Ultra 3rd Strike LITE v1.00 Mod Release

Classic Fighting Games Ultra Street Fighter IV
41

I don’t think it can be done. Besides, I hate SF4’s stun system. I’d change it completely if I could. But don’t worry. Its faster than people expect.

I think you’ll like the full mod when I can get a very early version out.

I’ll take a quick look at your post and note below everything that the full version does:

-Remove Focus Attack: I’m still not sure on that. But right now, its redesigned so that it doesn’t combo and doesn’t crumple. Its an approach & poke tool, but a lucky hit of that overpowered attack no longer gets you combo. I’m still considering taking it out entirely, but I’m attached to it for some reason. Its probably the right decision to remove it entirely.

-Quick stand from (almost) anything besides super/ultra: check. That and I have a new quick stand system that is closer to 3rd strike (makes you move backward on a tech)

-Juggle system is made almost exactly like 3rd Strike. There are also some few juggle reset, yes, it is possible in this engine. Some supers already have that.

-The frame data is getting a pretty big rework, the biggest changes being the jabs & shorts, so you can’t combo into fierce and such. They get some change in pushback as well. I’d have to see into adjusting the pushback for other normals as well.

Don’t worry, I don’t like SF4’s way of making every normals link into each other and my mod wants to change it. There will still be some, but much more tame. Ryu can still combo 2 crouch MP, I think, but can’t link it into fierce or crouch HK.

-The fireball game will not, however, be inspired from 3rd Strike. Instead, it goes the opposite way. 3rd Strike had awful frame data for fireballs. In a world where you can easily parry fireballs, I think they need to still feel strong.

(and more)

You’re probably right overall that I should focus on the 3rd Strike element more than the SF4, but at the same time, I want my mod to be its own thing.

Thanks for the feedback.

I plan on releasing an early release of the FULL version when I’m done with Akuma, Cody, Decapre, Dudley, Guy, Ken, Oni, Ryu, Seth & Yang.

I’d be happy to see what you think of that. Because people are answering quite a bit, I’m trying to work a bit more than usual on it. Maybe I can get it out soon enough.

42

The speed of SF4 is what put me off for so long (and I thought being a 3S snob was tubular) so I honestly ignored 4 until a year ago. I still haven’t tried this mod but I sure plan to. Would love for Ibuki to get her teleport back to a dash command, btw. I miss that bs so much.

43

oh, i didn’t mean juggle counter reset, i mean juggling off a reset like in 3s

44

I’m sure I’ll work her to be as close to 3rd Strike as I can in pretty much every way possible.

Oh, right. I tried that and yeah, its not possible. Well, you can make it possible to get hit by -everything- during a reset in the air but not just supers so thats the obvious problem.

45

who’s the chick in your avatar? she’s a banger… man

46

I thought I’d drop a teaser match video in here since I just completed Ryu. Obviously played against the CPU here.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=u5clmxuY9vc

Whats new in full:

-Rework of every characters, including:
-Reworked hitstun, pushback & “reset” physic (thats physics when you reset an opponent in the air with a jab, for example)

-Some entirely new moves are given to every characters.

-Some moves are entirely reworked (Ryu’s Tatsumaki in particular here), otherwise almost every moves have had alteration, generally faster and in SF3 flavor.

-The Juggle System mimics 3rd Strike. Any moves that hits add to the juggle count. When you are over 12 juggle points, you can’t combo anymore. If something can hit, anything else can hit. Some supers have reset properties (reset juggle count to 0).

-Super Focus Attacks are removed. Focus Attacks are much weaker and do not really allow for combos.

-Armor breaking is mostly removed from the game, so everything can be parried.

-Jump physics completely altered, mostly made shorter, just like 3rd Strike.

-The 3rd Strike Quick Stand system is in play.
When you tech, you “roll” backward a bit and get up.
You can tech throws and crouching roundhouses and such.
The tech gives some meter.
You can dash through certain character’s tech in the corner if timed correctly.

-Counter-hit bonus damage is removed. Instead, you do bonus damage on crouched opponents. You never do bonus stun. This is exactly like 3rd Strike.

