Mostly, he’s talking about ex st. Not those. You want to lose 5 frame u2 also?
Edit: Serious question. I feel people are presuming Vega will be too effective overall. I don’t want him too effective, but I also don’t think we should just go into usf4 with 2012 data because people were afraid Vega MIGHT be good.
For sure. 5f is retarded.
6f is ideal. Fast enough to make “safe meaties” disappear (such as Boxer crLP) and slow enough so you can’t combo off crLP/crMK bar counter hit. Legit.
But I would improve the hitbox vertically, so it would catch empty jumps as well.
Either that or make it so empty jumps have 1f of recovery. They are really strong as it is now. But I don’t see it happening, so U2 catching empty jumps seems like a more realistic thought.
Make CH like Super and improved hitbox to hit low profile moves and I rest my case.
About EX ST, though… I really like it for the fact that I can react to things with it. But I can see why a invencible reversal that is only -15 for a character with a 22f backdash will be really strong. Couple that with the delayed wake up mechanic and it will be more trouble for the other characters than previously thought.
I would change that EX ST invencible for a slightly stHK to make Claw more solid.
I would take s.hk for sure. The rest of that sounds good, too.
Anyway, Chris King dominated. Mike Ross called Honda and Sagat vs Vega unwinnable. King in grand finals.
So. Expect changes.
Hopes chris kings wins
He’s facing Valle as Rolento.
Edit: Forced him to Ryu, expect he’ll win. Will be surprised if they don’t revert Vega to Vanilla data. Heh.
Chris King wins. Valle says u2 too strong, also notes his own failure to adapt.
Yeah. Whatever they do, I hope they don’t overnerf him. But, I expect some significant changes. Hmm.
Edit: Snake Eyez takes the tourney though.
Yeah supposedly all we have to do to beat Honda is hold down back. Wonder why that strategy never works with me vs Honda. I always get o-thrown, hands, sumo smashed and headbutted. Only gief scares me more up close than Honda.
Also… how bout that EX ST invincibility? By my count it was 2 AA successes out of 9 tries. And all because of the angle. You can’t use it to AA ppl landing on your head because it will get stuffed, you will whiff, or you will eat a jump in. It sure did a good job of stopping ppl from jumping in for free too eh?
Either you use it as a reversal once or twice a match or its worthless.
Again: The main use of EX ST is to react to things. With an invencible EX ST we are no longer a sitting duck regarding Jaguar Kicks and Wheel Kicks.
And it seems that you underestimate the psychological factor of an invencible EX ST.
A lot of guys are claiming that if Claw has an invencible reversal he will create a new tier.
And you claim that its worthless unless you throw it out there. C’mon.
U2 needs to be strong. I really hope they don’t nerf him. He needs to be viable for once in this series of SF. For 4 years other characters have been absolutely ridiculous, what’s wrong with yet another?
In fact, just make the whole cast ridiculous.
I noticed that any raw jump in on ex-ST will beat any move prolly 100% everytime only when used at the the latest time as possible, everytime it got stuffed as a AA it was used way too early and would get stuffed with vega feet near the max height when he flips.
So my guess on being able to win the AA situation without it getting stuffed 100% of the time is to let the opponent land in as close as possible for the I-frames to do its job. The really fast new U2 looks like it has to be treated the same way cuz of the 5f speed.
Also am im the only who noticed how fast the cosmic heel now? I like it and one situation when it was used on a cr. opponent, it was done really up close and the person blocked it, but vega instantly hopped to the other side it was kinda weird yall seen that?
edit: The hit box ex-ST might prove me wrong tho…
+1, It’s ridiculous to have an ultra straight comboable from a jab. We didn’t asked for this, 6 frames would already be quite a buff.
As for EX-ST, I-frames on it would really change Claw’s power. Now every character has an EX move invincible, or at least invincible to physical attacks. I don’t see why Claw should be the only one left appart.
The good thing with EX-ST invincible rather than having good aas, is that it does still leaves a weakness against jump when Vega does not have a charge. Vega with all time button press aa would be OP, character’s who could make their way in against such a Claw would be extremely few, even when the Vega is the attacker. With EX-ST, Vega gains a reversal plus an aa usable only while defending himself. It’s more versatile, and respects a lot more Vega’s character design.
(btw, dunno if you guy’s have seen Chun-li’s jump buff, it’s almost like if she had the best one in the game now. Maybe they wanted their locktest to be all out at first ^^)
Vega beats the hell out of tournament players, they complain “he is too strong” (translate: “he is not weak like before, so we have to think now”) and I’m in frigging Nepal, missing the whole action!
Is there an archive video for the stream or youtube video or smt I can watch when I come back?
