Why a better forward dash, cody his forward dash is already really good.
Just a thought: EX bingo trajectory change like Juri’s EX fireball change or her FSE EX Dive kick change. One version cody goes slightly backward, another he stays stationary, and the other he moves forward as he normally does now. Why? this would help his wakeup game BIGTIME. Yes it may sound ridiculous, but why not? Cody has such a bad wake up game that this might reward the player for reading his opponent. Many times on wake up I’ll EX bingo and move forward but it would be nice for the opponent to land right into me on wake up. Either way obviously you would loose to meaty attacks on wake up but this could be usuful for zoning and baiting as well. Startup frames would not change, but this may help Cody out of sticky vortex like Akumas or Ibukis. Anyways, maybe I had to much Jack Daniels but that would be fun.
FASTER backward speed and backdash would be great. No one has thought of having all versions of Ruffian Kick Special Cancellable? rose can cancel slide, bison can cancel slide, and cody stays on the ground in all versions. It would be great for pressure and take more risks. It would be if bingo was not a charge move, so once could react better to fireballs, but I would rather EX CU to be more usuful. Knife pick up should be 3 kick buttons instead of Punch. I can’t count the times I have picked up the knife by accident. But Airborne crack kick is great and HK ruffian should trade less, have a faster start up along with fake rocks so this set up could be used more often. It’s just not worth the risk to Fake stone / HK ruffian because unless you are completely full screen away you loose to RYU’s walk back jumping foward into death sentence. That whole bad stone fix would help Cody so much to zone to compensate for his horrifying wake up game.
Here is some stuff to consider that are unthrowable and can lead to ~250+ damage while also being safe on block:
Rufus IADive Kick (obvious)
Rose close MK (not quite as much damage unless she FADCs but is unthrowable ENTIRE duration.)
Sakura LK Tatsu / EX Tatsu
Evil Ryu Hop Kick
Viper HK Burn Kick (grounded) IABurn Kick
Makoto IA Axe Kick
Chun Li MK Hazanshu
Vega Down Forward HK
Dudley LP SSB / EX SSB
Fei Long HK / EX Chicken Wing
Akuma / Gouken demon flip dive kick
It’s not exactly unprecedented.
I’m on my phone but we don’t really need knife changes, forget em.
However I do agree with the ex crim changes and a better backdash.
The crack kick is fine as is, no otg, raising the hurt box abit higher would be better/easier at avoiding lows but for those who want it completely airborne, cody should not be crack kicking at a range where he could get thrown anyways.
Now I’m 100% some of the top tiers will recieve some nerfs, alot of those nerfs will be beneficial towards cody and alot of the cast. Asking for too many buffs for a character who is IMO one of the more extremely balanced characters is too much when it’s certain alot of the top tiers will be receiving nerfs towards their pressure game to make Cody’s wake up game more bearable.
So basically, ex crim hit/throw invincible till first active frame.
Backdash range increased.
I think you are forgetting that it isn’t just about not being throwable. Also I don’t think anyone here wants it airborne from startup to finish just the same as in SFxT/Alpha 3 from 8F - finish meaning you can be thrown out of the startup.
Here is a good example why Cody should have crack kick airborne:
3:45 the Sako (Evil Ryu) vs Sasaki (Cody) match starts. Most of the match Sasaki is trying (and failing) to get around Evil Ryu’s cMK which is better than any of Cody’s pokes and shuts down 90% of his ground game in the match. Due to not hitting crouching the best Sasaki is able to get out of crack kick is to get in close and then immediately get pushed out by E Ryu’s cLP/cMP. At 4:54 Sasaki once again goes for a crack kick (which misses because Sako simply crouches) and because of Sako’s quick reactions Sasaki eats a 350 damage combo that while costing 2 bars also built back 1 bar and put Sasaki in the corner.
With Crack Kick airborne getting hit by that c.MP would have air reset Cody instead meaning that while you lose positioning you’d only lose significantly less health for a move that can be avoided simply by crouching. Even if you adjust the hurtbox unless you made it end at higher than cody’s groin you’d still get hit by a lot of lows (all slides, Cammy’s spiral arrow up close, ect.) not to mention all of the crouching attacks that aren’t lows that would still beat it clean (everything.)
