What would you want for Cody (within reason of course) if there is ever a version 2013?
For me:
Overall walk speed increased to equal Zangief/Juri
Crack kick made airborne
c.MK slight distance buff and hurtbox adjustments (for example make the raised leg projectile invincible)
b-MP puts opponent in juggle state on airborne hit (probably would need a damage nerf in exchange)
Hurtbox/hitbox adjustments to HK Ruffian to make it trade or lose less often and whiff less often on characters with higher jumps. Also 3-4F less recovery time to make HK Ruffian-MK Ruffian easier and more consistent
EX Criminal Upper given +3F more invincibility on startup.
forward jump LK crossup on all characters.
Badstone reduced to 27F startup
Fake badstone reduced to 25F total
I personally don’t want a v2013. I think the game is fine the way it is. At the very most, I would hit Fei and Cammy with a few small nerfs. The game is pretty balanced. But, since it is a wishlist thread:
Walk Speed Buff: for footsies
Knife Combos: more cancelable normals with knife
Airborne Crack Kick: for corpse hopping.
That’s it really. I enjoy Cody as he is. Maybe ex criminal upper as a better reversal, but it is going to be subject to the same weaknesses of ex zonk. Ex zonk is still a good reversal.
Ah yes one last thing I thought of that is less of a buff, more of a functionality change:
Make Badstone function like EVERY SINGLE OTHER CHARGEABLE MOVE IN THE GAME. When you release the button, the strength you currently have immediately happens.
Right now it works like this: When you hold the rocks, it waits until your NEXT level to release it.
So for example, if you hold the badstone for even 1F longer than the earliest you can release it (22F is the earliest you can go into the “release” animation which is 7F) so if you hold the button for 23F, rather than releasing the badstone right then and giving you the level 1 badstone. It waits until the next level to release the badstone, which isn’t until frame 45. That means that the badstone wont release until frame 52 which kind of defeats the purpose of being able to delay it to mess with jumps since that is longer than the longest jump duration.
And badstone is the ONLY chargeable move that functions this way. Sakura/Gouken/Oni’s fireballs, Cody’s Zonk Knuckle, Balrog’s TAP, Focus Attacks, El Fuerte’s Quesadilla bomb all function in the more logical “when you release the button the move stops charging and is performed as-is.”
Badstone didn’t function like this in Alpha, but then again in Alpha not only was badstone MUCH stronger, but there was a lot more levels you could charge it. It didn’t have 3 levels, it had 12 levels.
NOO dont nerf cammy im starting to learn her. jk but i everything you posted is all i want. airborn crack kick for corpse hops and throw baits, never though about knife combos but it would be nice to see used more and his walk speed is so bad. I much prefer cammy vs gief than cody vs gief because my spacing doesnt need to be fucking ace in the hole perfect [so easy so wiff punish and step in poke.
The bad stone points sounds pretty good also.
My addition: Make super do more damage or make it never drop opponents. i feel like execpt for a match ender if you have execution there is no point in ever using the super. no stun and i could do the same damage with a combo -60-80 damage.
ex. Why do a punish with cr fp xx hk ruffian xx super when you can lose 60-80 damage while gaining 500-600 stun and a bar of meter. [cl fp cr mp xx RH ruffian fadc Crack kick to ex CU].
ill tell you when, only on set closers and thats it. And who wants to use that shit as and anti air when you might drop out.
At least ryu and sagat supers have like a 2-3 frame startup so you can do unique punishes.
Heres what I want, including some good idea’s from you guys:
Faster walkspeed.
[LIST]
[]Backdash moves further back possibly slightly less recovery.
[]Increased sweep horizontal hitbox.
[]Airborn crack kick.
[]Cr mk made to go further and have better AA capabilities.
[]Ex ruffian to have projectile invincibility closer to start up (not on start up but a bit closer to it would be nice).
[]That stone charge thing (even though I don’t fully understand it lol.)
[]Fake badstone reduced recovery (as soon as he’s finished standing the recovery is finished).
[]And for gods sake please make the knife pickup down and 3 kicks or something.