It’s not that Iframe-Ex-ST vega won’t have matches that are tough, it’s that he will make matches HELL for a chunk of the characters. Honda seems like a great example of that, WTF is he going to do against vega? (Apparently die).
It’s so easy to see how this entire iteration of vega from the start was intended to specifically not have that sort of AA. As for the “jump on head and ST will lose” people, that’s true but in neutral, how are you going to get there with your jump arc? You are going to get around his AMAZING ground pokes to get into the prime position to jump on his head? The only time that will happen is on wakeup, which is where a lot of people wanted to use the move to begin with.
CH is being modified to attempt to avoid how it worked in Super. It became a go to move for everything. They want it to be used to jump over low OS in pressure situations, but are also hampered by the fact that it is a forwards moving +f move with low pushback. I imagine this is a constraint of Vega continuity, wanting to keep the move in and trying to find a purpose for it. +2 is just too much, I guess they feel +1 isn’t enough?
Well I suspect ppl will get around his amazing ground pokes the same way they’ve always gotten around them. Bait something that isn’t a light and jump or focus through. The only difference is that with a reliable AA they can’t just herp derp jump in completely avoiding the ground game all together making his amazing ground pokes essentially worthless.
I get 50% of my damage in a match anti airing ppl. I used to think its cause they don’t learn. Its because the reward and chance for Vega fucking up is so high that getting hit with 70 to 150 damage isn’t much of a deterrent. And I don’t blame them. Vega sucks at keeping people out in the air. Vega doesn’t suck at keeping them out on the ground. Why take the harder route? Ppl have spent the last 5 years jumping in on Vega. They have no idea how to approach from the ground. So of course its going to appear broken until someone shows up and exploits the weaknesses in Vega’s ground game.
I mean seriously what good are Vega’s pokes if the opponent refuses to and has no need to play footsies? Other than CH, cMK, and cMP none of his pokes with any decent range combo into any serious amount of damage.
I have zero problem with Vega having the ability to keep people out. I also have zero problem leaving Vega at a disadvantage once the opponent gets in. If you work your ass in you deserve the reward just like you do against sim. But letting him have BOTH weaknesses remain? Fuck no. I’ll be happy to drop this game again if that happens. I came back because there was a chance that exact issue was going to be addressed. But if I’m stuck high risk anti airing herp derp jump ins like I am now where someone gets rewarded half my life for stupid shit when I have to make fucking god like reads to win a match… see ya.
By jumping?
Oh yeah. So I guess that will be out. With an invul AA, they cannot bait a ground normal an do any sort of punish unless they jump a month and a half before you throw the poke. If you had a frame to block, that means you had a frame to invul dp, and win. The only caveat to this is if the EX ST does not end up serving as a catch all anti air, like almost every other dp in the game that is invul until the striking frame…
Good! The character was very intentionally setup to create a very airborne style of play compared to most of the other matchups in this game. Although I would say you should probably step up your pressure game just a bit of the ratio is that high.
This is correct, his incredible (and don’t fool yourself, vega has some of if not THE best ground normals in the game. We all feel like we are great at footsies when we barely have to try!) ground normals create a style of play that intended for the opponent to take to the air FAR more than in most matchups.
Standing mk is also a great poke. But you just said “Other than 3 of the best pokes in the game, what pokes does he have?” Any character in this game would kill for vega’s crouch mp, and it would make any character in the game besides vega God tier.
Good, give him a way out of pressure rather than a tool to cover all angles. We can agree on that.
I don’t understand what ground game Claw has. You can build meter from simply getting in his cr.strong poke range and waiting for it, then focus dash for meter or free damage. Or, what every player wants, focus the attack, dash forward the recovery, and jump right on top of him. True of every long range attack from him. He has no real pressure in this game, and if you don’t Focus his attacks, you can just block, with nothing lost and him stuck recovering, which also means if they blocked they’re now in range to jump on him.
Until he has EX meter, he can’t do jack shit. Without meter he’s ass. All the opponent needs to do the whole round is stand back and wait, or get in his range and Focus him or jump. His ground AA game is severely lacking, so not all his ground game is good.
I don’t even know where to begin with this guy.
I don’t know man, all I know is Vega is the most awesome character in the game. Possibly the most awesome thing in gaming.
I mean, look how long that crazy claw is. It’s so fast! Oh snap, I just canceled my poke into KKK backflip so you missed your focus! WUT! Yeah I got all kinds of crazy shit cuz I’m Vega. Are you scared mate cuz imma rip your shits up at NEC14. Nobody likes to mess with the EEEEEEOOOOOOOOOOO
If there was no Vega in SF4, I wouldn’t play it.
Vega is the fucking boss of the world.