he has alot of videos and alot of low tier videos.
I just checked and there are some low tier videos by magnetro/myke z/mapster.
Justin Wong is also known to play morrigan in casuals so try to catch those aswell.
and thanks.
explain blodia glitch to me? I thought it was due to flying screen - that is any super that activates flying screen (when it hits an assist) will also hit point even if you are blocking. its happened to me before when i got shockwaved and blodia punched. am i wrong?
anyway, jin does blow, no doubt, but I seen some players take advantage of the fact that all his moves do chip damage, so they pick Doom and try to chip their opponenets to death by doing shit like the down plus roundhouse move while calling out doom, etc…
besides, he can do air combos off a jump in fierce, or something like that, so hes not all that bad. i’d definitely pick him over some homo like dan hibiki (EW).
So…
Guile > Jin
Charlie > Jin
Servbot/Doom > Jin
Ryu > Jin
etc…
Roll < Jin
Dan < Jin
Anyway whats all this talk of ryu sucking? hell no, he’s way better than akuma. tiger knee fireballs, tiger knee shinkuu haduken. GOOD SHIT
Yea well
at least dan has mobility , he has his gale kicks as a ghetto air dash which he can block afterwards (he even has a short version of them so he won’t be too vulnerable).
He also has 3 frame launcher like akuma and alot of the “fast” versions of the shoto normals.
He has a semi infinite in the corner, in fact you can get alot of damage just by doing a shinkuu gadouken, and doing his koryuken rekka before the shinkuu gadouken finishes hitting (which causes them to be launched high into the air) and launching afterwards into a reset (launch, magic series, lk gale kick, hp throw).
Ryu does suck, he has fireballs, they get eaten up by storm’s assists he can’t do good damage if he launches you (although the hurricane kick + rocket punch is mentioned it isnt’ that great)
His recovery on his fireballs suck too, dhalsim actually has better recovery on his.
His fireballs can only be thrown sparcely because of their bad recovery, his HP throw can be rolled out of too to avoid any wake up game.
Tigerkneed fire balls still leave him kinda vulnerable and Tiger kneed shinkuu hadoukens have ridiculously bad recovery, even if you hit them with it they can roll and you face a mix up situation afterwards.
His shin shoryuken sucks total ass too, it only has invincibility on the first hit.
I remember i was playing a friend and i poured all 3 levels into it, i hit him with it only to be hit out of it by the assist he called.
GAY.
I should also mention that you basically CANNOT land ryu’s shin shoryuken in a real match.
If you DHC it you waste 4 meters AND if that were not enough he only does 59 damage instead of his usually 80, which is hardly any damage at all, most half decent 2 level dhc’s do more damage ESPECIALLY because even though it’s a level 3 it is suceptible to damage scaling just like any other super so if you use it as your last super you hardly get any damage at all…
But i think ryu is still better than Jin, and also ryu’s bnb that i use:
c. lk, standing Hp xxx fp hadouken xxx shinku hadouken (mash) only does around 65 damage.
Akuma’s bnb:
c. lk, c. mk, standing HP xxx fp hadouken xxx gou hadouken (mash)
does around 73 - 75 damage.
Ryu may have the fastest overhead out of those 3 but he also has the shortest range on his overhead.
He also doesn’t have the hurricane kick glitch as mentioned before, so there goes one of the best things about the shotos.
This may be minor but if you cancel the hadouken into the shinkuu hadouken too fast in his bread n butter you get the shin shoryuken.
Not only do you waste 3 levels but there is no way you won’t be punished for it so you have to be very careful in doing that combo or ommitt the hadouken which means less damage.
Again he has limited options, but at least he has a fireball which isn’t too bad, at least it has a bigger than average hit box but it still loses to the fireballs and lazers and non negateable projectiles the big 4 have.
It’s beyond me why he doesn’t have better recovery on his fireballs it’s about one of his only assets.
He recovers around the time his fireball reaches the halfway point of the screen.
