I know, Jimmhalpert thinks otherwise because he tested with something that is fairly easy to screw up.
why is this thread?
Okay, I did exactly what you said. I set Ryu to dash twice, cr.hk, held up and did j.hk, then held block for about 7 seconds. Here’s what I found
[LIST]
[]You’re right about being able to safe jump the super. However, it’s definitely 3 frames. f.mp -> super combos and f.mp -> s.hk definitely does not. I think for some reason the super whiffs for a frame or something.
[]You are wrong about corkscrew cross being 3 frames. First of all, it’s impossible to link into corkscrew cross. If it were 3 frames you could do f.mk -> ultra or cr.lp -> ultra. You can’t. Also, Ryu blocked reversal ultra when I tried it. When you tested it he got hit because the ultra freeze ate up the ‘block’ part of the recording. You have to record him blocking for a long period of time in order to not get messed up by the ultra freeze. Another way that you can show the ultra is slower than the super is to do lp Jet Upper -> lp MGB -> super. If you substitute an ultra it whiffs.
[/LIST]
The frame data is right, the move is just screwy. Either it’s the move being weird or Ryu has some magic way to safe jump 3 frames, which I didn’t test but should have.
Darkyellow, this setup is impossible to mess up. It’s so braindead easy because it requires no timing at all. Just holding up forwards after cr.hk.
Anyways, it doesn’t even really matter that you can safe jump Dudley because like I said Sagat has the same problems without super bar, his backdash is worse, and Dudley has thunderbolt too. And safe jumps aren’t the end of the world, Rog and Chun are even more free on wakeup and they’re still good. Chun can’t even backdash against safe jumps because you can beat both EX Spinning Bird Kick and backdash with jump in option select DP! So stop complaining about Cross Counter not being a reversal. Dudley requires you to block and tech throws a lot. It’s a good thing.
Don’t say the frame data is wrong because that’s just not true.
So we’re in agreement then. :razz:
i though cross counter only worked on normals. i have been able to cross counter some specials and some ultras:
you can cross counter cody’s criminal upper and ultra 2.
you can cross counter guys ultra 1.
you can cross counter adons rising jaguar.
i dont know the startup or active frames for those moves, but it worked. maybe someone should take it to the lab and can find some real sick uses for it.
Just… don’t try for anything but ex CC on your wake up and only if they dont safe jump and have been attacking mindlessly on jumpins. It’s not a magical move. Should be used sparingly like anything. (save EX MGB)
Also, GIMPYFISH YOU PLAY THIS TOO? 
Has anyone else ever done a crosscounter when you have a sliver of health left? It’s hilarious. Both me and this Blanka had like 5% HP left, he went for Ultra 1 and I EX’Cross Counter’d it but it still killed me. The second the ball hit me, it did the flashy Ultra KO screen, but then Dudley followed up with the EX cross counter then collapsed on the floor after. It sucked that I lost but it was hilarious. Also CC is a great tool to throw in as an anti-wakeup. It beats reversals that would normally break armor on wakeup like a reversal shoryuken, bird legs, headbutt. It’s delicious against scrubs.
If Cross counter worked on more physical, mid hit ultras, it would be better(Cammy’s and Ken’s U1 and Ryu’s U2 come to mind)
I refer to it as the “Anger Punch” due to Dudley’s yell on the KO… I like to imagine his yelling is him going into rage mode.
I’m glad you posted this, because I wasn’t sure if it was a matter of different characters having a different wakeup speed or if it was simply a hitbox issue when trying to land meaty overheads. On some characters it seemed a lot easier than others, and the few I asked online had no idea if the timings were different.
So its the exact same timing every time…except for on a few characters, in which case you just have to learn their character specific timing and then its STILL THE EXACT SAME TIMING EVERY TIME?! Honestly i find you talking like safejump is technique of the gods absolutely hilarious. People wouldn’t even bother to talk about safe jumps if daigo and mago were the only ones that could do it. I honestly can’t imagine anyone practising for an hour and not being able to do it 95% of the time. I guess you just really are that bad.
Cross Counter is superb. Like any of Dudley’s other moves, there is a wrong way to use it and a right way to use it.
I have landed my Cross Counter literally every time since I’ve started to use it, save for once. I strictly reserve Cross Counter use to once per MATCH. EX CC causes huge damage, is entirely unexpected (most people forget Dudley even has this move) and throws everything your way once it lands.
this is how CC needs to be used. good man.
ps SSB in this game sucks. i died a little inside the first time i baited a throw only to have my SSB blocked and punished.
Can someone change this thread to “Why do most dudley players bitch so much”
Jesus christ , dudley is a rufus jr. he’s going to have drawbacks due to his wicked offense
Hook me up with whatever it is you are smoking good sir.
Cross Counter has it’s uses. I don’t mind the losing life because it’s the damage you took + some on the opponent. It’s pretty much trading with a guaranteed win in the trade with knockdown. Cross Counter vs characters with lower health than Dudley is really good. EX Cross Counter to Ultra is definitely something you should know for those “just in case” situations. Don’t say Gouken’s counter is better, I tagged Gouken’s counter with a decently spaced neutral jump RH with Dudley and his attack part whiffed me and I got that RH damage and then some.
SSB is strange in SSF4. I’m not completely sure if it has throw invincibility on the back step part, if it doesn’t it should. It does work as intended by baiting throws (well Makoto’s throws and normal throws) if you can predict them. This move eats Fuerte’s wakeup mixup alive though so it definitely isn’t useless. I wish landing SSB had enough frames on hit to combo something after since we don’t have 2 or 3 stocks of Super to cancel into, but that might be overkill.
Thunderbolt I’m pissed at. I used the EX Version a couple of times to end rounds as a surprise and every fucking time it pushed them out after 2-3 hits and I got punished >:[
SSB DOES have throw invulnerbaility when he goes back.Problem is, it doesn’t when he gets forward again, and that the most of the startup is right in the opponents face.In sf3 it had most of the startup away, then tbassicaly teleported and hit the opponent in a few frames.Here it has massive startup while next to the opponent.That’s the problem.
jaja, much like Dudleys entire move set, cr jab or throw beats it. /salt
Too bad EX MGB doesn’t have armor.
I don’t think EX MGB needs armor. It’s not that kind of move.
EX MGB would be way too strong with armor.