you’ve proven that you have no idea what im talking about. you fall into the catagory im targeting. do not post again unless it has some intellegent relevance. :tdown:
instead of calling me a baby in every follow up post. how about someone be a good samaratin and step up to join a party with me and school me on this “new age of fighting tactics” everyone is embracing. a few other kids i befriended online have given me constructive critcism already and i appreciate all instances. if someone can show me something that i can benefit from, why should i knock it??
Trust me, I have played these guys and beat them. You just have to be very careful and think about what you’re doing in advance, and respond to their actions. It can be very difficult and frustrating but I promise you that NO simple flowchart strategy is 100% effective in any street fighter game. It’s ALWAYS more complicated than that. If they are keeping you out with fireballs they might be changing up the way they use them in order to keep catching you off guard.
What character are you using anyways? If you’re playing Zangief or Abel or something that’s exactly what Akuma has to do to win that matchup. That’s not his fault, it’s just the way the matchup plays out.
And dude, there never was an SF rulebook. That “code of honor” and “rules of cheap / fair play” stuff was bullshit right from the beginning. The game doesn’t care what you do; the game just knows that there is a winner and a loser.
I am 23. I remember those old rules. They were bullshit then, and they were bullshit now. Only difference is that more people today have realized how full of shit the rules were to begin with.
Saying throwing is cheap in SF is like saying dunking is cheap in basketball.
I’m really starting to feel like my words are falling on deaf ears. Oh well, I tried to show him the way…
Also, stop blaming your loss on your opponent’s controller. Even intermediate players can do fireball motions on demand with 99% consistency.
By the way, every damn arcade had a different set of random rules. My scrub friends used to actually have arguments over what the rules were. Just more proof that this was BS made up by a bunch of people. It has no place anywhere. Throwing is not cheap and in fact, it’s really essential to the game’s balance, because without throwing, blocking would be overpowered.
What Tanner means to say about it being “ever changing” is that you can’t really define what “fireball spam” is and not run into a problem somewhere. First off, the number you pick to be the rule (“You cannot throw 10 fireballs in a row!”) becomes problematic because it’s arbitrary. There doesn’t seem to be any real reason the rule shouldn’t be 9 or 11. Second, even if you set the rule at 10, and throwing as many FBs as possible is really the best strategy, then the new best strategy becomes to throw 9 fireballs in a row. If you make the rule 9, then the best strategy is 8. Then when you reach the limit you just do something to reset the counter real quick and then go back to throwing 9 fireballs in a row. Then there becomes a whole problem about exactly what resets the counter. If I do 9 fireballs, whiff a jab from fullscreen, and then do 9 more fireballs, is that breaking the rule? How many other moves do I have to do inbetween the sets of fireballs? Do they just need to be moves from fullscreen and it doesn’t matter if they touch you? Do they have to be blocked or hit? See the problems that are arising?
The reason you can’t get around fireball spam and throws is because you are NOT GOOD AT THE GAME. Anyone slightly decent at this game can easily avoid this stuff. Capcom gave you plenty of tools to avoid fireballs and throws no matter how numerous. And yes I’ve played countless akumas, sagats, goukens etc whos whole strategy is just to stay away and throw fireballs… but instead of crying and complaining about “cheese” I get around them and win. The difference between you and a good player is the good player is willing to find a way to win were as when you can’t figure something out you just yell that they are cheating. In the end you learn nothing.
Don’t sit there and try to go “OG” on me either. I played SF2 back in the 90’s as well and me and the people at the arcade that actually knew how to play laughed at the losers making up bullshit rules. There is nothing at all cheap about throws and there never was.
Either you are going to have to deal with the way things are now or simply quit the game because no one is going to follow your silly childish rules.
lol… thanks. you’re the only one who is actually entertaining my views. i mean i guess you’re right. but damn man this is how i was raised!! and it just aint right!! like i’ve said many times before, im not trying to vent, cry, whine, complain or start any tension here… but i mentioned something and it got blown out of proportion just because ima new member. smh… btw if you reallly think about it, dunking IS kinda cheap in basketball. lol.