Jin’s normals don’t chip too much at all, all his jabs and shorts don’t chip and all his heavy attacks are way too hard to set up/have too much recovery/are too risky for them to be too useful but i could be wrong.
EDIT: i might aswell take this opportunity to give you guys this link in case you want to see the frame data yourselves.
It’s useful in finding out stuff about low tiers because information is really scarce
http://www.video-opera.com/features/mvc2/mvc2-joo.php
just in case you are wondering that is only the ammount of frames they come out in it doesn’t have active/recovery frames.
edit: can anyone confirm if ryu’s shinkuu hadouken is cable safe (when cable is on point)
if you swap the hadoken in the combo for a roundhouse hurricane, you can get like 80 points of damage on that. problem with this is that unless you’re fighting a bigger character, hurricane kick goes over their head. but hey, if you get the opportunity, go for it.
when it comes to overheads, i never really saw ken’s range as that significant, mostly because
- speed is a much bigger factor when it comes to using overheads in matches. you want to hit them before they can react, not poke them from the outside.
and - especially since any time you’re in position to throw it out with a shoto, you’re in range to hit or be hit by just about any other attack.
ryu’s best combos off a launcher are his flying screen shinku hado combos, usually with an assist incorporated in them. you can knock them into stuff like dhalsim, bh, cyke, or commando anti air, hadokenXXshinku hado for heavy damage. I’d also like to point out that there are ways you can set up the shin shoryuken reliably:
Launch, call drones, sj lp, rh hurricane—> land on other side—> ssrk. Or if you feel like mixing that up, you can use the lk hurricane and land in front of them. it’s one of many reliable setups i use. if you don’t have 3 bars, just super hurricane it when you land. speaking of the shin shoryuken, i rarely don’t have much of a problem with the canceling too fast when going for the shinku. mostly cuz i’ve already gotten used to this type of thing with strider. anyway, moving on…
also if they roll after you do a tk shinku, you have initiative coming down. you can come down with a fierce or a mixup of your own. it’s kind of a 50/50 situation there.
ryu’s throw is rollable, unless you throw them into an assist. throw them into doom, free flying screen shinku combo for 70 points of damage. throw them into storm, free combo. kick throw them into sentinel, free mixup.
tk fireballs only suck if you are using them with nothing at all. drop drones. drop rocks. drop something. they are also useful against storm if she tries to typhoonXXhailstorm. if you see the typhoon canceled into hail animation, you can cancel the tk hado into a super, much like how cable would.
and lastly: ryu’s shinku is not cable safe. there are two characters who can punish the blocked shinku, the other being felicia.
in the end though, who needs shotos when you can use CYCLOPS :badboy:
do you guys find that the shoto launchers are pretty crappy and hard to land?
guile’s is pretty good because it has great priority, but the other shotos not really.
so characters like ken which have glitched hurricane kick that does craploads of damage aren’t that good because he relies on landing a hit, and he has no range whatsoever, while ryu has huge fireballs that can travel slowly and fill up the entire screen. he can also have multiple fireballs on the screen at once, i think. and marvels all about who can fill the most crap on the screen at once, ryu is cool.
hailstorm eats fireball? because optic bullets, sonic booms, and other projectiles hit her out of hailstorm. but im not sure about haduken. i’m sure sonic boom does, because i do it all the time.
Yeah, I re-typed all of this. Fuck this computer.
(Damn Kaising, stop stealing my combos while I re-type my posts.)
It’s pretty good. You can DHC to HSF during the Shinkuu Hadouken IIRC, because Sent gets offscreen fast enough.