Ah I see, good example. So where Sako punished with cr.mp would have been an air reset if they implemented the changes you mention? Not a bad one. I’d be okaaaaaaaaaaaay with that. I gotta say though Sako naturally just has great reactions and footsies, he anticipated everything Sasaki would do, although Sasaki has been leveling up quite noticeably and I’d definitely like to see a runback.
Yeah, when you also consider that Cody has no way to alter his jump arc at all, and the 4th slowest overall forward jumping normal startup (Yes, I did the math. Cody’s AVERAGE startup for a forward jumping attack is 7.5F with 7.16F active frames. The only characters SLOWER are Sagat 7.66F with 7.16F active average, Zangief (8.16F startup 5.66F active), and Dhalsim Stretched limbs (9.16startup 5.16F active) it’s a bit important for Cody to have an approach tool that doesn’t result in a MASSIVE punish even if the timing is strict.
(If you are curious Cody’s isn’t even in the top 5 for most active frames either (he is tied for 7th with Sagat and Dhalsim (Short limbs). Dudley, Deejay, Elfuerte, Bison, Yun and Hakan have more active frames. so it’s not like he makes up for being the 4th slowest in the game on startup, and he certainly has worse hitboxes than any of the people slower.
///
Buffs:
Faster walk speed
Faster Back dash / forward dash
airborne crack kick
LP Criminal Upper made -3F on block
Fake Badstone made faster
Knife chip damage increased
c.HP/s.MP with knife special cancelable
2F faster startup on badstone (all versions except EX)
EX Criminal Upper strike invincible until first active frame
EX Ruffian Kick projectile invincible sooner
HK Ruffian Recovery reduced OR startup reduced and hurtbox shrunk to be a better anti air. (IMO it should either be a good juggle tool though better recovery. Or they need to make it a viable anti air by shrinking his hurtbox and reducing the startup. Right now it isn’t really good at either job.)
c.MP made +5F on hit
cls.HP startup reduced to 7F
far MP made special cancelable
Things that could count as buffs or nerfs but should be fixed:
hitbox/Hurtbox on far MK with knife and without knife
bMP unable to be counterhit
Being able to release badstone between charge levels
Level 2 and level 3 HP badstone recovery/startup numbers fixed (Currently 7F longer startup 14F less recovery making it +16F on hit)
Ultra 2 not breaking counters/focus (and when the dust counters a fireball making it so that the opponent can recover from the dust ON HIT and block the wrench part which is super annoying to have happen.)
Super Combo randomly dropping people
Crouching knife attacks not properly being crouching attacks
Badspray from face up position given the same recovery as badspray from face down position
Dream Change:
Add LP LP MP HP Final Fight Chain Combo and jump + down MK knee drop.
Obviously he doesn’t need ALL of these at once, but I figure it is better to ask for these things and hope that they consider each one on it’s individual merits that way you at least get SOME of what you wanted.
@Eternal I agree with your suggestions, they are very good and well thought out. I also think that the crackkick not being instantly airborne but still airborne, is actually a good idea. A better idea than to only raise the hurtbox. I don’t understand why you would want the criminal upper lp version to be -3? I think it’s good that it’s a bit more punishable.
At -3F it gives Cody one option to cancel to that isn’t easily punished allowing him safer chip options on blocking opponents. Badstone can’t really be canceled into safely for chip due to the long startup and all of Cody’s specials are unsafe on block. -3F on LP Criminal Upper would be enough to give him A chip option. This is especially helpful in the Ryu match as even at max range a LP CU can be swept for a punish.
