You’re confusing aesthetics with game mechanics. All the “enormous laser beam” is, is an increase of abilities Ryu already DOES have. Ryu has the ability to throw energy from his hands, thus a laser beam is a perfectly logical and acceptable evolution of that move in a game that revolves around huge flashy spectacular moves. Ryu doesn’t have the ability to run in the air, he doesn’t anything like jet-feet that are able to propel him in an entirely different direction while in the air, thus giving him an airdash is illogical.
I’ve dumbed this down as much as I possibly can, so if you still don’t understand it, you are a fucking moron and talking to you is a waste of time.
Look, I understand why some people think giving everyone an air dash is too simplistic a fix for a game like Marvel, but let me explain my position. In an ideal world we could have faith that Capcom would have the foresight and technical wisdom to give each character roughly equivalent offensive tools that leaves all of them viable in a competitive environment. However, Capcom has proven time and time again that they’re incapable of doing this, especially in the versus series.
So yes, giving everyone an air dash or a short hop is a simple fix. That’s exactly why I advocate it because Capcom (probably) won’t be able to screw it up. Ideally, a character without an air dash would be compensated in other ways like throw into a super, a dust attack, or just really good damage/chip options that warrant being stuck with a little less mobility. However, I have zero faith in Capcom’s ability to tweak games.
It’s obvious when you pick up MvC2 and select some of the lower tier characters that absolutely no thought went into their design or win strategy. Someone explain Ken’s win strategy for me please. Or Jin’s. Or Roll’s. Or half the roster’s for that matter. For those complaining about homogeneity, they should really take a good look at how the majority of low tier characters play in MvC2. Most of them are essentially pixies with broken legs. When they make a bad assist call against top tiers like Storm or Cable, the only thing they can usually do to protect them is to try to super jump to the other side. Then on the way down they get mixed up because they have no air mobility to vary when they’re going to land. For offense, many of them rely on the same basic shit: dash unders, sweep into tronne, or blockstun into doom. They have to depend on stuff like that because their “unique” tools are often leagues below what the top tier have.
So yeah, I rather Capcom guarantee that every character has some viable offensive options, instead of depending on the infinite wisdom of their playtesters who they don’t even listen to half the time. Seriously, ask people who were around when they were testing MvC2. Capcom knew about the AHVB before the game even came out. Players told them about it and they did NOTHING to take it out. I know this sounds like monday morning quarterbacking, but really I’m trying to illustrate the point that if they don’t give everyone a viable offense, then the game will probably end up homogenized anyway (except with all the low tier characters having the same shitty offense instead of the same good one).
MvC3 is already awesome since it got Spider-Dan to post again! Yay!
Concerning the topic, considering that in MvC2 mobility was the most important thing to have, I say give everyone a doublejump and/or air dash in MvC3. No, MvC3 won’t be identical to MvC2 (actually, it probably will barely resemble it; I hope MvC2 fanboys are prepared for disappointment!), but mobility in general has been of utmost importance to Vs. games, so it’s better to level the playing field in that regard. Merely being able to dash and superjump doesn’t cut it any more.
All air dashes doesn’t seem to ruin gameplay but Have this feeling when I think about it that tells me,“nah son, this ain’t marvel”. I think that better balance would come from the properties of moves being adjusted. Charaters like ryu and Ken would be much better threats if their dp’s grounded opponents but gave them a chance to juggle before opponents land like charlies throw. Sentenel’s flight wouldn’t be so bad if a trade while in flight mode did something really punitive to him like maybe stun or unrollable ground fall. Storm shouldn’t be able to leave the fight, maybe her super jump could be shortened or other characters could have theirs raised. Maybe capcom could do something with hit properties on super jump block so that blocking certain moves from unmobile characters put you in normal jump state to be guard broken.
What I’m trying to say is that while giving everyone more aerial movement wouldn’t be a bad thing, changing the properties of the current builds of characters might be more fun. Look at strider and spiral, they don’t need air dashes, but some tweeking here and their to their moves would benfit them a lot and marvel would still retain it’s variety. Megaman is a hell of a character, he doesn’t need an air dash, he needs something that will make the opponent pressured, “maybe higher chip damage”.
Here’s another idea, maybe some characters can have a dash that goes through their opponent like slayer from ggxx ac or ibuki from sf3. This new engine is supposedly very powerful, I don’t see why they can’t have as many offensive tools as possible?
