2-D hand-drawn art. You made valid pointsâthereâs nothing more I can say. I honestly feel like I fight a losing battle, part of it is my fruition in how I approached the threadâI saw the thread title and went batshit. Regardless of my own (and others) love for 2-Dâit terms of games it rarely finds it way into a project and reaps financial success. I personally just hate that the current generation just doesnât get why these games are good or why the art is good. It makes me feel like people donât have eyes unless its 3-D.
Donât get me wrongâthere are 3-D games that do look impressive, but I think in terms of a fighting game thereâs still small nuances that just canât be replicatedâbut as you mentioned more or less thats part of the compromise.
I really fucking hate the âcompromiseâ that has to be implemented due to the demand and I sincerely hope that somehow that will change and people will learn to appreciate 2-D hand drawn art more and that it doesnât cause a financial catastrophe, but quite the opposite.
In terms of winding downâIâve already winded down. Iâve stated in previous posts that the rage is gone. I just wished that the âout with the oldâin with the ânewââ wasnât so rampant in the industry. Even with my workâI still draw them by hand and then scan things in PhotoshopâŚthereâs something that is just personal about feeling work so naturally that sincerity is something miss in games now.
Once KOFXII came out, I was focused on trying to learn the game that I didnât check Famitsu at allâand the only thing I was concerned about was the terrible online drama.
I still hate 2.5D for the most part, but I see how financially its a suitable choice.
Wow, a really goodhearted and mature ending to an extremely uncivil discussion. You can almost cut the love in here with a knife. :lovin:
Never wanted to disrespect Nokato over his opinion (On the opposite, I respect him for sticking to his guns), but it just got too ugly earlier for no reason. Trust me, nobody here âdislikesâ 2d artwork. We just want a bigger appreciation for KOF, if 2.5d is the answer to that, a lot of us would embrace it. That I think is the simplest form of this discussion. Nothing more, everything else we offered is mostly filler.
Personally, I was really hoping 2dâs transition to HD graphics would help it out, but apparently, thatâs just not the case. Bottom line, itâll always be the gameplay. The Nintendo DS outsells the PSP and offers more 2d gaming than 3d gaming, so itâs obviously not the medium that matters, but the games we play.
If we get a good complete KOF, with solid online and robust features, itâs hard for it not to succeed due to word of mouth and other factors. That simply was not the case with XII. Itâs hard for it to get exposure, on top of also pleasing its already robust fanbase. Itâs just an uphill fight, but I donât think 2d, 2.5d or 3d have a hand in it at all⌠just prejudice to the series and a blind love for SFIV (Like Nokato noted), and sloppy programming.
Letâs hope the future of gaming has the variety we all need to stay interested in the hobby. :3
Well again, in awnser to the thread question i do like 2D.5 but in the way SF4 was handled. After playing KOF and BB, when I went back to SF4 it just came off really ugly and generic all the suddenâŚsomething about the goofy models and floaty animation donât really mash well together.
No fucking way would I want to see KOF XII as 2.5d or 3d. Street fighter IV graphics were gargage. Why would people want every game to have the same sort of graphics anyway, are people really that fucking boring:looney:
And the civil discussion is brought to a halt by Turbo Ken. Congrats!