[/LIST]
The amount of times I’ve triple plinked and picked up the knife, or even tried to link into ultra and picked it up is rediculous.
Can’t really think of anything else, I don’t really want him to have a solid reversal option really, if he get’s all
of these he’s bound to be nerfed in some capacity… so I’d say nerf the knife. >:]
Personally I think Cody’s sweep has really good horizontal range already, the only real downside is that he doesn’t have many long range link to sweep combos. (I don’t know why his s.LP isn’t +4/+7 I mean come on, his jab having tons of frame advantage is one of, if not THE MOST iconic thing about him. Anyone who has played Final Fight knows Jab Jab - Turn around gut punch - turn around jab jab. His infinite jab combo is so iconic that they made Final Destruction do it in Alpha 3, and if you chose X-ism mode you could do it yourself (It was a pretty tough link but when you are in x-ism super mode you can do jab jab - turn around - jab jab - turn around for a low damage semi-infinite that lasts until the super wears off.)
If you ask me, the only person in the game who should have a jab on par with Cody is Balrog. But that is just me ranting about character identity rather than balance lol.
Anyways, the reason I want a better HK Ruffian and B-MP is because Cody is free to jump-ins on wakeup as we all know, and thus jumping in on him while he is standing should be a bit scarier. Go watch any video of Sasaki or Momochi and you’ll notice that around 80% of the time they simply do a slide and avoid trying to beat the jump in at all because b-MP is only good for directly above and in front of you, and HK Ruffian is too unreliable. Unless it is the Zangief/THawk matchup and then they still almost never use HK Ruffian but use far s.HP/s.HK a lot because they are good anti airs and Zangief and THawk are the only characters who the moves will hit crouching.
Heck if you watch the videos of Sasaki or Momochi you’ll notice a few things about Cody
A LOT of their offense is based on things many characters can do just as well:
Most offense are things like empty jump - low, dash up throw, jab - tic throw, forward jump heavy kick, walk up throw, walking backwards and forwards on an opponents wakeup to try and bait a move.
Cody’s badstone rarely ever hits due to the long startup and is mostly used as simply a long range “check” to get them to block for a moment, thus stun damage is pretty pointless.
On the rare occasions that they use Zonk to avoid a fireball at mid range it is always punished via sweep on whiff or block due the 26F recovery.
When they do use HK Ruffian for an anti air it almost always trades if it doesn’t counterhit the startup of the opponents attack.
Both Sasaki and Momochi whiff b-mp occasionally at the range we all do, directly in front of Cody because only the first frame of b-mp hits in front of Cody the 2nd-4th are only directly above Cody.
they NEVER use super.
Simple way for you to understand it: Go into training mode, throw a LP badstone. Then do a LP badstone and let go of the button the moment Cody toss the rocks up in his hand while waiting and look at how long after you let go of the button it takes before Cody actually throws the rocks. Then pick Sakura, do a hadoken. Do a hadoken but hold down the button for just a moment longer and let go, see how long after you let go of the button before Sakura releases the fireball.
Ohh I get you now, the way he juggles the rock before throwing it, yeah that is kind of stupid really :/. The reason I was talking about the horizontal hitbox on sweep was mainly for whiff punishing, but it would probably be slightly easier with increased walkspeed anyway. I suppose stomach blow could be a better whiff punish on certain moves anyway. Got to agree with the anti air hk ruffian too, not a fan of using it because of the trade (although I managed to get trade into u1 in the corner recently ;D ), it still gets flat out beat by alot of stuff. I can remember when I started playing cody in super I said I wanted it to be invincible and have 4 frame start up (lol I was such a scrub).
But yeah generally agree with you there pal, would also maybe like a slight damage buff on the rocks :(.
I personally wouldn’t change anything but his walkspeed. I believe Cody and Gief have identical walkspeeds already. And if I had to throw in one more itd be crack kick airborne. But that’d be too much already
EDIT : I should’ve posted my reason why I only wanted a faster walkspeed, simply because it would boost everyone of his normals/frametrap significantly depending on the increase buff of his walkspeed. Crack kick airborne would give him better ways to get in and also throw bait, hop over and make specific low forwards whiff (ex: ryus cr.mk) crack kick being +1 on block is already good enough to restart pressure incase the opponent decides to stand block.