Novakain, think about this. Pick Akuma, go online, and do this so-called “super cheap” strategy to another player. See what he does to beat it (he probably will). Then, use that to incorporate into your own game.
You’re already on SRK; instead of whining about an Akuma which throws 50 fireballs over 2 rounds, maybe post in the Akuma thread and ask “I play [this character], what can I do to beat a fireball spammer?” Just because you can’t come up with an idea to beat it doesn’t mean they don’t exist.
There are some people who’ll give you a hard time on SRK (and, based on the way you’ve talked in this thread, you’ve kind of brought it on yourself), but this is an incredible resource with very good players who are ready to help new players.
Let me tell you, I love it when people mindlessly spam fireballs without any mixup. It’s a free win. After discussing strategies to beat it, you might think so too.
Also, most people here are just as OG as you. If throwing is programmed into the game, why would we deliberately choose not to use it? Throwing has its fair share of counters, you know. If someone walks up to you and throws you, try teching the throw! Reversal DPing the throw attempt! Dash back (and use invincibility frames to avoid it)! Jump and do a beefy combo! Seriously, there are sooo many ways to counter throws, and most of them end up with you dealing serious damage. So why are throws cheap again? If you know someone is going to walk up and throw, and you don’t counter it… you are playing poorly and deserve to lose.
I’m 28 years old. I remember those rules, I used to play by them myself. Now I realize how silly they were.
It’s basically just “I don’t like this aspect of the game, I can’t deal with it/don’t want to, so I expect you not to do it and I won’t do it either. LET’S FIGHT LIKE GENTLEMEN.” If throws were so bad, why would Capcom continue to put them in everye game they make? Better yet, try to think about Street Fighter without throws. Let’s say we’re having a match. I pick Guile. I will get the first hit on you in the round - now I’m just going to sit on down-back. My reaction speed is fast enough so that I can Flask Kick any overhead you try to do. What are you going to do to me? What could you possibly do to make me want to get off my charge?
Somewhere within the first two pages of the SFIV forum you’ll find the video thread. There you will find gameplay footage from high level players. If you watch the vids, you will see these players dealing with the tactics you think to be “cheese”. They get around fireball traps, they tech throws or jump backwards out of them. Yeah, sometimes they hit fireballs to the face and sometimes they get tossed around too, but that’s just a part of the game.
Learn how to deal with these tools and utilize them yourself, and it will make you a better player. It will make the game more fun - open up strategies and situations you never knew existed before.
i understand there are aggressive people who are waiting for the chance to jump down someones neck on forum, but i dont really sugar coat anything, i speak my mind and havent really insulted anyone on here. i have an aura about me and if i came off offensive… …
well, like eminem said, i find you offensive for finding me offensive.
I should also add that mecha (and Azrael!) add a great point. If you couldn’t throw, there would be almost NO counter for someone who just sat in the corner and blocked low the whole match (only some characters have overheads, and even so, they’re not big damagers).
Throws are a necessary part of the paper-rock-scissors mechanic. Without them, rock would always win. If you think throws are cheap, imagine how cheap the game would be without throws. Seriously. They’ve been in every single fighting game ever made for a very important reason!
When someone throws you, they countered your block with the game’s “block beater”. Blocking is not a free win, and getting damaged while you are blocking is not cheap. You should really re-examine these rules and why you (and players like you) hold them… because they don’t really make any sense. Hopefully some rational thought will help you realize what we are trying to say here.
If it makes you feel any better, when I was a kid I bought into all that honor / cheap stuff too. I used to think throwing was cheap in SF2, although if I was alone I would play against the computer on my SNES and abuse the hell out of it.
