Yeah the footdive was the best tool he had but that seems like a fair trade off considering his weaknesses imo.
his mixup game is legend with trait he could frame trap the shit out of you with safe launchers into damn near 50%'s he didnt need AA because his backdash had like 30 frames invul and traveled liek a 3rd of the screen so instead of challenging your jump in he just got the fuck out of dodge and with stages being so big you dont have to worry about cornerign your self so often. lightning cage is an amazing wakeup that leads into 40% damage about. HE completely controls interactables and pre patch interactables did damn near 30% and had like 1/4 to 1/2 screen unblockable hitboxes. Divekick was completely safe from all angles and was even plus in some situations.
He was rightfully nerfed and is still a really good character he just doesnt dominate EVERYTHING
thats Martian Manhunters job now.
ST, MVC2, and 3S are among the most intelligently designed, deepest, and most fun (okay that last one is subjective) fighting games ever made and what else do they have in common? Oh yeah they all happen to be very unbalanced in the sense that a few characters are wayyy better than everyone else.
In the words of the man John Choi: "Don’t worry about buffs or nerfs, just play.
Look at one of my all time favorite games ever Awesomenauts, all the characters play completely differently from one another so many unique abilities and yet the developers managed to balance it really well by making everyone OP, everyone can kill each other quickly. Look at Dead Space 2, the plasma cutter was OP in DS1, but instead of nerfing it Visceral just made all the other weapons better, nerfs to anything in a game, especially a competitive multiplayer game should be done very rarely and judiciously, taking something away is never as fun as adding something in.
I really hate this stupid notion that balance is overrated, just because Capcom and NRS suck at balancing it doesn’t mean that balance is the problem, the problem is the ways that they use to try to achieve it.
We have companies like ASW or Examu for example that do a a better job at balancing their games, just look at GGAC and GGAC+R, games that are well balanced and did it by not nerfing its characters, or AH3 and AH3LM.
@Oz
The moment that you include MVC2, a game that is “good” by accident and 3s a game that has really stupid design choices (not wiffable parries, a priority system that asures that a Strong never loses to a Mid for example) i can’t take your opinion seriously at all.
Nerfs are sometime necessary btw, saying that buffing everyone doesn’t cut it. Everyone likes to assume that making everyone op or broken makes the game balanced, well, nope, just loo at HnK, a game where everyone is broken, yet we still have a really unbalanced game because we have 2 people that are more broken than the rest.
Yes the most important thing is making a fun game, but fun and balance are not mutually exclusive.
MvC2 is intelligently designed? That’s news to me…
Technically ST also had some glaring design flaws…3s seemed fairly well made IMO.
I can’t agree with MvC2 being intelligently designed. You know they threw that shit together right?
lol at MvC2 intelligently designed. Zoo made a funny!
Then you clearly don’t know the stupid shit that happens behind the scenes on 3s.
The game has a lot of really dumb shit on it.
Yes, ST has its flaws, but it also has virtues that helped to define what FGs are, so because of that it gets a pass.
Bad design is bad design you don’t get a free pass.
I’m not saying 3s is flawless I just said it’s fairly well made as in there isn’t any stupidity. As a example of poor design compare it to SF4 or MVC3…it’s safe to say capcom has lost its touch.
any1 who talks bad about ST knows nothing about fightinggames.
the only flaw ST has is O.Sagat , lol.
It has a lot more then that…Honda vs ryu is a good example.
His point is, despite its flaws, Street Fighter II set the precedent for a lot of fighters that came after it. It influenced games like KoF, and damn near every 2d fighting game in existence draws from it in some way.
Since when is a bad matchup considered a “flaw” ?
so is sennin like… full on retarded or just partially? i haven’t seen him say anything that shows any bit of insight or intellect.
you’re gonna talk shit about the flaws of st and then say 3s is well designed? are you one of those “hitler wasn’t wrong” people too?
Nah fuck st claw
I made a thread back in the day about sucking at SF2/ST.
Oh old school Vynce. You ******.
I would’ve rather that they just went back to the drawing board and rebalanced him all the way. No one likes “One Move the Character”.
Emmm, bad balance =/= bad design, though bad design can lead to bad balance like is the case of 3s
No look I’m not saying one shouldn’t strive for Balance because they absolutely should, for developers it’s not over rated all, and yes Guilty Gear games tend to be exceptional examples of this, and even as a player you should care about it, but it’s way too high on player priority lists, Marvel 2 may be good by accident but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s really good. It has a large match up list despite how many characters aren’t viable, it has crazy systems, it’s honestly a really good game but so many people write it off not because it’s just not the game for them, but because balance reasons and that’s silly, you’re missing out a fun game because you’re so worried about balance.
Or the way people just shout for them constantly these days, MK9 was ruined by constant declarations for patches by players to make things “More balanced.” I think 3rd Strike was name dropped by Zoo because despite it’s problems and some of the cast being heavily stacked against, it’s still a really fun, competitive game that offers an experience pretty much unique unto it’s self. It’s a good game.
On a slightly unrelated note, I just wanna rant about an issue i have with the way people sometimes talk about Capcom fighters. I’m not saying you have to like them or anything, but the way people shit on them sometimes is really aggrivating. The newer games like SF4 an such don’t really count to what I’m talking about, this is more the 90’s and early 2k fighters. Capcom games at that time where pretty pioneering, they tried really new concpts pretty often that tended to yield unique fighting game mechanics that others went on to improve upon. SFIII for example has some glaring flaws, but it was still trying new things and pioneering concepts that are rather staple in modern games, and that’s a good deal of what made them really fun. Guilty Gear has exception balance but then again ArcSystems has been working on the XX series for like…15 fuckin years almost, no Capcom game has ever gotten that kind of love.
I dunno it just kinda burns me a little the way people so easily shit on their games when a lot of the games genres that belong to fighting games find some kind of DNA in a Capcom fighter.
Eh it’s whatever I guess. I’m kind of stoned right now so feel free to ignore me :tup:
Naw son 3rd Strike has a ton of dumb ass shit going on, and even if it didn’t it’s dumb in other ways that Capcom should have definitely know better then to do at the time. As Hecatom pointed out the Priority system isn’t that good, coupled with silly ass hit boxes and you end up with stuff like Chun Li Palms. Same for Yun Palms and his launcher. Just fuckin silly. I give the parry system a pass because it’s one of the first times anyone tried to make a universal parry system like that, and almost all the systems are built with the parry system in mind so changing how it works would fundamentally change the way the game played. The Parrysystem was the pillar the game was built around. Even still the way parries work has all kinds of silly properties. There’s is no reason you should be able to Option Select a parry, I mean come on.
I like how I just posted a rant about shitty on Capcom games, and then turned around a took a big ole dump on 3rd Strike