yeap probably that’s the case
I dont remember that beeing punishable ever with Normal SPD.
Man Capcom are so fucking gone. It makes me so angry, and then they reinstate the nerfs to some of the most unskillful chars ever like Ibuki. This is the most CORRUPT SF-Edition yet. Get your hands in the pocket of someone with influence and cry.
At this point what they can do to save the Gief?
There will be at least one more build with the 5th character, no?
I don’t think they’d buff one character like crazy in the final location test.
Capcom’s testers (on the company) are most likely a bunch of casuals/scrubs, and we know how both of those playerbases feel about Gief.
Anyone with a little bit of common sense understands that Crapcom is purposely unfair with their balance to Zangief. Since the first SF4 version, he have received nerf after nerf. The funniest thing about this is that he have never been a strong character. They for example buffed Guile a lot in USF4 and he is already way better than gief. So would it not make sense to nerf Guile and buff gief instead?
My brother always tell me that Crapcom is a bunch of crooked hustlers. Money is the foundation of Zangiefs balance, thats for sure.
Also, Sagat has always been -1.
I don’t know why I keep visiting here because it’s nothing but bad news. I can’t wait for USF4 to come out so I can just accept how badly they’re treating my favourite character and move on.
There is actually one positive buff for Zangief(its a general buff actually) in the latest build.
EX Red Focus Cancel cost 3 bars and crumple on lvl 1. Since gief is almost completely independent on meters in the latest build, gaining 3 meters is a piece of cake.
With 3 bars, we can buffer lp -> lp green hand -> EX Red focus cancel -> Ultra 1. That’s nice for 3 bars and can be hit confirmed.
But are we sure he can combo into exRFA?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egMUuETqwfQ
Here at 0:56 KingBlackToof try combo exRFA after a LP BF, but it fail
I know it’s just a mod, but just to contribute
clMP -> exRFA? I don’t know i doubt it work
clHP -> exRFA? Will be awesome, but i don’t believe we will get that
With EX BF being now shit i believe we will have a lot of super meter, but for what i’ve seen we will not get awesomeness from exRFA (when almost everyone else get new ways into ultras)
At this point i believe Gief will rely more on normal RFA mechanic, imho he will be good at it and against it, but maybe i’m wrong
I know Zangief has an overall problem with safe use of EX meter, especially against non-projectile characters. I think the only thing to do, is to start training these slow ass sluggish 16 frame sniper riffles, for use in footsies. Note: If they were 15 frames, you can hit confirm from far standing LP, which is +6 on hit, and +15 on cancel.
Firstly, I don’t know much about the new mechanic, but unless the EX Red Focus is speed up. I don’t think it will work. LPGH on canceling, won’t provide enough frame advantage to cover the attacks startup - especially given now that the green hand is faster.
And if it were true, it would be a very stupid gimmick, to a once great warrior. But if that’s what he’s reduced to, then so be it.
Edit: Unless your referring to this 4 Bar combo: EXGH xx Red EX FA L1 - Ultra 1. That would work if EXGH is +1 on hit, and does not knock down. But using all available bars is really stupid, even if it does KO. Your at a huge disadvantage without extra EX or FADC tools - not that he has much of those.
I actually think that LPGH is a good buff, but at HUGE fucken cost to EXGH. Not sure how it will be as a positioning tool, but it will be a viable counter poke tool in footsies - whiff punishing.
Just have to remember that after the LPGH game, you have to assume the brace position, that is crouch block then tech. You can forget Ultra 1 after the fact, as that shit is so hot, its on the FBI’s most wanted list. No clown will fall for it, and you will just eat an ultra for your trouble. But I think the -2 on LPGH could be somewhat manageable.
LP-GH is a HUGE buff in ITSELF. But the all around changes are terrible.
Gief Focus Attack does not hit crouchers unless they are very close to him. Its also slow so it proabably cant combo of anything in USF. Maybe c.hp
I would like the following buffs:
-
far LK range restored, needs help in footsies
-
MPGH to -2 on hit, for use in option selects in footsies
-
LPGH to -1 on hit, but this could be too much
-
LPGH, MPGH, HPGH to cause impact displacement on hit, so you are both outside throw range.
-
Needs an alternative bread and butter combo for use against grappliers and 1-2 frame throws.
-
cr.mp can be special/super cancelable on hit. As this normal forces stand, it would allow you to land Lariat combos on any crouching opponent. But it has slow startup, so you could only realistically land it off a jump in. You could also anti-air reset via cr.mp xx LPGH to appear in front, or cr.mp xx MPGH to appear behind. But cr.mp xx EXGH would whiff.
