Vortex is still nerfed. Very common tactic after a sweep or a blocked (ex) fireball was to go for a high/low mixup with the palm/whiff. That mixup is gone. As soon as they see/hear it’s a demon flip, they can crouch. They might still get by it, but it’s one reason less for them to guess wrong. They can keep their charge as well.
Yes, it’s more easy to crossup opponents with DF DK if they’re crouching, but those are outcomes depending on what your opponent does, instead of what Akuma does. That and the reduced possibilities after a forward throw, which was a key move within the vortex. You might not have used it a lot, but Momochi and Tokido did, especially against Honda’s and Boxers.
Wow, he’s Gouki is still really good lol… Defeating Sasaki really convincingly! Losing to HJMxp Dudlye’s though, lol I feel like people should mash shoryu againts Dudley way more often then they do now, they’re giving him too much respect, and he goes and frame-traps them like ten-times in a row untile he gets a CH D:
Really, I’m not too worried about Tokido’s Akuma/Gouki play of late. He’s been dabbling in a lot of other characters, mainly beefing up his Seth. His Akuma is bound to suffer as he probably hasn’t dedicated as much time to the demon while trying to find an “alt” he can use to counter pick in those matchups where Akuma is clearly at a disadvantage.
People need to stop looking at the forward throw as if it was just broken. Everything still works the only change was your frame perfect set ups aren’t the same. I can stilll safe jump everything I could before.
Really? How do you safe-jump Ryu from a forward throw mid screen then? I would really want to know, cuz I sure as hell ain’t have a safe-jump on him or Ken from mid-screen.
Come on dude, you’re putting words in my mouth, never said it was broken. It was powerful because of all the options it gave us. I mean, which shoto doesn’t have a safe jump after a forward throw? Made no sense to remove it.
Care to explain how you can safe jump 4f reversals with the current throw, don’t see how that’s possible without a HK demonflip and that can be defended against crouching…
How did you ever (with non-hitbox related gimmicks) safe jump Ryu? He has a 3-frame reversal. I reckon we can safe jump 4f reversals with some kind of HK demon flip after a dash or something, but again, opponents can crouch block the palm.
Pretty sure you can’t safe jump 3fs reversal unless you empty jump, like for instance Dash x 2, Empty Jump? Though feel free to correct me if I’m wrong… This works on DeeJay’s annoying EX Upkicks however… And I believe LoyalSol stated he could “still safe jump everything he could before”.
So in essence, you shouldn’t be safe jumping 3fs reversal characters but rather trying to mix them up or stuff their DP’s with the new setups. Right?
Perhaps I should have used different words. I am talking about acting like the throw is worthless now. I will say the current throw IMO is better not worse than the previous. It gives finer control over corner mix ups and as I said I can still do everything I could before the change.
Dash, Walk Forward, Jump.
The same method I have been using before the nerf. I just have to jump 2 frames sooner.
I missed this part of your post so I will address it
When I talk about cross up I mean cross up palm not cross up dive kick. I mean using a set up that is hard to determine what side Akuma is going to land on.
I have a set up with Honda that forces him to stand if he actually wants to avoid a more dangerous mix up. With good timing and spacing after a forward throw, you can make it so if Honda attempts to block the palm low you land on the other side of him which acts as a cross up. You can immediately go into s.HP > Fireball > FADC > etc. for massive damage. If Honda blocks it high or reversals it acts as a normal safe palm. In addition you can delay the palm by a frame and land on the front side in case Honda catches on to the cross up. Basically Honda has to deal with a 50/50 mix up if he blocks low in addition to the regular safe palm, dive kick, and DF grab. Now here is the funny thing, if he starts blocking high to remove the 50/50 guess what that opens up?
I have similar set ups for Chun, Viper, Sim, and Rose.
PS Tokido used empty jumps more than empty palms because they are a little safer of a mix up. Those still work.
My hard drive unfortunately just screwed itself over so it may be a little before I can upload footage.
The general idea is that with characters who’s crouching hitbox is really small and also they have slow reversals you aim to hit high on the character. If they stand up they block Akuma from crossing over which forces Akuma to hit normally, but if they crouch Akuma can go overhead and land on the other side.
I got this idea from a similar mix up that Viper has where she can aim the burn kicks to go over crouchers but not standing opponents.
The new throw could be better, but imo i prefer the old one because the corner setups just arent enough to make it better for me. Yes you can still safejump with that throw, but with the old you could safejump AND has more vortex options at the same time (ex. dash dash j.rh/cross up tatsu).
Also not sure if this happened as much before, but when i safejump with palm vs some characters the palm whiffs if the just block crouching. If that was the case before aswell then ppl were stupid not to take advantage of it (the opponents pretty much).
Unfortunatelly im not. Try some stuff vs Ibuki. I just NEVER got it to hit.
What would the setup be? throw, walk etc? Havent tried it alot but it seems u cant get in range for the tatsu to crossup while you are able to safejump with j.rh at the same time.
Oh Ibuki is an exception. Her hit boxes are messed up. You can only palm her from certain angles. Ibuki players knew that back in AE and Super though so nothing new.