Yeah, fireballs should be better. They’re not bad, because of the size. TK fireballs are good whenever you have something beneath you so the other guy can’t just dash forward (I use Doom-B), but of course you can’t just throw them out all the time. TK Shinkuu is only for killing stuff and for DHCs, IMO. But if you really need to use it, or you’re in a 1-on-1 situation, doing 30% damage > whatever (probably) weak mixup they have planned. And you can do it on reaction to Hail. You can attack on the way down if you did it as a super jump, btw…
Shinsho is only invincible for the first hit, but…it’s invincible for the first hit. So, it beats any regular attack (or special, or super, for that matter) as long as an assist wasn’t called too long beforehand. So if Cable dashes at you with crouching Short or jumps at you with Roundhouse (standing Jab puts him too far back, IIRC?), or if anyone does anything, and haven’t called their assist yet, or can’t call it because one’s already onscreen, you can hit them with a Shin Shoryuken.
It’s not worth the damage, however. 60-70% for 2 meters >> 80-90% for 4, usually. Unless it will kill someone (or, ideally, two characters) without a DHC, or you have a team that isn’t worried about not having any meter, you probably wanna do something else. But it’s not as hard to land vs any agressive opponent as you may think. Now if they’re keeping you away…that’s a different story.
And you can Guard Break into it, actually, but still not a good idea.
You can do a Storm air combo to Lighting Storm to ShinSho for like, 123 damage, or something like that? Anyway, it does like two assloads, so if it’s gonna kill someone it could be worth the meter. You’d be better off with Storm/Sent DHC instead, of course…
Well it does more damage because you have a crouching Forward in there, too… But for the Ryu combo, try substituting the fireball for a Roundhouse Hurricane Kick. Pause for a second (not a WHOLE second, obviously), and then cancel into Shinkuu Hadouken. That one does ~70, and you can DHC to a lot of things off of it.
You can throw assits in there too- there are a lot of assists that will let Ryu’s Hurricane Kick hit multiple times on the ground (Sent-A, CapCom-B, Cable-B, Mag-A, Iceman, Wolverine, whoever), and you can do up to 40% damage without burning a super (with Akuma-G). You want to cancel into a super sometimes, but with a few assits it’s a bad idea because it doesn’t work out, positionally (ie after using Akuma G cancelling into a super does crappy damage because you’re too close, but after using Mag-A IIRC, you can fire away).
Yeah, overhead isn’t so great. It’s a good move to have, but it should really be quicker. I wish the hopkick was on overhead… Anyway, Ryu does have the glitch, as a matter of fact he has it on the ground also (see above). He just can’t combo into hit without an asist/outside of the corner. BTW, short, fierce, Roundhouse Hurricane Kick (hits twice) does good damage and gives you frame advantage so you can assist/throw/whatever as soon as they recover.
Ryu can do 70 points off of a launch, he just has to burn a meter. Launch, fireball xx Shinkuu (you can sub the fireball for an early SJ fierce vs larger characters…Cable-size and therebouts) does about that much damage, and he has some flying screen assist combos which do up to 100 IIRC, but you can’t DHC out because they cause flying screen…ie with CapCom or Megaman AAA, Launch+Assist, SJ FP, SJ fireball xx super. And he can do the air combo into hurricane kick in the corner. And he can do ~71 damage in the corner without meter: launch, sj Jab, Strong, Forward, Fierce Roundhouse, falling OTG sj Fierce, walk forward, crouching Jab till they undizzy. Inspired by the combo from your Charlie vid.
Ryu’s problem is that the combos are situational, sometimes- ie if you’re already really high in the air, it’s hard for Ryu to launch and still connect with something for good damage, moreso outside of the corner.
It’s like panther/bird xx Orouburos, you get used to the timing eventually and you won’t have Ragnarok randomly coming out (at least nearly as much). And you can sub the Hurricane Kick in, but they have to be standing unless you hit them with an assist that takes them off of their feet. You can try doing the Shinkuu Hadouken as HCF+PP, which will make it a little easier.
Ryu is good at building two meters and then doing the Marrow thing, where you call your assist and it gets hailed, and that’s mainly what I use him for (though his supers generally aren’t as useful for that as the homing bones super). Ken and Akuma can do the same thing, but can’t stall for as long vs offensive characters, generally, because Ryu’s big fireball actually comes in handy when that’s what you’re trying to do.