The other thing to remember is that Cody’s main ways to cancel into LP CU are c.LK (not a true block string has enough of a gap for an invincible reversal between LK - CU) c.MP (often doesn’t reach the opponent with the CU at all due to how Cody positions himself farther back when canceling a c.MP) and c.LP (also not a true blockstring) that only leaves c.HP which is unsafe to whiff that close (total frame count of 26F with 16F of it as recovery and it is a 7F startup normal)
Basically this would turn c.LK - LP CU into the same thing as Akuma doing c.MK - Hadoken or Yun doing c.LK - Shoulder Slam except Cody would have the advantage of the multi hit move breaking armor, while having the disadvantage of a much larger hurtbox on LP CU than most characters (Cody’s extended arm is vulnerable during the entire move, so he is almost 20% wider and 60% taller on his hurtbox during CU)
I understand that. Why not -4 then?
So the most common named wishes:
-Crackkick airborne (meaning throw invincible) - potentially low invulnerable / better hurtbox. [I think both could start from frame 5 or so]
-Better Backdash
-Fake Badstone A LOT faster
-EX Criminal Upper strike invincibility until up to (and including) first active frame
-EX Ruffian Projectile invincibility from frame 1.
I think everyone should mention these when the poll comes up.
Thinking about it, I’d like to see far s.MK’s start up buffed by 1F. I don’t think we will get yet another forward walkspeed buff. Cody is designed to be slow.
@zukuu I would personally rather have his far s.MK simply have it’s hurtbox/hitbox improved. Currently the hitbox ends at his ankle and the hurtbox is I believe the 3rd or 4th widest hurtbox in the game outside of sim’s stretches. It is wider than Rufus’s c.HP hurtbox and taller too.
@ostkatten -4F would be fine too tbh, I just think it should be safer than -5F. -4F is still a bit unsafe but at least then he couldn’t be swept by ryu or Sakura’s c.MK
Lots of good suggestions. I’m not sure why people think the knife should be ignored though - Cody received buffs with and without the knife in the last update, so why can’t the same thing happen again? Certainly I think it’s pretty obvious that the knife still has major problems.
ya i like zukuu suggestions. also st.mk buff is good. It would help a lot against ryu and other shotos because it moves cody out of range from ryu’s crouching forward during footsies but usually if they jump it is punishable because recovery is really slow so you need to commit. I also think they should leave cody’s forward dash alone. He’s no makoto. Also since he got a walkspeed buff last update it would be more practically for them to give us better normals for footsies.
I actually wouldn’t mind if they left his forward speed alone, but made his backward walk faster. That alone would help his footsies.
I like alot of these suggestions, would a better backdash be too much to ask? It can be better in any way…just…better lol
But still punishable by Claw’s cr.MP :).
I do think it should be at least either -1 or -2. Not neutral or on plus frames because that would be ridiculous considering his 3 frame cr.lk but enough so that you get a safish way to chip the opponent. “Safish” because there would still be a gap in the blockstring, allowing for big punishes you’re attempt is read by the other player.
Also, I know it’s a lot to ask for but I would love it if Ultra 2 connected on airborn opponent in order to make it safer even if it means little to almost no damage.
Making his crane kick airbourne would be crazy, would blow up throws far too well.
I think Cody is fine the way he is, all this update should do is remove that ambiguous unblockable shit.
However I would LOVE a faster/more invincible/more airborne backdash.
If you HAD to buff Cody, improving anti-air hitbox on HK ruffian would be good, also making bad stone act normally is a good idea.
1)- I don’t know what is the actual hitbox of HK Ruffian Kick:
or
(from the thread forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/103496/cody-hitbox-data-screens
BUT it trades or gets beaten, A LOT.
Considering that this move can’t hit crouching opponents at all, it should be a better anti-air:
-The hitbox should be adjusted, or the move should be faster (now it’s 7 frames, quite slow), or something needs to be done to this move.
It’s use in combos won’t be affected by those changes.
2)- Charge bad stone to release inmediately on button release.
3)- Fake bad stone recovery faster, or cancellable after some frame into moves or normals.
4)- Something to improve cr.mk, to make it easier and reliable to slide under fireballs.
To me, this is what i need.
Of course that an improve to crack kick would be great,
or make normal bingo punch FADCable on hit (still looses vs low hitting moves)…
…but honestly, i don’t think they would do nothing to cody.