I know right. Why can’t swinging a tennis racket be as easy as doing a hadouken. Such horrid game design.
honestly trying to talk to you is unsettling both because of the content of your posts and your username/av combination. it’s like i’m trying to explain this to a fucking cartoon character
swinging a racket and doing a hadoken are both stupidly easy… but ignoring that… Are you aware that street fighter isn’t tennis?
yeah i know you had an entry-level philoso[phy class or something
Ability to read what you link says hi:
I wish swinging a tennis racket so the ball goes where I wanted was as easy as doing a hadouken and having it go where I wanted, especially after large repetition. Are you aware that both are games with execution requirements? Apparently not…
uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
i’ll edit this in case you dont know what i am pointing out. how is timing not a part of execution. if roger federer doesn’t swing his racket at the ball in time, the racket wont hit the ball. much like roger federer if i do not do the shoryuken in a timely fashion i am not going to land my anti air, and even more similar to myself is john mcenroe because yell and throw things when i try to explain to you
So my personal conduct is relevant to the issue of Street Fighter?
You do know that relates to conduct where ethical motives are at play, right? Like if somebody says “I think we should experiment on humans because it will be cheaper” and somebody returns with “But you only say that because you enjoy murder.”
I’m shocked that there’s a moral component to this discussion. I never would have guessed. :lame:
No. There are moves that have easy versions that are different motions or simply eliminate the difficult motions. The last hit of Akira’s DLC combo in VF5 can be either b,f,f+p+k or simply p+k. The harder one does more damage, the one without the b,f,f motion does less damage.
And Akira’s knee is another example where a mistake isn’t as bad now. Akira’s knee is done by pressing k+g at the same time but only holding guard for 1 single frame. In VF2, 3, and 4 Vanilla if you whiffed Akira’s knee input you got a standing kick which is a terrible move to get in place of a knee. In VF4:EVO they changed it so that k+g (where g is held for more than 1 frame) gets you a different knee animation with reduced effectiveness. Akira’s “true” knee is meant to be hard to do. K+G (1G). But the easier knee, simply pressing K+G without the single frame timing, makes making a mistake much less forgiving.
All of this is good in VF because it helps beginners and doesn’t punish elite players. Where in SSFIV and HDR the easier inputs punish everyone by making a for a terrible game. Unfortunately Capcom can’t seen to find a balance between making good games and including beginner friendly mechanics, moves, and combos.
theres only ethics involved in that itd be immoral to agree with you lol
Straw man much?
So now you’re changing your position because your earlier one failed. You never once limited it to a timing issue. You were talking about doing a move “better” like not missing any inputs or something. Those are two completely different things and I sincerely hope you see that and realize why the latter can’t work.
But none of that has anything to do with actually screwing up a move. What he was talking about is like if I try to do a shoryuken but don’t hit the :r::d::df: perfectly I’d get a weaker version. Basically a lenient input system that ranks the performance. It can’t work like that because it would interfere with normal play. You’d randomly get crappy versions of special moves when you’re in the process of doing other ordinary movements.
That’s not a straw man if that’s what the damn thing says. Good lord. I seriously can’t believe you don’t know what an ad hominem is yet try to tell me I’m positing a straw man. You’re a clown.
Timing is part of execution.
This lesson in beginner fighting game terminology is brought to you tonight by ElderGOD.
Picking out the one part of the definition that doesn’t apply, a position which you create specifically to be easy to argue against, rather than the position actually held by those who oppose your point of view.
i don’t know man i think the amount of frames you have to do fits pretty well into the categorization of “timing” and “execution”
hahah wow eldergod, nice
Yeah, ONE part. He made an argument that was far broader than that and now he wants to backpedal on it and pretend he was only talking about timing instead of everything involving execution. Real brilliant guy you’re defending, pal.
Yeah! You’ve got a supporter who doesn’t know what ad hominem or straw man means! A winner is you!
Thank you for agreeing and admitting that it plays a part. A for Ad-hoc reasoning.
Please stop using ad hominem attacks against the pimp bishop donjon via sarcasm. Your inability to comprehend his argument regarding timing and execution is your own lack of education in the matter, it is not pimp bishop donjon’s fault. Please stop playing the straw man again by again creating a position specifically to be easy to argue against, rather than the position actually held by those who oppose your point of view.
i never said i was only talking about timing frankly i have no clue how you got that idea. i am saying that timing was already a part of what i am trying to explain to you in that the amount of frames you have to do a move would go in the “timing category”. what’s your freaking disorder
You both have to be clowns. There’s no other explanation because you’re very honestly talking bullshit. I’ll have to make this as simple as possible.
1) About timing:
pimp bishop donjon argued that “bad” execution could result in worse versions of special moves. Timing is ONE aspect of execution but he NEVER said he was talking about timing. He was talking about actual performance. But actual performance problems, like adding in wrong directions or missing necessary ones cannot be used to result in “bad” special moves since during ordinary play you would get crappy versions of shoryukens when you just tried moving around the damn screen and shoot a fireball! The game would think you were trying to do a shoryuken and just fucked it up!
2) About ad hominem/straw man:
Pimp bishop donjon posited an ad hominem when instead of countering my statements he pointed out that my username and avatar of all things made it a pointless argument. He attacked me instead of my argument. That’s textbook ad hominem. The article says that ad hominem arguments only work when the person’s character is relevant to the topic. Unless my username and avatar are somehow relevant to fighting games or this conversation then that exception doesn’t apply! Therefore, pointing out that it doesn’t apply is not a strawman as ElderGOD tried to argue.
I can’t be any clearer than that. Good lord.
One critical difference though, that’s one of the reasons the analogy is so flawed… Is that “execution” barriers exist in Tennis because it’s a sport… and the execution barriers in a fighting game just exist for the sake of existing.