The real problem in marvel is that there is no mid range game and giving more mobility diminishes it even further. I think that capcom would do well to give characters tools or improve current tools to create a mid range game, but the question is, “would that be fun?” maybe beams shouldn’t have pushback while fireballs do, maybe dashing could give you beam immunity so that you could dash a little closer than block the rest of the beam? I don’t really know, I never designed games, I just played them and dealth with what I got. But I do know that variety in gameplay is usually a better direction to go with in games…
I apologize if I don’t know what I’m talking about… Please educate me on what I’m wrong about…
So you’re saying that because Ryu can throw plasma from his hands, thus having him throw plasma from his hands in a completely different and far more over the top way is fine, but even though Ryu can jump stupidly high and change his momentum in the air already, having him jump in a different and over the top way is illogical and makes you a moron.
Completely different way? Hmm… he’s firing energy from his hands. This is somehow completely different from… firing energy from his hands. Is he firing it from his cuticles? Is the energy composed of blood from his wrists? No? Then it’s not “completely different” at all and your idiocy is even worse than I thought.
what im actually scared is “the removal of 8-way dashes”, that’s the kinda things that will kill marvel. Rushdown will never be the same without triangle jumps. It pisses me off to no end when commentators of tvc keep saying people are triangle jumping when they are not. I’ll wait and see for mechanics before I start raging tho, I still have faith in capcom.
Fixing top tier would go a longer way to maintaining what MvC2 built than giving every one the same shit. Top tier is top tier more due to abuse of game system (unfly
Sent, Sent unblockable) or fucked up hit boxes (Storm s.Hk beating out everything in the game) than higher mobility for every one. Besides, air dashes for all wouldn’t mean dick if Sent can just do an unblockable mouth laser all the time in theory. Short jumps would be good though. Improving offense/defense would balance the game better than mobility improvement.
To everybody saying that certain characters shouldn’t be able to airdash, I present, well, any doujin fighter not named Akatsuki Jewpuncher. And Sengoku Basara X. And Guilty/BB.
None of those fuckers should be able to break the laws of physics like that, but for the sake of gameplay they can. Giving everyone an airdash would add an opportunity for universal air footsies and general mobility throughout the cast. It’s one of the few (relatively) modern touches that seems perfect for this resurrection.
I was just addressing the fact that megaman could have an airdash if you changed him to X. But X would be a nusiance with an air dash and the same mechanics as MVC2 because he could already compete with Mags and Storm. You could even make him to where his Megabuster did chip damage and he wouldn’t really need an air dash like it has been said.
you could just make the big characters’ air dashes really pathetic compared to most?
i’m a fan of the “the roster is way too big and teams make it impossible to really balance so let’s just throw a million different tools at everyone and it will all work out probably” philosophy, though. if air dashes are gdlk then there will be enough different characters who have them anyways so the game will still be perfectly playable with a decent sized viable roster. i wanna see some super jumps, though.
You picked an incredibly bad character to make that example with, given that since the original Street Fighter, Ryu has had a gravity defying move that propels him forward through the air. Unless you would care to offer a different explanation for what QCB+K does in, you know, every SF game ever made.
Furthermore, your argument is doubly without merit, because Chun-Li and Cammy do not have Magical Jet Boots that propel them in an entirely different direction while in the air, yet both of them can double jump and Chun-Li can airdash. Which, I imagine, is why you completely ignored my example of Chun-Li both times I said it, and why you will likely ignore it again now.
If you really want to be a canon whore then someone has to explain to me how Thanos with all the Soul Gems is low tier in MvC2.
Also, you might want to explain the following things:
Jill’s Burning Dash and ability to summon zombies at will
Hulk Grabbing a God Damned Meteor out of the sky and crashing down on people, at will, and only knocking them out.
Wolverine jumping up in the air and creating a fucking laser X (don’t remember that from the comics)
Ken being on fire protecting him from lightning, hail, and giant laser beams
Everyone suddenly obtaining the inherent ability to leap tall buildings in a single bound.
People with CRAZY MOTHERFUCKING POWERS AND SHIT.
Oh yeah, I forgot. *** IT’S A GAME***. You don’t complain about this shit because you’re used to it. I bet if all the characters had air dashes in MvC2, everyone would’ve thought it perfectly natural for Zangief to zoom across the sky like a beautiful russian beast. Then when MvC3 came around, and some idiot programmer decided zangief had to lose his air dash, I bet these very same people would be like, “WTF? How can you have Zangief without air dashes? This game makes no sense to me anymore!”
edit: Oh wait, I forgot. Zangief can already do that! It’s called DP+K
