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No I don’t think Oni is one of the worst characters in the game. Considering his changes, the 6 gods had him about right. C tier. I do agree that for Wao to drop Oni, that does say a lot. He played him since AE vanilla when he came out, and when you look at his character history has never been a tier guy. He must believe Oni is bad enough that it isn’t worth it anymore, that is what his posts say. As far as tournament viability Oni in AE 2012 he was so so. Match up wise he was definitely on the lower end of the spectrum however. I do think it is a crock of bull when Capcom decides to nerf any character that isn’t top tier. It is bad enough for top tiers, but inexcusable to do it to anyone below that. Though I guess Oni is one of the characters that aren’t allowed to be complained about…even though most people here complain about their own characters. Oh yeah, and most aren’t exactly playing Dan or Deejay either (truly horrible characters).
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With that I would like to thank the few who break the trend and uplay their characters. Oilforthewin with Hakan, Emanualb with Honda. The few who don’t downplay their characters: Veserius, HNIC mike, Yorkey, da knut, and AlextheKing. Might be forgetting a few, but most everyone here complains about their own characters so if you don’t like others doing it, practice what you preach.
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As far as blaming personal performance on a character, that is nonsense. Cause everyone has the freedom to choose whoever they want, no one
is locked or forced to play a certain character. -
One last note on Deejay…it is by far the greatest atrocity committed in this balance update. Capcom takes a character who literally couldn’t compete in AE 2012, unlike most other characters, and they decided to make him worse. So Deejay players deserve to complain more than anyone. A damn shame too, cause Deejay was one of my favorites in SSF2 and ST…he was a lot of fun to play, great design…the best of the ‘new challengers’ introduced in SSF2. A design that could have easily been made to excel in SF4, without slowing the game down or any other feared side effects.
I think a lot of this backlash shit has to do with how the oni players were pre ultra. Like pretty much the forums were quiet to begin with(almost dead), lack of players from the start will do that, and I think given who capcom decided to make the “face” of ultra we all thought omg combofriend yes! You couldnt do much to fuck oni up even more then he already was right? He was already mid tier at best along with his AE compatriot evil ryu.
Ultra drops and now look its like wtf man, a lot of the other mid tiers got cool buffs that changed how they play or just got straight up better, oni who not a lot of ppl played to begin with stayed…the same/worse? Knee jerk reaction is now “yo fuck being quiet time to complain, i dont wanna get nerfed again”
my 2 cents. its not the autism jabs you guys are joking and trolling about.
You just earned yourself a new friend.
I never said he was bad broski, I even said “I am by no means calling Oni a BAD character”. I just don’t think he’s solid - The things he does well he does well, but the things he doesn’t do well are borderline terrible (like the things I said before). Also I mentioned E.Ryu because of what Oilforthewin said but didn’t feel like having a massive quote stack lol. As per the comparison though E.Ryu falls into many of the same categories as Oni such as aggression based, combo heavy glass cannon shoto character, which Is why I think he’s a pretty good contrast between the two and why it would be a logical step to prefer playing E.Ryu over Oni while keeping the same typical style.
Most DJ players are not complainers. We are sick of people trying to tell us that our character is good or unexplored. It’s annoying.
But we are pissed that Capcom waited til the last minute to nerf him . The arcade version of DJ was going to be low-mid tier.
I don’t get why people play DeeJay when Guile is essentially the exact same core gameplay (turtle with strong AAs) but has been a much better character for 4 years.
It’s like torturing yourself.
The “bad” part was more directed at the other posters who do seem to think he is a legit bad character.
To me, comparing E.Ryu and Oni is like comparing Ryu and Ken. Yeah of course they have the same basic toolset, but they are played MUCH differently thanks to the rest of their unique tools.
But again, I digress, I know your mind is set on this opinion so my thoughts are useless to Oni mains.
maybe they dont like how all guiles tools are more focused on defense. deejay can turtle, but his design is supposed to be the offensive version of the slow fireball charge character
Legit bad characters…well in AE 2012 there are only a few I would call that.
Dhalsim, Dan, T hawk, Blanka, DJ, probably El Fuerte. The rest could compete, though obviously some were better than others. Doesn’t mean that people were or should be perfectly happy with their characters (especially in SF4 which compared to other fighting games characters in general are much weaker).
Dhalsim and T.Hawk could compete, they just weren’t great because of some sucky match ups, it’s not like they were as bad as DeeJay.
Wasn’t Oni supposed to get better in Ultra?
They think they did.
