Daigo has been way off, such as Gief top tier. Evil Ryu has no future, etc.
He’s also said Cammy, Akuma and Ryu were the best in 2012, and most people laughed. Well lol @ every person who cried about getting roflstomped by Akuma and Cammy.
I usually agree with Alioune, except for Bison. His judgement is always based on salt from his matches with Gagapa.
Viper probably more well rounded than Evil Ryu cause of her wakeup. ER has a -5 dp and bad teleport.
ELF improved is EX Q-Bomb is nuts. Beats afaik all wakeup options of Viper. Should be higher on that list, Dudley and Hakan also a bit higher.
My opinion on Dictator has always been from someone who used to play the character since vanilla, and Ive been good with him way before Gagapa. Not from conspirationist salt from my matches against someone (I beat alot for 5 years now). Keep assuming things.
Anyway, I dont care about Bison anymore so im not bothered where he ends up. Im more interested in your Ryu and Yang placements.
Btw guys in Alioune’s tweet he said it’ll probably change in a week he just wanted a frame of reference as a starting point.
Edit: Nvm didn’t see his post. Just ask him yourself I guess lol
At first I was thinking that Yang wasnt getting much stronger in the absolute. Walkspeed, mk crossup, st lk 4fr and far mp mostly are meh on paper.
But I think most of the stronger characters got weaker /or are more affected by the system mechanics negatively. Delayed wakeup ends up benefiting him. Makes his safe neutral game much more relevant because he doesnt mind getting hard knockdowned now.
He deals well with the new characters and the walkspeed buff with his 2 normals buffs is kind of a big deal in match.(Alot of situations where cr mk would whiff against focus attacks or lack the range like against Makoto Seth Sakura etc…, he can use far mp now).
Also the fact that he keeps his 3f crouch tech is kind of huge considering all of the strongest characters lost it.
Good points that I can agree with. Surprised about Guy, but I havent seen much. I think people were riding on the 2f reversal that was removed pretty early. I saw a lot of Guy top 5-10 claims.
I’m curious for your thoughts on why you rate Poison so much better than Decapre? They both look good mid tier but Decapre seems to have way safer pressure/normals and mixup game. Poison has the excellent fireball game but poor frame advantage overall?
Also, why Hakan so low now that he is better unoiled and gets more chance to oil up overall?
That’s what i’m talking about, we need more top players posting on srk. I would be very curious to hear your views on Seth if he’s still a decent character and if the new mechanics affect him negatively.
Hakan unpopular and forgotten tier. I believe Seth is still there, he still gives a fair number of characters problems.
Sakura still has 3F crouching LK that can be chained into itself and leads to a full combo easily with crLK - crLK - LP - crMK Shooken. Also far MP is useful for Yang because it moves him forward when canceled from so it lets him do things like farMP - Palm - Red Focus which would whiff with a max range crMK - Palm - EX RF. MK Crossup is hardly “meh on paper” on paper it’s even better than in practice, it’s one of the only options Yang was lacking a consistent tool for. Now his dive kick game got stronger because he can do crossups from same position a dive kick would hit in front.
I agree that many stronger characters got hurt by DWU, though I really am starting to think that people will quickly adapt and the weakening may be mostly temporary.
Scientist and frame Data himself in the same thread. Oh shi-
Also nice of Infiltration to show Akuma is still up there. Doesn’t need to heavily rely on vortex, he’s also been using that far st.hp buff a lot.
I think it’s a pretty good list. I’d change a few things like I’d swap Juri with ibuki but can understand why things are the way they are. The two I would like some more info on are Dudley and especially Hakan. I haven’t had much interaction with Dudley but stuff like catching backdash with f+hp into full combos make me feel he’s crazy scary. I think he was slept on too much in ae. Is Hakan just hurt by dwu that much? I know it messes with oil dive stuff but…
DWU hurts hakan but his neutral game got so much better and Hakan can do decently well with just resets and punishes now that his punishes can break 300 easily and he still has the threat of FADNC and SPD to back up his pressure game. I can still see areas he is lacking (heavily due to walk speed). Like most grapplers he is going to be match up dependent which depending on your views could keep him low tier.
Here is the big question, how important is it that the character has few disadvantaged match ups? If a character does extremely well against a bunch of characters but poorly against others is he lower tier than another character who doesn’t really excel or fail too badly in most matchups?
I agree with Alioune’s Sagat placement, dead center because he’s winning a bunch of matches but he’s losing a bunch too. Evens itself out, decent all rounder but too many problems against top characters.
Fei Long I’m still unsure of, he could be that low, a lot of his old pressure is gone now, especially to cover back dashes. He’s much more footsie based now, his pressure is not as good therefore people are harder to trap. Most of his combo buffs are too character specific and too distance dependant to really make an impact.
I think the only one I would maybe disagree with is Akuma being top now, he’s still good, I’m just not sure if he’s THAT good. He could be though, I’m just not sure if his low health is good enough in these longer rounds.
DWU helps him, as much as it hurts him. Don´t forget the oilup.
Just many other chars received useful and working buffs, whereas some of his would have been very useful buffs(cr lk, crossup and st.mp) are … how should I say it, ended up very shitty(Too situational). Not really making a huge impact imo.
While many others improved heavily, he did not that much.
I would be more upset about ex q bomb, but I hear it has an 8 second charge time.
Can’t just bust it out at will on offense or defense
heard wrong. 210F = 3.5second charge time. Less than the time it takes Balrog to do a level 3 TAP.
Guy and Hakan stick out for me. Gouken too probably, dunno why they gave him a 3 frame jab.
3 frame short is very good indeed, but with jab tech, losing the 3 frame short is not that big of a deal imo.