-CPU AI tweaked to be more interesting to play against

-And more!?

Ryu’s new moves are:

-Joudan Side Kick (HcF+K)
-Denjin (QcFx2+K)
-Fake Hadouken (Qcf+HP+HK)

Thats it for now.

47

I was interested until I saw parrying would work JUST like 3s. Backing away now.

48

Interested to see how you try and balance Cody given that parries basically destroy his move set. Single hit somewhat slow startup normals, frame traps without a particularly viable high low game, large hitboxes that would potentially allow for both high and low parries to work (common problem vs Gouken in SF4), attacks that are very unsafe and telegraphed but broke armor (LK Ruffian, Zonk)

His badstones would kind of be useless since they are so telegraphed and you can parry them AND air parry them. Knife throw loses to parry, focus, jabs, and other fireballs all while being only 70 damage and 26F startup.

Knife normals lose a lot of viability with parries since they can’t be canceled and are generally on the slower side (6-8F for all but his jabs).

Throws are weaker without the auto safe jump of back throw.

Lastly he has a pretty useless super so buffs to supers is kind of pointless.

That said, UOH is nice for him since his F+HK can’t hit crouching it gives him a way to open people up and fight stand+crouch tech that he lacked previously.

Another character I imagine would be hard to balance without armor breakers is Dan since Danku is like the basis of his entire gameplan and they would be super easy to parry, at least with Sakura she has good fast normals and her Shooken might be tough to parry given the multi hit nature. Deejay might be hard to balance too though MGU might be tough to parry, overall he’d be pretty destroyed by parries and no armor breakers.

Guy and Fuerte’s Run/Stop stuff I think works really well with the parries having recovery time allowing a punish. They can use RS to bait a parry. Also Guy has his F+MP overhead that is two hits, fast startup, and can be special canceled before it becomes active allowing him to bait a parry with an OH Feint into a special.

49

Too late. You want to build the game like 3S, then you make the game work as close to 3S as possible. Which involves resetting stun.

If it can’t be done, I understand. If there’s unwillingness, then I would respectfully disagree with the decision.

50

Interested in what you would do for Honda.
He’s like the character that never uses ultra but always uses super, quite the opposite of the majority of the cast in sf4.
If supers only cost 2 bars he’ll get a lot of mileage out of his hhs hitconfirms.

51

There’s quite a few ideas and new things for Cody here. Here’s another wall of text.

-His knife hits are special cancellable (with the same rules as his equivalent normals) and he also gets a specific universal overhead with them. He can also still do his command normals (Forward HP and Back MP) even with the knife in hand.

-The knife pickup is cancellable instantly on pickup.

-Knife on a aerial hit can juggle. With the 3rd Strike juggle system in place, there’s a variety of juggle you can go for.

-Most of his knife moves have slight start-up buff or end faster

-Cody gets a new Ranged Criminal Upper move, allowing him to spawn a tornado at a distance whilst avoiding projectile. Its very slow. The EX version is a unique move, however, where he does an incredibly quick spin tornado in place and grabs the knife from wherever he is. The move can also send the opponent in the air if done very close.

-With the Knife, Cody has a new Assassinate super.

-Badstone and knife throws have a much faster recovery. The knife throw is also really quick now.

-Cody can cancel into his Ultra 1 and 2 -> to be specific, it combos from HP (standing or crouch).

-Bingo Punch can be done with a manual command. (the held version is still better)

-Cody’s Forward HP overhead is sickeningly strong now and links into crouch HP.

-EX Ruffian Kicks now has 3 versions. EX MK being completely safe and has a longer hitbox. EX HK is better for combos and also recovers much faster. EX LK is the same old anti-fireball move.

I think Cody can hold his own with that. Cody lacks a low-overhead mixup game, so thats why his slow overhead was made this strong. His new EX options should allow him to give some safer pressure. His combo game is very strong now.

Charge characters are quite a problem. SF4’s engine does not allow charge partitioning which is key to balancing them in this environment. So instead, I intend them to have faster charging times and to work around that.

I don’t have a plan for E. Honda in particular just yet, though.