Fuerte wasn’t that bad
Eh he was but so was everyone else, nothing but buffs they said, make everyone awesome they said. Its a moot point now, i’ve been talking about it with my brothers for a while and we’ve come to the conclusion that combofriend was just a face. Someone to get the trust of the community. The real balance changes were probably made by japanese businessmen after a night of drinking. o well. Its a shame that combofriends name is attached to some of this shit I really liked the dude he was funny to listen to comentate and shit talk other people while he played.
I think they did a fine job with most of the shotos
-ken they gave the world to, he finally won a major.
-gouken they did a good job but they could have fixed the hitbox on his tatsu/ex tatsu better as people still phase through it if jumped in on.
-Ryu…wtf, jump mp into tatsu really…not even the cool version like the one we saw in the modded sf4 it ended up being some straight up knockdown bullshit. Couldnt even make his crouch mk like it was in vanilla or make mk into fireball a true string tisk tisk.
-akuma idk, coming from an oni player where the whole match is me blocking a bunch of stand hks all day into random touch into U2 combo I think akumas fine? apparently he got shit on vs everyone else, it makes sense that the matchup for oni akuma is the same he never could truly vortex oni the same he could do to others, his whole pressure was knockdown into wiff palms front or back and just kiting oni all over the place. idk this probably is an issue of akumas other matchups getting buffs and dwu screwing over the people he could control and not giving him more health to compensate and more damage for the damage everyone else is getting.
-Evil hes fine. edit- disregard what I wrote here earlier but i still feel that if you moved the true mk fireball string to ryu more people would play ryu instead of evil and evil would still be relatively strong.
-oni wtf, give him the same dp properties as everyone else, fix his forward mk hitbox so chars cant low profile it and make it 0 on block and revert the frames to pre ultra to compensate. increase the hitstun on his stand lk and crouch mk so that fireball fadc wont randomly drop at certain ranges in crucial match up punishes(blocked soul spiral from rose can only be punished with stand lk into tatsu as of right now i believe, and its a tight punish too). Give him a faster walk speed so people just cant keep zoning and spacing him out till he dies, you can nerf his kara throw range to compensate for this, akuma has a kara throw too and even though its ass combined with his walk speed makes him almost equivalent to oni in terms of throws+he sets stuff off of it.
sounds fair and not broken right?
dan-for who hes supposed to be hes fine, i thought that command -edit close hk was genius to give him, it gives him so much more damage options up close. The buff to dan kicks was solid too. buffs to his fireball game were solid even though its still ass. Give him more damage on his dp fadc ultra and make his fireballs travel farther.
sakura-fuck that bitch she can go die shes still good.
-edit I included gouken and sakura for completion sake.
Evil ryu has had that since vanilla AE brah, and its true string at all ranges.
And sakura and gouken are not shotos lol
Yeah my bad what i meant to say was http://www.airryu.com/the-bad-match-ups-of-evil-ryu-that-daigo-approved/ , basically you have to space your mk fireballs max distance to be safe, and have to react to the mk hit or block and if cancelled too late it wont be a string.
BTW about Oni players downplaying their character, what about Sanford? He was the guy who called Oni really strong, and even tweeted after Wao’s successes that Oni is top 10. So that line of reasoning doesn’t really fly concerning him. (Can’t be used with Wao either IMO, but whatever).
July 28th
July 30th
So what…from top 10 to now not even worth playing? I guess Sanford and Wao don’t know Oni very well though, they should just hit training mode more.
Wait wasn’t Mago going to switch to Oni as well? He was playing him almost exclusively for many months before Ultra dropped. Ultra only made Oni slightly worse though right? So why has Mago left the character completely?
Just link the tweet, it will appear, nothing else needed format wise
followed by
july 31st @FiggyCal I will use Oni for certain match ups but i will be MAINING Ken Masters
but really for anyones own PERSONAL gaming experience it doesnt matter what the pros choose to use or not use. its their perogative to use stronger chars. It sucks for me as a VIEWER of the game, now i only have omh bodying europeans on youtube highlights to watch.
Its their JOB to win, they are getting sponsored to win. They dont get sponsored for fighting the good fight and having character loyalty, results matter if your sponsored. If you dont produce tournament results you will be dropped. Good for sanford.
Meanwhile in the non-cherry picking fields. This is less about Oni now, and more about distorting the views of a specific player to suit your arguments. Maybe Sanford is wrong. Maybe he is right. Maybe Wao is wrong. Maybe Wao is right. At least post the rest of their statements related to the topic at hand. Don’t pull a Kotaku.