-
cr.hp to be +3 on hit (currently +2 on hit) or make the move 1 frame longer, so that the combo cr.hp xx EX Red FA - Ultra 1 becomes possible after a jump in.
-
far HP to startup faster in 10 frames (currently 12), plus increased float state. To catch jump outs and connect EXGH.
-
cr.lk to become 3 frame startup or +5 on hit, to make the beautiful cr.lk. cr.lk. cr.lk cr.lk xx LPGH consistent.
-
Ultra 2 command can be activated on the ground, startup is 0+9 (which includes 6 pre-jump + 3 till active), compared to 0+3 when done in the air
-
Increased range on super to be greater than Ultra.
-
New EX Lariat, a mix between KKK and PPP lariat. Complete full body projectile invincibility and shorter duration than KKK with limited forward movement - for his harder projectile match-ups and to avoid chip. Hit and or throw invincibility is debatable. Performed by pressing PKP or KPK, could be a hard input on pad.
-
Needs a better way to counter throws after LPGH, when Ultra 1 is not stocked, and without the risk of jump cancel atomic suplex. If EX Atomic Suplex is 1 frame, that would make the role of EX SPD obsolete. If EX Atomic Suplex is unthrowable, Abel won’t be too happy. Need to examine the risk and reward against the opponent’s options after the LPGH game: back dash, neutral jump, back jump, reversal, block, throw, combo. As W Ultra Combo Double is bad news for any grappler - too many high damage punish options.
-
Running Bear Grab has armour and EX Running Bear Grab has 2 layers of armour. Not that it would catch many people, WITH THAT SLOW walk speed. Just putting it out there.
Does anyone here think the guessing game after LPGH, -2 on hit, is balanced?
Does anyone here think the Oni match-up is balanced?
-2 LPGH isn’t balanced at all. It’s less damage than EX GH for a worse mixup. If Gief got better utility from his meter then it could be debatable. But he really doesn’t. At -2, the best thing to do is just block. Even at +1 with EX GH Gief doesn’t really get much pressure since his fastest light is 4 frames and on a buffered EXGH he’s usually too far to hit confirm cr.LKs into another EXGH.
Whiff punishing with a light into GH is already monumentally difficult against real player with real footsies and nothing about that is becoming easier. So to be rewarded even less for it is absolutely not balanced.
I like some of the buffs you suggested. +5 cr.LK is a top priority buff IMO. It’d really help Gief keep people on the ground. That or allow cr.LP to keep people grounded like cr.LK does (no way that’s happening).
I’d be fine if they just left him like he is now and made EX GH 16 frames, no knockdown and made LPGH 0 on hit. He also needs an armor breaker or he’s gonna be super free to red focus.
c.lp keeps them grounded if they try to jump as long as you dont chain the c.lps. the thing about c.lk is that in truestring like splash c.lk or c.lp chain c.lk it catches people mashing backdash, reversals or jump all in one, while still keeping you safe from their mash and punishing it.
Why cant we just have Super gief EX-GH Knockdown on 1hit. and 1.70 SPD? Then we would be good.
At least we can still hope for the Final Round build, they said to expect improvements for who got less, and as now it seem to me that nobody got it worse than Gief
Don’t expect any real buffs to gief. ever.
Best case is he gets useless buffs, and worst case he gets nerfed even more.
As it stands now I’m not even gonna bother getting Ultra. They’re shitting on my main yet again and I’m sick of it. Also Hugo will be the worst character in the game when all is said and done imo and although Hawk is slightly improving he’ll probably still suck. Grapplers will be trash in Ultra. Thx Capcom, Combofiend, and all the whining scrubs.
you know gief is a freaken movie star you would think he would get better treatment then this
The fucking Hugo got armor on stHP 
It will be cool to get armor breaker on our stHP… not just for the fun of punch Hugo in da face but to beat RFA, Gief still don’t have an AB outside throws range
Or better, give me stHP with AB and knockdown 
Okay so we all know that Gief has gotten nerfed after every iteration of SF4 but I was thinking about Ultra today. It almost seems as though they’re deliberately trying to make Gief obsolete in this version. First all the nerfs to his footsie options and jab spd range. Then we have delayed wakeup and red focus. Just think about it guys.
So now we have worse spd range and worse footsies but if we still somehow get it now the opponent has delayed wakeup so we have less mixups. There goes our chance to do any damage. Then we have red focus and guess who doesn’t have an armor breaker? That’s strike two for Gief. Finally, all our bad mu’s are getting worse. Basically every character is getting better and some will be much better while we get worse. Strike three lol I love it.