Idk yet… I haven’t seen much Fei or yun really =[. They still look like they will be good from the 2-3 minutes or so I’ve seen of each but I wish someone had played him on the yubiken stream or something.
Anyone get a chance to see how Sakura’s jf.hp got nerfed? Wondering if it’s still a fist of god
Looks nerfed. I’ve seen characters who at best could only trade with that BS jump in beat it clean now (roses cr.hp for example).
In this iteration it’s status quo really since safe reversals are the standard. Honda just gets the most use out of it in a lot of match ups.
I play a character who can deal with Honda more because I have the neutral game and oki game in my advantage, but when I’ve played against Honda with characters like T-Hawk it really really sucks. The headbutt becomes a nightmare to deal with.
IMO Honda as a character needed some buffs in the other areas in exchange for the headbutt being more punishable.
If I block it I can’t punish it, and he gets out for free.
That’s advantageous for Honda too, that’s kind of the whole point of the discussion.
Yo hawk might be low-tier now instead of bottom 10.
My friend in Japan told me it’s still good, just not godlike anymore, still stuffs a lot of moves.
I hope people know that they can focus condor spire…
And Red Focus the whole string.
It depends on if you could actually get a focus charged in time or have enough time to forward dash it. If T-Hawk recovers fast enough you might just get hit for focusing it.
Also EX Spire armor breaks.
Edit: Nope, if the recover is the same Hawk recovers too fast to do much with it.
its ok. he has one really good move now. im sure you can still whiff punish it, but it’ll be a mix up between him doing lp and you pressing the button early enough to get counter hit by one of the slower versions active frames
i’ll manage if he still loses to week 1 blanka
Nope you can actually do quite a bit. Don’t forget about the fact that absorbing an attack freezes the opponent in place longer than it freezes you as well as the fact spire has a bunch of active frames. Point blank LP Spire you can actually get a level 2 focus crumple even if you don’t start the focus until almost right before you get hit. You can also do focus absorb - dash forward - punish vs many ranges of condor spire with characters who have fast punishes. I can do focus absorb - dash - crLP with Ryu even from a nearly perfectly spaced LP Spire.
Even before the armor freeze time the LP Spire hitting on the first frame has to go through 8F more active frames +4F airborne recover +7F grounded. That is 19F right there. Even hitting on the last frame is 12F which is enough to release a focus attack and have it hit even if you didn’t get extra frames from the focus absorb.
They didn’t reduce the recovery or active frames on Spire AFAIK all that was changed was startup and then LP got 3F more hitstun (it’s obviously more hitstun rather than faster recovery because they only changed the hit advantage not the block advantage which would have changed if they altered the recovery or active frames.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCm1jFokqBM
Niconico Chokaigi 3 Ultra Street Fighter IV exhibitions
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwA6BBRE0_I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kv2Vim7FxK4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuRiK0bgAgY
Watch the first video w/ sound on at your own discretion.
hugo looks absolutely hopeless in sf4’s engine
[quote=“Dragonfave723, post:4094, topic:162662”]
[/quote]Rolento is so annoying, perfect replacer for Seth as I expected. Also spoiler it’s retarded that Kaz didn’t get a stun in the first round of the Fei/Seth match. Seth is clearly weak, he’s still high risk whilst having less reward. Very sloppy of Mago not to challenge that weakened divekick and punish dp fadc dash forward. Maybe they weren’t serious.
Except if you think about where Hawk will do the spire (canceling it off c.MK for instance.) You won’t be able to start charging till part way into the active frames. That’s what I’m getting at.
Sure if T-Hawk does it raw you can or point blank (But come on, Hawk isn’t going to do a move that is -7 on block if you hit on the first active frame in your face), but think about how he’s going to do it in the update. The block stun off c.MK is around 14 frames based on my calculations which means you won’t be able to start charging until 3-4 frames into the active frames. Meaning that leaves only about 5 active frames and 11 recovery frames. 16 frames isn’t enough time to fully charge the focus from zero and let it fly.
And this is under ideal conditions, in a real match you might be a frame or two late on the focus.
Odds are you would be just releasing the focus at lvl 1 and back dashing. Which isn’t really enough to make Hawk stop doing it. Especially since the EX version armor breaks so you have to always be careful of him doing that version. You’d be better off DPing in the middle of the string or something like that.
Edit: Let me use an example from another character. Yun’s LP Shoulder has worse frames in the same situation as Hawk’s new spire. You can’t charge a focus in between up to lvl 2 in time to punish the shoulder if Yun cancels into it from s.MP. In Yun’s case his recovery is bad enough you can dash forward after absorbing the hit and be at frame advantage, but in Hawk’s case the recovery is not slow enough that you’ll be dashing into an SPD.
http://youtu.be/jCm1jFokqBM?t=46m18s
at 46:18
Rolento isn’t the new Seth… he’s the new online Blanka!!
While it’s riskier you will be at frame advantage even from near max range LP Spire. IIRC armor freeze is 4F (I could be off slightly). crMK is 4F active 12F recovery -2F on block but you have to also consider that it has to hit for 1F so you subtract 1F more. That is 13F. Also you have to consider the distance factor. THawk’s crMK cancel position moves him back slightly while Yun’s moves him forward.
Also Yun is a different character, true the situation is the same but one of the reasons you see people focus shoulder less often is because he has other threats from sMP and the walk speed and other normals to decide to simply NOT cancel it. THawk doesn’t have the walk speed Yun does, or the option of canceling crMK to DP (because it whiffs unless point blank) or a safe option like Yun’s EX Lunge punch to break armor.
Also in the video example given earlier you saw a lot of the spires done from sLP as well as just done raw. Those ones could be focused even easier than crMK.
Here is a modified THawk with a spire matching USF4 version (11F startup +3F hitstun, input done with DP + Kick instead of reverse DP + Punch. crMK special cancelable)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jb9dhtGSzME
Now if the crMK - spire is done from farther out than shown in the video, not only does it have a much larger gap (meaning if you had started charging the focus right after the crMK you’d have reached level 2 in time to punish if only barely.) but it also means it’s easier to throw out an attack like a crHP or DP or possibly try and low profile the spire (distance/character dependent obviously)
There are a lot of options depending on the situation, including using focus attacks and focus dashes.