I’m for the kind of government transparency that allows citizens to fully document what’s happening with tax dollars and law-making. For the ugly shit? What were we ever going to do about that stuff in the first place? Vote NOT to fly a secret bomber mission over Iran? I think they’d do it anyway guys.
this, right here.
and you know, there used to be somebody watching our gov’t to keep it honest, in fact this body was deemed so important as to be given explicit protections under the very first amendment that we put into our constitution: “Freedom of Press”. a term that is supposed to make sure that our media stayed independent and held our politicians accountable, however they traded in all that card for access. so now we have to wait for random people to leak documents like this, then we get to listen to our media attempt to trivialize those leaks, or call into question the person doing the leaking. it’s like… bitch, as journalists your SUPPOSED to “leak” shit about our gov’t to it’s people.
What else can we expect from someone whose handle is Soviet and from Canada?
What’s there to trivialize? The fact other countries are scared of Iran? There was some gossip about other country’s leaders? The US spies on other countries (like every other country in the world)?
Sounds trivial to me.
so if we could PROVE that OJ did it, would you want justice served, or to just sweep it under the rug and say “ha i WAS right”
too many people are viewing this as anti american, or are just fucking stupid idiots.
You mean aside from me saying what’s right, and you getting put into your place? Lol you think you’re the first person to the “you’re from Canada” card, spuddly junior? Get educated, son
The whole issue is theres a difference between “figuring they did it” and KNOWING they did it.
Did your gf cheat on you over break? You can ask her, you can suspect it, but until she gives you an answer with support, you JUST DONT KNOW. Obviously its hard to get supporting sources on shit like that, but best believe (if you arent a dumb ass) if you KNEW the truth, you would make a call to leave her if she did it.
Its as if some of you have forgotten that we are at war and these very documents released hinder our diplomatic efforts. Nothing released was of the level of say Nixon era stupidity, but that which revealed the personal viewpoints of diplomats and foreign leaders… So we think that Sarkozy is an ignorant asshole, did we need to see it in paper? Why are some of us here glorifying the efforts of documents released by an American born spy. How has the revelations of documents released today help YOU the citizen??? This wikileaks reveal does nothing but hurt the tenuos foreign relationships the US has with the world…
Not to mention jeapordizing the lives of us citizens and allies named in the reports… Maybe its just me, but having a sense of discretion, privacy, and TRUST are essential for diplomatic efforts. Now, as a Gov, the US has to repair relationships that have been damaged because of the release of this document.
Thanks wikileaks for the big FU to the US and giving silly convo for people to chew on…
Not to mention jeapordizing the lives of us citizens and allies named in the reports… Maybe its just me, but having a sense of discretion, privacy, and TRUST are essential for diplomatic efforts. Now, as a Gov, the US has to repair relationships that have been damaged because of the release of this document.
Thanks wikileaks for the big FU to the US and giving silly convo for people to chew on…
well, these ones are kinda trivial, the war document leaks were not though, and they got the exact same treatment from our weak-sauce corporate media.
transparency is good. those who have nothing to hide fear nothing from leaks. exposure of the hypocrisy, lying, deceit, and stupidity found in government, corporations, religions, and individuals is in the public’s best interest.
except now other countries can’t trust us because they will be afraid anything said to us in confidence will be leaked. all this leak did is weaken our intelligence gathering as it exposed nothing of value to anyone.
if nothing of value was leaked, then nobody will care and it will be business as usual. you can’t have it both ways. either this information is not a big deal, in which case, none of the countries will care, since nothing that was super top seekrat was released, or it is a big deal, and its good that it was leaked out, as it exposes the shitty behavior of the US.
edit: finally, in todays age, thanks to technology, pretty much nothing you do can be kept secret as long as you have a digital trail. someone will break you given enough time and motivation. so unless everyone starts using ineffective means of communication such as messenger pigeons, stuff will continue to be leaked and transparency will continue to prevail.
I already explained why it hurts intelligence gathering, because intelligence sources will be afraid the information given in confidence to us will be leaked. It’s like if a newspaper accidentally leaked their secret sources, nobody will want to be a source to them again.
The actual content of what was released is nothing of note. Big deal, we spy on other countries and some gossip happened. Whatever.
In this case, the guy that “broke” us was a disgruntled worker who has some serious personal issues. He was a technology keeper of sorts for the army and decided to spread information he was being trusted with to keep protected. In my eyes, that makes him nothing more than a spy. His disgruntlement probably flared from anti-homophobic sentiments experienced during his tour of duty.
A big FU to US.
again, if nothing of value was released, then why will intelligence gathering be hindered? either
a) the US government is good at protecting its actual valuable classified information, and sources of actually valuable classified information will continue to divulge the goods
b) the US government doesn’t is crappy at intel gathering, since all it achieved in the past 3 years was “gossip”, in which case it shouldn’t even bother with espionage anyway.
I agree with what you’re saying, but not how you’re saying it. The nothing to hide argument is flawed on quite a few points. First off, it begins with the assumption that only people with something criminal to hide should be concerned with maintaining their privacy, and that’s certainly not the case. The linked article goes into more detail and really made me outright reject this type of thinking. :tup:
I suppose that is true in the case of individual people. However, someone who has nothing to hide is not going to be targeted by wiki leaks, because exposing say… their google search history will be of no interest to anyone. but when it comes to stuff such as religions, corporations, and governments, which have a history of being underhanded, deceitful, corrupt, and incompetent, transparency goes a long way toward protecting people from their actions.
the wikileaks on scientology is a good example. if i understand scientology correctly, you have to give tons of money before you are given access to the top level info, which of course was leaked out for free. leaking on scientology helped discredit scientology (even more), gave good insight into how ALL religions are run as for profit organizations, and gave any pour souls who were on the verge of subscribing to that shitty religion a chance to back out before they lost a shitload of money on a poorly written sci fi story.
edit: also your link is broken
People support and vote in other people who don’t value transparency. People shun those who speak candidly, show supposed “weakness” like admitting when their country erred, and vilify the dumbest shit ever (OMG HEALTHCARE IS HITLER). And then people act all surprised when their leaders keep secrets.
This is quite possibly the stupidest thing I’ve read in the last three months. Dumbest poster of the year candidate, right here folks!
You’re drawing the weirdest, most illogical conclusions ever.
Dr. B never apologizes because he’s the only flawless human.
The actual content is interesting - Iran smuggling weapons to Hezbollah on ambulances, The saudis urging the US to attack Iran, Casualties in Iraq that shit all over the Lancets exxagerations, China ready to abandon N Korea. No one has actually discussed what was leaked - no content - just broad generalisations.
The problem is that most of the info is gonna be ignored amidst US bias.
Assange showed how much of a cunt he was by his response to the leaks about Afghans helping the US.