Ken and Akuma are probably more useful (Ken’s obscene assist, and Akuma’s is good too), Akuma is a better character 1 on 1, and they certainly have things that he doesn’t- the corner infinite (which you can also guard break into), the hurricane kick air combo (and DHC, for Akuma), but if you’re actually building a team for someone, I think Ryu is the best of the 3 shotos. Ken and Akuma can sorta kill stuff for moving (XX/IM/Sent DHC), however. They have DO have more of a problem with getting the meter IMO.
Shinkuu or TK Shinkuu? If hit or blocked? For ground Shinkuu, blocked is quite unsafe (so his Messatsu Gou Hadou, btw…you just have to AHVB really quickly), hit is safe. For air version, it depends. If you’re close to ground level (TK Shinkuu) it’s less safe, but I don’t remember being AHVBd afterwards anytime recenly (though maybe that’s because I don’t do it. I do recall that it’s a positional thing, and if they roll they have a harder time hitting you if you hit them from close range.
edit: fishjie- it’s random. If the fireball is close enough to her it will trade, but sometimes it will evaporate before it touches her. This is for air fireball, dunno about the ground one. Though I have seen a fireball be on screen and float for a while through a hail storm and THEN evaporate, so I dunno. Maybe there’s a difference between Jab and Fierce?
In response to both of you.
Have you tried your variations on crouching opponents?
the reason i omitt the middle kick from from ryu’s combo is because if i do the same thing i do with akuma it whiffs on crouching opponents.
Hurricane kicks are pretty unreliable since storm and mags can probably duck under them,
ur comboes are interesting though, i didn’t know the launch , fireball xx shinkuu.
Ryu has a little better time building meter due to his decent meter on fireballs but i still dont’ think that’s enough.
Very interesting comboes, but i have to ask how are you going to get a launch in with ryu?
Akuma gets in to apply pressure with his fast dash, and he has teleport and i think even his dive kick has some frame advantage although it isn’t nearly as useful as it is in other games.
Ken has his command roll + assist for mix ups, and he has a good sf2 style cross up in his U+HK (it has massive hit stun) i aim it for the head but keep in mind these kinds of cross ups are kinda unreliable as i always say in mvc2, i also think that he might be able to use his command roll as a way to get back in should he be push blocked, since he can cancel out of it from any normal and it covers 50% of the screen.
Ryu has FK, HP, and even U+HK as a cross up (although his u+hk has about as much hit stun as a hop kick IIRC) but even then none of these cross ups are all that great… He has jump up foward hp xxx hurricane that all the other shotos have only better (his will only juggle for one hit because of the way it hits while the other shotos can get up to 60 damage from 2-3 hits of their hurricanes)
The range on ken’s overhead matters because he can hit from further away, and he can use stuff like, c. lk, standing fp xxx overhead while ryu can’t (actually ryu can’t do it anyways because of his chain system, but at least ken has a fierce’s block stun to help compensate for the startup on his overhead).
On another note, ken’s standing lk looks a little like the the start up of the move so you can even use it as a fake out by delaying a c. mk.
And to the topic of the shin shoryuken, yea you can get used to it but i still don’t like the possibility of it coming out when you need your shinkuu hadouken combo.
edit:
By the way
nice comboes TS, and Kai
really really nice stuff, i’m definitely going to use them now 
edit2: i actually i kinda take it back, ryu’s overhead seems to have good range on the second hit at least but still it sticks out like a soar thumb in my eyes, for some reason charlie’s just seems to blend in to me.