52

Interesting, even if he can’t confirm from his crLK if it’s still 3F that combined with a scary overhead gives him a high risk vs reward option and still has a viable low game even if it’s not particularly strong outside of hard reads/footsies.

Is the EX LK any better as an anti fireball or is it the same? It has no projectile invincibility during startup frames only the active and a couple of recovery frames for some reason. Not saying to change it just curious if it’s different.

The changes to EX moves should be interesting, one of the bigger weak areas in Cody’s USF4 moveset is that his meter usage isn’t particularly good. Most of his EX moves aren’t very strong and his super is garbage in terms of utility and average in damage. Buffing EX moves and generally making it so the only real use he gets isn’t a 3-4bar 340 damage EX Zonk gamble is a very good buff to his moveset.

You should use the jumping hurtbox for UOHs after a certain frame use the actual attacks hurtbox (maybe slightly expanded for some), having them be based entirely on the animations makes characters with specific jump animations get screwed over. Cody doing the EX UOH can’t avoid many lows at all, also his regular UOH gets tagged pretty easily unless done from far away vs attacks with taller hitboxes like Hugo’s crLK or Cody’s sweep or Chun’s sweep or Zangief’s crMK.

Curious if you intended for it to be easy to combo out of UOHs on crouching opponents even without an EX version. I didn’t test many others but Cody could do it easily, as could Chun (Her EX UOH is really good too because her air normals are fast and FJ HP can hit twice).

53

I’ll admit I read your post wrong the first time. You should reply if you need to. :wink:

54

You’ll need to adjust Blanka’s closeMK in final version or change low parry, there may be other moves you’ll need to adjust as well. Because of how the hitstop is setup on that move Blanka is able to do the 2nd hit of his closeMK while the opponent is stuck in hitstop still. This makes it always break armor, in USF4 normally this actually makes it so Gouken can’t counter Blanka’s closeMK.

Now in this mod you have Parry_F setup in a way that counters this (the two instances of waist invincibility on the same frames cause it to be a 2 hit absorb if he is stuck in hitstop but only 1 hit absorb otherwise). However Parry_D does not have this same setup and thus if Blanka does a closeMK and you do a down parry you’ll parry 1 of the hits but be unable to parry the 2nd no matter what you do.

Another issue that I’m not sure would be easy to solve, or really worth bothering: At close range many fast moving EX Fireballs only need to be parried one time, the 2nd hit of the fireball will pass through harmlessly.

55

It is not. Cody has plenty of tools against fireballs, including its new moves which has startup fireball invincibility.

I intended to do that. The biggest problem is I can’t see the hit/hurtbox, so I have to test many times to see if its really how I want it. Its really hard to tell whats the right hurtbox. But I want to do it. I honestly just forgot about it.

Mostly, yes. Most characters can easily combo something. Some are possibly too easy to follow-up. Some don’t feel like they jump high enough. There is so much to test. I’ll try to keep it all in mind. I think being able to follow-up into jabs from a direct overhead isn’t unfair, but this depends on the character.

The full version actually gets an overhaul on the parrying hurtbox, to fix them and to normalize them between characters, and I already expect to change certain moves’ hitboxes just so that they work better or as expected for parries.

I also changed it so that multiple hits before you can input another parry will be parried, in all types of parry.

So in the full version, you can parry Blanka’s close MK.

However, its parry in a single parry input, so I will change it so that it requires 2 parry.

Also, I know about fireballs going through you on multiple hits. The “armor stun” is the same as the block stun, but when you adjust it to fix the problem, blocking the fireball pushes multiple times and lasts much longer than its supposed to do. Its a an annoying situation.

If any series of multiple hits don’t parry individually or just miss, I want to find them and fix them.

Damn, there’s so much to test and so much to think about.

56

Figured it’d just be easiest if you simply used the hurtbox from the moves you are copying and then tweaked them if you wanted to or not. I think the most important is simply using the hurtbox for the frames before the attack starts, just some of the lift off frames copy pasting the hurtbox from Jump_F would make it more lower body invincible.

57

Well this is interesting.