I can understand why you’d think Cody walks the same speed as Gief. Cody’s forward walk speed is faster than Gief (Cody is 0.038 forward walk speed, Zangief’s is 0.035. Juri is 0.035 and Ken is 0.04 for a comparison.) however Cody’s BACKWARDS walk speed is worse than Gief’s (Cody’s backwards walk speed is 0.024, Zangief’s is 0.03, Ken’s is 0.03, Juri’s is 0.03)
So as you can see, when you take the forwards and backwards walk speeds together, Cody is worse than Zangief. I’d like to see Cody have either 0.038 forward, 0.027 backward. OR 0.039 forward 0.026 backward
Cody = 38 forward, 24 backward = 62 total
Zangief = 35forward, 30 backward = 65 total
Juri = 35forward, 30 backward = 65 total
Ken = 40 forward 30 backward = 70 total
I just want Cody to be up to Zangief/Juri overall walk speed. Backwards walk speed would help him space his anti airs and footsies better, forward walk speed would help his frame traps and tic throws.
Good to know Eternal, and exactly! All the criminal really needs is to walk a bit faster, just enough so he can utilize his overall moveset abit better. He already has a tool for almost every situation its just, well, their **situational lol. **And if I were to choose between forward or backwards I’d take backwards to compensate for his backdash (more like backstep)
EDIT : Just thought of another sick buff/change that they could consider giving to Cody, his Alpha Rocks! Change the trajectory at which the rocks are thrown. Just look up Cody in Alpha 3 and you can see how useful it’d be in his zoning game.
You mean how the rocks came out from around head height and would fly over fireballs until they started losing altitude? Yeah, on one hand that would be good, on the other hand it would be bad. It would make stopping fireballs with a badstone even harder, and it would make it even easier for characters to lower their hurtbox and dodge the badstone (in Alpha you could actually just crouch at certain ranges and it’d go over.) but it would allow Cody to take advantage of the opponents longer recovery time on fireballs via throwing a badstone over their fireball to hit them while they recover and then using his faster recovery time to block the incoming fireball making him only take chip damage.
Plus having the badstones come out higher makes them usable as a sort of anti-air since they are harder to jump over.
It’s a bit of a trade off I dunno which is better. That said, I do think that the knife should come out higher up or just go through fireballs like it did in Alpha, losing to fireballs AND strikes is too much for a move with such strict requirements for usage (have to get the knife, can’t combo into it, and it has a 26F startup)
If there was ANYTHING from Alpha I wish Cody had that he lost it is the V-ism sidestep. It was such a unique move that added a lot to Cody’s ability to approach characters with long pokes or fireballs.
The more i think about it the more the rocks with different height seems sick. i never played alpha 3 and every time i look up vids its just stupid terrible shit when i try to find cody vids. does anyone have any vids of actual play between experienced players? i dont think iv ever seen a good alpha 3 vid while ST and 3rd strike vids are easy as hell to find
Posted this in the AE Rebalance request thread in regards to if there is ever a v2013:
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Shoulda added ‘a 3 frame dp with invincibility’ on the dream list for giggles, lol. I agree with what changes we gotta have, and tbh I don’t even think the ‘must have’ section is asking for much. Basically we’re asking for enhanced tools that would finally set cody apart from others that can pretty much do what he can do.
If you want Cody to have faster walk speed (as pretty much everyone in here requested) go to the AE Rebalance thread in the main section and argue your case because they seem to think otherwise.
I like most of the proposed changes. I don’t think that HK RK should be changed, though.
Some people were mentioning how better speed would increase Cody’s already great AA options.
Would that even be needed if Crack kick was airborne? It would give you a nice little combo if you catch the opponent who is empty jumping. And even if you get hit out of it, you would not have to worry, as you would only be reseted from the air.
I would really like to have a super that is a few frames faster :). Right now, I use it only when I want to be flashy.