edit3: I don’t know you guys, that ryu shinkuu hadouken xxxx hsf just seems unreliable to me and overall not worth it. I should also add that ken’s shoryu reppa goes into hsf very well at the right point and you can dhc after both akuma’s and ken’s after they are completely finished into hail ryu can’t dhc too well off his shinkuu from what i can tell. (i guess you meant his air shinkuu, if you did then nevermind)
jump in fierce that shit. that’s the most underrated way for any shoto to land the launcher. shoto jump in fierces have insane priority and a huge crossup box. it’s like a shorter ranged summers family roundhouse. you can also do a c lk into a launcher during your wakeup mind games after slamming them into the floor a couple times.
i should also point out ryu can cancel into his overhead off his mediums. As for the range of ken’s overhead, it never really mattered much to me because by the time he whips his leg up, that’s more than enough time for him to get hit by something with even more range than his leg. there’s just too much time to react to that. that extra motion is like extra time the opponent gets to leave blockstun and call an assist.
ps. have fun with those combos. i’ll post more later when i have time. =P
Sakura has the best launcher(s) out of the shotos DF HK. C.HP has decent horizontal range compared to the other guys too.
ryu’s hopkick overhead is pretty good.
if you have storm projectile assist you can play some sf style mind games.
knock down. call storm. hopkick
knock down. call storm. c. lk
knock down. call storm. hesitate. throw
its pretty effective, plus its much easier to land a knockdown with ryu than it is to land a launcher. storm is there as insurance that you won’t get punished, her assist should hit them right after you make your move, so either they block it or they are already in hit stun and it gives you more combo options.
and yeah shin shoryuken sucks. it always comes out accidentally. cable’s level 3 super is better anyway :sad:
oh akuma’s divekick is kinda sucky, most AA assists own it pretty badly.
Try to cancel C.HP into qcb+lk with Sakura especially on Magz. Because she has (a little) recovery time that can be taken advantaged of. It’s so funny how I confuddle a Mag player when this happens.
For example.
Calling Sent G wavedashes, C.LK, C.HP opponent blocks xx LK Senpu Kyaku opponent does a C.LK to combo me into his launcher but it whiffs because I’m slightly above the ground Senpu Kyaku hits along with Drones, dash C.LK…:badboy:
This has happen to me many times.
I think Jin is better than most midtiers, simply because of his chip damage ability and power. Obviously he’s not top tier, but he’s still useful. Basically, you can make most characters good, as long as you know how to defend against the top tier tactics.
One of my main teams, Jin/Sakura/Tron, works well, I can hold my own in any arcade, and I have good comp in NorCal, and when I visit SoCal. With Jin, you never use supers, because he’s one of the best batteries to have. It also doesn’t do that much more damage to use them anyways.
Anyhoo, SVGL/NorCal/Etc can vouch I can beat top tier teams using Jin, especially people like Randy Lew (puahaha). I’m nowhere near the best, but I’m not an easy victory…most of the time. I’m not sure if anybody really cares, but I can share more Jin tactics…it’s not like more than 5 people use him seriously.
i used to use jin as part of one of my main teams: strider/jin/doom. Jin AA was just too good back then. then i evolved and threw him out for cykes when i found out cyke could give me almost everything jin could give to me and then some. (and ironically now, i’ve in turn put cyke on the back burner for sentinel). i’ll still bust jin out every now and then simply because any character that’s considered tough to rush becomes 10x more annoying with jin’s AA.
i can vouch for soulrequiem. i’ve seen his sak fuck up sentinels like nothing.
HK Senpu Kyaku lockdown ownz!!!: :nunchuck:
It would be nice if you could share some strats that u use.
Thanks for posting i hope u can share more with us.
Yes. Some assists only let the hurricane kick connect once if they’re crouching (Akuma-G works on everyone except those with abnormally low crouches…Megaman, Morrigan, and probably Omega Red). Btw, short, fierce, RK hurricane kick with Akuma-G is 64 points of damage, and with Sent-A is 70 if they’re standing, and does about 60 if they were crouching, IIRC. While I’m on damage, Lighting Storm air combo xx Shin Shoryuken does +130 damage, and general combos to Shinkuu Hadouken DHC to Hail does +100. (only does ~72 if you do the TK Shinkuu by itself).