I remember a real scrub moment was playing Killer Instinct 2 on the nintendo 64 with a friend. I was NO fucking good at fighters at that time and never really started to understand them until many years later. I picked Jago, and he switched between all the different characters, playing Fulgore, Spinal, Jade, and whoever the hell else was in that game. He absolutely DOMINATED me every time. Being the scrub I was at the time I had an excuse for everything. So and so was overpowered, this move was cheap, you got lucky with this or that, you’re just button mashing, etc. Finally he agreed to play me in a MIRROR match with my best character (Jago) some crazy ruleset (no fireballs, no combo breakers, probably some other stuff to)… and he still absolutely destroyed me. He had shown me that even when he broke down to following my own ruleset he still absolutely dominated me. I had run out of excuses and things to ban. I don’t think I said anything at all after that fight. I remember being extremely frustrated but with absolutely no way to excuse my failure.
I haven’t talked to him for years for entirely unrelated reasons, but I kind of wish I could play him again. Even at the young age we were (probably around 13?) he already understood what it meant to play to win, and I was miles behind him. It wasn’t until later that I would really understand what I was witnessing. And it wasn’t until much later (around when I realized that zerg rushing in Starcraft wasn’t cheap and was just another part of the game) until I really started to get out of scrub valley and start on the playing to win path myself.
(Before you go tearing me a new one for being an ex-scrub, please keep in mind that I was 7 when SF2:WW came out. I think that deserves at least a little slack :lol:)
well now you’re better for it. please don’t ever use words like “cheese”, “cheap”, blah blah blah when dealing with fighting games here. oh and don’t use eminem either… shit’s mad gay
Then it simply becomes an issue of someone using a technique that beats you too much. If, in a boxing match, someone were to drop their guard and the opponent repeatedly lays heavy shots into his face, is this cheap? Does the guy getting pummeled say “hey, cut it out, you’re doing too much damage by that one move”? No, he probably puts his gloves up, or else ends up with brain damage.
It’s the same with throws. If someone is throwing you repeatedly, stop blocking! Do any of the things I suggested a few posts ago (throw back, jump, dash back, reversal uppercut, etc) and teach him that he can’t just throw you all match and expect to win.
Plus, this gets back into territory about how many throws are acceptable. You’re not against throws 100%, but you’re against them… 70%? 50%? There’s some fine line between being thrown too much or being thrown “just right”? No one is able to define this, and that’s why this argument is not tolerated in the community. The line where it’s too much is basically the line when the opponent starts to lose, and then it’s nothing more than an excuse for losing.
Besides, throws in this game do pretty small weak damage. There’s almost nothing to complain about. Go play the really old school SF2s, where throwing did half of your life and had fewer counters. Then, playing SF4 will seem like a breeze.
If you play old SF all the time, and don’t throw, how do you beat people who sit there and block all day?
Also, here’s something else to consider. Let’s say you find a counter to someone doing the fireball spam. You find one technique that just clean beats it. And every time someone spams fireballs, you do this one thing, and you win the match as a result of this. You then get a message that says “good job you faggot way to spam one move, why dont you learn to do something else”.
Do you see the irony here? It happens all the time, and it’s precisely what this type of thread is about.
There is nothing wrong to finding a counter to your opponent’s strategy, and doing it over and over again until it stops working. In some cases, this is simply walking up and throwing. In others, it’s throwing fireballs. This is at the very basic level. But turn this around and use it to your advantage! If he only throws fireballs, then you should do only the fireball counter. You wouldn’t think that’s cheap, would you?
This is how teams win at sports, too. If you can’t stop Shaq in the post, you’d be a pretty foolish coach to not center your offense around him, and give him the ball at every opportunity, right? Is this cheap? No, it’s good strategy!
Just be happy you can tech out of throws unlike SF2 where you get owned by throw priority characters, and throw cheese tactics like Boxer’s. Seth Kill knows what’s I’m talking about.
this is a competitive gaming forum… and the only rules that exists in this type of forum is “play to win…”
if you want to make up gentlemen rules or dont want people to do certain things in matches, then by all means as a casual player, find players and friends who agree to it and enjoy the game… some people play just to enjoy the game… and that is perfectly fine…
but for most here, they get the most enjoyment out of the game by winning… no matter what the player does… they like to strategize, and figure out how to beat other strategies, and adapt to an opponent’s gameplay and overcome it…
basically you are in the wrong forum novakain… this is the reason why you are receiving so much hate…
