Since when cr.lk -> cr.lk was a hard combo? it’s literally impossible to miss. It’s a 2 frame link btw, not 1. The combo you started using (cr.lp, cr.lp, cr.mk -> sk) is a 1 frame link so it’s actually harder…
You do realize that having to guess is NOT a bad thing, right? I wasn’t saying Bison should be able to react to everything the opponent does to escape the corner. That would make escaping corners virtually impossible. It would be unbalanced and that’s not what we were asking for.
It was right as I saw the video that I realized how overpowered he would become, and definitely not the way it needed to be. As I said, people always tend to look at weaknesses as a bad thing, like they’re a mistake on the developers part and that should be removed entirely. But again, developers don’t make weaknesses just for the sake of it. They keep the character balanced, and prevent him from being overpowered.
What I’m saying is, don’t ask for a perfect character, don’t try to eliminate a character’s weaknesses; instead, find ways around it. It’s true, they gave Bison weak AAs, but they also gave him a way around it, like j.mp. It requires some skill, but if you’re good, you can stop people from jumping with that. The problem is, it just doesn’t work! It has a shitty hitbox, and a huuuuuge startup. That’s where Bison should be fixed. That and some damage would be perfect imo. As I said, they should improve his current tools, instead of giving him new ones.
Anyways, yeah that is my issue with giving him a reaction based AA as well, it would become impossible to escape the corner. Plus it would go against his whole essence.
He needs to have his moves that don’t work gets fixed, like air moves and hell attack. Beyond that the added damage would be all he needs. I still disagree with U2 being a circle command.
Find it funny you guys seem to be against reaction AA vs people in the corner (which none of the ground based AA is likely to accomplish) yet want to potentially give him exactly that with a hell attack that works.
Granted I would love for hell attack to actually work.
Oh, yeah I saw that video. Free isn’t the only person who thinks that. I think that suggestion is pretty much dominant among the Bison community.
@ stabicron
Well yes hell attack WOULD work as an AA in that case, especially in the corner. However being an air attack it makes him unsafe because there will still be times even if the move is made to work where Bison can be beat out of it just like there is for the other characters like Ryu, Seth and Gouken. It wont be free, whereas a better AA would be. With an AA Bison can remain grounded and just be a wall that no one can ever get past. Couple that with his wakeup options (which are by no means perfect of course but better than SOME characters) and it would defeat the weakness of the character. And we aren’t saying make the hell attack godlike, just actually work. Actually working doesn’t mean it can’t be beat, it just means that it works for the situation it is meant to.
highly unlikely that Bison will get a new overhead move, also with Free’s log video I agree that EX devil reverse shouldn’t cost another meter after the EX empty DR use…
^ Can’t really agree. Remember that if you make everything unsafe, nobody will attack at all cause they’re afraid to be punished, making the game even more defensive and slow.
But if you really have to, you should make these moves even more powerful to justify the fact that they’re now unsafe, but that would make the game too random
well in my opinion, i think when they make these updates they should make changes, nerfs or buffs, that promote smart play. that doesnt mean just make everything unsafe, it means just nerf the high reward low risk moves. for example akumas sweep range and startup should be nerfed. Make zangiefs far s.hk/c.mk have more recovery on whiff, s.mp easier to whiff punish, and nerf range on light spd, but give him back his knockdown on ex greenhand. In high lvl play this will make zangief better, but for scrubby players they cant abuse his gimmicks anymore.
just remove all the high reward low risk shit and make it so that it actually takes some effort for akuma to get a knockdown, instead of getting a knockdown so easily so he can destroy you with his vortex.
My main point is make changes that makes the player actually think when they do stuff, instead of just do it. I really dont know the method to that, and no fighting game will ever be 100 % balanced. Bison guile will always be 7-3 because of their style of play. But in general i honestly like aliounes changes more than dieminions, because if capcom listened to dieminion, guile would become the most ridicilous character in sf4. Alioune had the right idea with his changes, but i didnt agree with all of it.
In that video, 1up mentions some shit about combofiend, with him bringing up Bisons first. What did combofiend say about Bison?
edit: I completely agree with making the second part of exDR not cost meter. Seriously, the second part of Rufus exJesus kick doesn’t cost extra meter…
I am in the air with more combos into ultra. For U1, sure. For u2, no. I’m fine either way for both. But make U2 a fucking motion, period. Its a bad ultra as a charge.
Guys, I took little tour over the other characters balance suggestion threads.
My conclusion, I think we were too sensible and thoughtful of our suggestions, perhaps little bit fair and shy too. I should have registered and asked for Bison to have ridiculous stuff such as having the first hit of Psycho Crusher to be blocked normally and the second hit as corss-up, a command grab, a meter building teleport , a taunt where Bison throws the hat and gains a damage increase, Fireball invincible slide and Rose backdash. This way Bison will not be left out compared to the others.
@Phenom
Ok, I got what you’re saying, but that alone would require an entirely new game imo. The whole metagame would change so unpredictabily, it would take too much time to test and balance. Scissor Kick not being safe alone would mean a radical change to Bison’s design.
Now what I think would be awesome is to introduce a new mechanic that gives you the opportunity to punish stuff that would normally be safe, but requires tight timing and skill. Something like a 1-frame parry, so nothing abusable and very situational, but that rewards one player for his execution and punishes the other for spamming moves just because they’re safe.
yeah the one thing I give credit to, is that the bison players wants seem grounded in reality. Then you go to other threads and they want 4 new moves, 0 frame overheads, wall bounce added to 1/2 their moves, armor break on the other half, double the movement speed, and much much more. Seriously go look at shit like the Evil Ryu wishlist. It’s retarded nonsense like “make ax kick an overhead, give it armor, and it shouldn’t be punishable because nobody uses it. Oh and make sweep 4 frames.” All in one post.
Meanwhile we ask for them to fix cHP like we have for like 4 years now.
Bison’s true AA solution is jumping MP, not s.HK or cr.HP. Those lead to nothing dramatic in the long run. If you got reactions, you can already use s.HK and cr.HP effectively. There’s never going to be an IWIN button for AA’s and stuff. Deal with pressure and block like a man.
Jumping MP getting better priority is the best overall AA I’d love to see. It’s just gonna open up better damage for him. Look at the SFxT Bison videos. THAT… do want. Just imagine all the Ultra 1’s and 2’s you’ll be landing.
Please let us not forget that there are plenty of characters in this game with kick ass offense AND kick ass defense AND runaway ability. All the sudden you give bison something a ton of characters have (AA) and it’s “OMG, he’ll never lose again!”
100% correct. I think people are way too bashful and self-conscious about stuff for Bison. I tried cammy a while back and was whipping ass with a character i was only messing around with for a few days.