And I should note that the flying Screen combo I listed above with the repeated FS crouching jabs doesn’t work on Cable or Hulk or Shuma (because they juggle funny), or Sent or BH orJuggernaut because they’re too heavy. And the Flying Screen Shinkuu Hadouken combo, using CapCom-B, does ~110 damage, I think.
Shinkuu/TK Shinkuu Hadouken xx HSF doesn’t work, unless you throw an assist in there and DHC as it hits them to bring them to the right height (cutting the Shinkuu short). It connects when they’r airborne- launch combos into Shinkuu Hadouken xxHSF, or hurricanen kick xx Shinkuu xx HSF.
You’re right.
Well, it’s usually not my focus. I think that against the best characters in the game the fact that the other two shotos’ have more way of landing hits doesn’t really matter, since they’re probably not going to land them that often anyway. And, if they do, they’ll want to maximize the damage, and will be DHCing out. Ryu does better damage from far away and is better at filling the screen with stuff. Damage potential is essentially the same for all 3 shotos if the opponent leaves themself wide open (not counting Sent, since Ryu has no Sentinel infinite). The other two shotos are a somewhat better at making combacks (assuming Ryu doesn’t have 3 levels to spare), but in a team-vs-team situation, I’d feel as comfortable with Ryu as either of the other shotos (moreso, even, but I’m biased).
And shoto launchers aren’t bad. They have sucky horizontal range, but their priroty is good.
All of the overheads have issues with being pushblocked, by the way…anytime you do an attack beforehand and it gets pushed, you go flying across the screen with your laggy overhead animation. Ditto Ken’s roll IIRC, just with less recovery time.
True, though connecting with more than one hit of the hurricane kick after a Fierce is a little harder than that vs non-giant characters with Ken/Akuma. You can actually do a throw after Ryu’s u+RK, even if it connects, because of the odd hitstun, and ditto with jumpin attack xx Huricane Kick (though you have to walk forward. If you hit them out of the air with it, the first hit connects, but they have to block the second, which gives you frame advnatage to call/bait an assist, or do whatever to keep them in blockstun. Sometimes you can get the fist two hits to connect and make them block a third, depending on the attack and the height.
np
Shinkuu Hadouken DHCs to hail seemed to work just fine for me… And about the accidental Shin Shoryuken, just do the super motion later. If you just slow down the fireball xx super part, your chances of getting an accidental Shinsho drop by at least 70%
And try this with Akuma: launch, Sj Short xx Roudhouse Hurricane kick (hits 3 times) xx fireball super xx Hail. Did like 130 damage in training mode or something crazy like that. And you can also do j.JP, j.FP xx fireball super at the end of his Sentinal infinite, btw…sucky for a lot of DHCs (you’d want to dash when you lad and chain into the DP super instead), but if you have a DHC that works or you’re out of teammates, it’ll work.
re:a few posts back
Hayato midtier wtf. :wtf:
(from experience)
You can do fsd on jin 
Anyways on a lighter note Dhalsim isn’t so bad (only when I play him). I just need more experience… Anyways he has a lot of things that make him really safe and dangerous. For instance, he can slide through all 3 HSF sets. As most people know, he can teleport out of hail storm, runaway forever pretty much. Call assist while sj mode if you’re quick. oc hp = 3 frames = fast enough to beat tri jump, aslo if you quick start by dashing back there is no way mag can hit you and his cr.lp is insanely fast and goes over cr.lk’s LOL
his assist (anti air) is silly because it works with any character pretty much.
Sorry for breaking this post up so much…
iuno about jin in mvc2, but in mvc1 i luv him 
i was gonna try and relearn him in mvc2 but there were too many glaring nerfs, one of which was the hk thing that was mentioned, where he doesnt recover till he hits the floor. also a side note to that he has like 1/4 the mobility in air during a hk. iuno mvc2 is a different game and i dont think jin keeps up, no matter how much we <3 him