lol smash
Okay, I created an account simply to create this post and will most likely never post here again. But I simply can’t stand how pathetic all of these Smash Bros. posters are acting. This is going to be a long, long post. So bare with me.
A game with depth is a game with depth. That is what Smash is; whether it is technically a fighting game or not (as determined by who? Not sure. Doesn’t really matter) is irrelevant. It functions similarly to a fighting game minus some major elements (health bar, meter, etc.) but has some unique elements (platforms, much more freedom of movement, direction influence, etc.)
The overly complex ruleset is there for the exact reason that everyone knows already: In vanilla settings, the game (assume i’m talking about melee from now on unless I state otherwise, I don’t play Brawl) is not fit for competitive play. That is because it was not designed to be that way. One thing that everyone has to realize is that regardless of a games intended design, there can be unexpected results. Melee’s depth exists whether intentional or not, and there is nothing wrong with people taking their enjoyment of the game to another level and attempting to mimmick “real” fighting games. Anyone who is annoyed or upset by this needs to get over it. If it weren’t an enjoyable experience then the Smash community would be dead by now, and it isn’t.
Now, a few things I need to get accross to the Smash players here. The people who frequent this forum are used to seeing Smashers act exactly how you all are acting now. Begging for acceptance, trying to explain why your game is legitamite. The truth is, nobody cares. Do I personally believe that Melee has a huge amount of depth? Yes. But that does not mean that I have to shove this view down other peoples throats.
This is an extreme example, but lets take a look at the Bible. There are a ton of nuts who get tons and tons of different messages from tons of different stories out of the Bible. One person gets a particular message and thinks that anyone who doesn’t share/also see that message is a moron. You, as someone who enjoys reading the Bible, doesn’t want to think that hard or look that deep into an extremely simple story, and immediately get shunned for it. This is why Casual Smash players hate us; they see exactly what the average SRK member sees; A community trying to make a game into something it wasn’t meant to be and shunning those who don’t see it the same way This is something that will always be true within the smash community, and we can’t change that. What we can change is our attitudes. While I definitely think there are a lot of good members in the Melee community (again nothing against Brawl but I don’t ever go to Brawl tournaments so I wouldn’t know), there are those who practice wavedashing at home, play with casual people and make them hate the game.
The same thing applies to the average fighting game player, more or less. Especially when Melee players take their game as a holy grail of fighting games, when it doesn’t even run properly in vanilla settings. I’m a huge fan of Melee and love playing it competitively, but there is no reason to deny that our game wasn’t designed to be played the way it is played now. It does not undermine what it has become, or devalue it, but to claim that your game is superior to other fighting games, especially when half the people who claim so don’t even play “real” fighting games, is beyond pretentious. I don’t blame them for hating us, and if more of the Smash community could just accept that there game IS seperate from the fighting game community, then I think they’d probably show us a lot more respect. We don’t need them to say “ya your game is good guys”, because most of them already (to some degree) understand the depth that Melee has. Being needy acceptance hungry scrubs isn’t helping. You all embarass me.
As far as the Smash community being less mature then other communities, no offense to you guys here at SRK, but I’ve seen some pretty childish/immature posts throuought the forum being a long time lurker. As far as hygene however, I for the most part agree, though usually it’s the younger kids who seem to have a problem with it. I’ve heard jokes about the Brawl kids being furries/anime nerds/never showering, but as I’ve said I don’t know any of them so I can’t say for sure.
I guess what is really boils down to is, the reason we aren’t a real part of the FG community is not because our game isn’t deep enough or doesn’t require enough skill or even because SRK hates us; It’s because our game will always be a misfit. Misfits don’t have to be hated, but all of you moronic Smashers make it so damn easy and give such awful examples of our community that people draw conclusions, often rightfully so. You all need to grow up.
Melee, regardless of it’s intended design, is a great game, and has at the very least stood the test of time. It’s going on 11 years and tournaments still get great turnouts. Whether these people accept us as a fighting game community or not is irrelevant, because it seems like most of you haven’t even accepted yourselves. Who cares what people think? Play the game you like.
Smash lacks a lot more fundamental fighting game elements than just (health bar and meter), but other than that I agree mostly with Shawn_P’s post.
I don’t think it really matter what Smash lacks in comparison to other fighting games. It isn’t the same as other fighters, and in a lot of ways isn’t anything like a traditional fighter, but the depth that it has is there and stems off of it’s uniqueness. I’m not arguing that one is better than the other, but I’m sure you can understand a game doesn’t have to be a traditional fighter to have depth.
I think this analogy pretty much wraps up the whole Smash community vs FG community dispute.
I’m a fan of smash up to Melee, Brawl was born out of the hatred of competitive play, that said I think we can all basically blame Keits (not offense Keits) for constantly bring Smash up on a a website that clearly doesn’t like it. Is it fair? No the hate is not justified at all. Will it end? No, its impossible for people who haven’t started or even attempted to play smash competitively to comprehend the game as a fighter especially when, yes, the game was never meant to be more then a fun party game. Here’s the thing, when you think about it Street Fighter was never meant to be a deep combo heavy fighter either, it just became that way because people found these moves that with strict timing could be pieced together to create devastating attacks. Smashers found that by limiting the randomness of items and stages they could play in a somewhat competitive fashion, later they discovered they could cancel aerial moves and attack while sliding thus creating devastating combos. Any of this sound familiar? The difference is Street Fighter knew it was a fighter and did the obvious thing and make this a core part of their game. Smash as a party game did the obvious by completely alienating it from their game. In the end their is no right or wrong way to play a game and a “good” game designer should never limit the player to a specific play style unless they absolutely have to.
Anyway my two cents.
Unfortunately the hate usually is justified to a degree. Especially when they have to read moronic posts like this attempting to slander Street Fighter and put it on the same level as Smash.
You can’t even begin to compare the steps that were taken to make Smash a competitive standard. Rules are STILL changed fairly consistently. Street Fighter II may not have expected to become a competitive standard of fighting games, but it sure as hell was meant to be a fighting game with no nonsense.
And nobody is arguing that you can’t change the rules to make the game competitive. They are saying that It is completely clear that, because these rules needed to be changed in the first place, it is hard to classify Smash as a real “fighting” game, based on a ruleset that shuts off a lot of aspects of the game, and when it is so vastly different.
The hate comes from posts exactly like these, simple generalizations that are dead wrong where people try to make Smash look legit by pulling comparsions out of nothing.
I think the hate is very justified. Seriously guys. Melee is a great, technical, competitive, deep game, but that means nothing when the community that plays are a bunch of whiners who complain about people hating on them when it has no effect on anything whatsoever. The ones who hate us and don’t know what they are talking about, don’t know what they are talking about. The ones who hate us and DO know what they are talking about already KNOW that Melee is a deep game, but it’s beyond the point of mattering.
I’ll say it again. STOP BEING WHINEY ACCEPTANCE HUNGRY SCRUBS.
Talk about generalizing, not ever person who plays smash is whinny. I even mentioned in my post that Street Fighter was meant to be a fighter what more do you want from me? I never said they were the same I said they way they became competitive was similar, never the same. Hate is never justified I’m not particularly impressed with how Tekken play’s competitively, but I don’t post about it ever time I see a post on Tekken. Whats funny is its true smashers want to be taken seriously because they envy the community that started competitive 1 vs 1 fighting is that such a bad thing? All I’m going to say is everything about this argument (in general) is purely opinionated which begs the question as to why is it even talked about anymore?
No, what I am saying is that that is what this forum sees. The people who don’t care either way, don’t care. The part of the community that this website sees are the people who want acceptance. The vocal minority. There is nothing wrong with wanting acceptance: There is something wrong with begging for it and stomping your feet and insulting people when you don’t get it, which most of the smashers who posted in this thread did.
And, as an aside, it wouldn’t be talked about anymore if Smashers stopped bringing it up.
I’m sure there wasn’t hate the first, second, maybe third time that a thread like this was made. But they’ve been putting up with it for years. I think at some point it is no longer worth talking about to them; the same conclusion has been reached countless times and Smashers just can’t accept it.
Your still generalizing that all smashers are bring it up, not all are. Post likes these are fueled by bigger posts on the front page I can guarantee you this thread started up again once Keits posted about the MK ban… Ok well point made I see you were infact the person who posted the day after his post. Literally 24 days after the last post of these thread. I’m not saying that you shouldn’t have post, I’m just saying it gets the ball rolling. Also guess what else gets the ball rolling? When the community eggs it on and then says they didn’t want it.
Post 292
2 months after the last post for what?
Smash may have whiners, but everyone else has trolls XD No community is perfect.
I don’t really see how when I posted is relevant… but I stumbled across this thread when lurking the forum like I do often, no real reason other than that. Didn’t realize it was almost a month old till I was 90% done with my post and still felt like sharing it. Furthermore, have you ever heard the expression don’t feed the trolls? If you didn’t feel a need to come and defend yourself, you wouldn’t bother. That’s called insecurity. I’ve seen plenty of the same stuff happen on smashboards, with smashers insulting people who play traditional fighting games instead of Smash. They don’t (usually) create threads and ask Smashers to accept them because they don’t give a shit. They have their own community. Why can’t Smashers be happy with what they have?
Just stop. You are doing exactly what I said is making these people loath you. You are complaining, making excuses, and trying to defend a game nobody here cares about. If you want respect, give respect. Don’t send the entire community here into an uproar because people got butthurt over people trolling SSB (as kedawa’s post states perfectly, it’s not hard to get you to respond and make fools of yourselves.)
The bottom line is, the only way SSB would ever get respect would be if stopped giving a shit what this scene thought of them, flurished on their own, acknowledged that their game is seperate from real fighting games and continuing to play it because the depth and competition still exists, stopped being immature, and maybe even started hosting larger multigame events to show that we aren’t all about Smash.
In other words, change the entire community.
In other words, stop posting shit like “What is with all the hate this game is good u are all dumb streetfigher guys lol”
The arguments are brought up by Smashers, or people who are interested in Smash enough to ask. Maybe they’d get decent answers instead of “LOL THAT GAME IS FOR KIDS” if we stopped, ya know, acting like kids.
This take a while, I still see nowadays people over at Smashboards trying to compare Smash to other fighting games
But I guess it is a good step to discuss it only there, rather than post it here and forcing an opinion onto other communities