Fix rockcrusher!
When close:
:mp: = Close Standing Middle Punch.
:ub::mp: = Close Standing Middle Punch.
:mp: = Close Standing Middle Punch.
:f::mp: = Quick Overhead Rockcrusher.
(Lets snowball this mofo)
Fix rockcrusher!
When close:
:mp: = Close Standing Middle Punch.
:ub::mp: = Close Standing Middle Punch.
:mp: = Close Standing Middle Punch.
:f::mp: = Quick Overhead Rockcrusher.
(Lets snowball this mofo)
rockcrusher on HP and all problems are solved
Hrm a few things. Balrog can ex wakeup dash punch and that is an incredible reversal. Blanka doesnât have something like that. Blarogâs headbutt is really never used as a reversal unless we are gambling. Dash punch or torpedo punch are way better. I also use upballs in strings sometimes or in neutral situations. Iâts a very good move and it makes people think twice before mashing buttons on you. Iâll take a CH exupball when my punish is either nothing, or on block i get stepkicked. So i do throw it out randomly because it CAN be done that way and makes people really worried about it. If on block iâm gonna start eating stuff like f.HP c.HP xx DP fadc ultra from ryu now iâm like âŠis it a buff?
Like i said it all depends on the range after the block, iâm also curious if we have any other changes on the horizon. As it stands i believe this change could go either way for me. I do think itâs a buff, but how much of one.
It doesnât matter how punishable the move is on block. You shouldnât be getting that move blocked anyways. The fact that he actually gains a legitimate reversal changes matches tremendously. Characters like Akuma, Abel, Cammy (plus 10) canât just mash low jab on wakeup anymore and get free pressure. What Blanka loses in random shenanigan upball off of hops or in max.range CH situations he gains by not being completely free to pressure and having an actual answer that makes the other side consider blocking which he has not had in the entire SF4 series.
This is the single most important change to Blanka that he could get. I personally asked âpeople in powerâ for since SSF4 was announced and have been disappointed year after year. I donât care if Blanka loses 50% per blocked up ball, with this change heâs the most improved character in 2012.
âJay Snyder
Viscant@aol.com
Actually your way does make more sense, my way loses ability to backcharge overhead fwiw.
Hold 1 punch for charge then release for rockcrusher, hold 2 punch for OH rockcrusher, hold 3 punch for ex rockcrusher with invincibility. They could even up the damage with the charge time.
I donât really agree viscant. I donât understand how on one hand you can say âcharacters like canât just mash low jab on wakeup anymore and get free pressureâ but then say âyou shouldnât be getting that move blocked anywaysâ It will happen if youâre using it to stop people from mashing. Yes you should care if it does 50% to you. If i exupball Ryu and he blocks it i donât think he can even c.HK (maybe he can) i know akuma can. So that is a safe wakeup option for me if heâs close range. I donât have to worry about hit hitting or not hitting it resets the situation and iâm fine. If now though if he blocks it and then he can do something like f+HP c.HP xx DP fadc ultra⊠now iâm like well shit⊠i canât exactly fadc my upball like someone with a DP can. I do think it matters a lot.
Yes there are some characters where it doesnât matter. Abel, Balrog, Chun li, and others who can currently ultra even on hit or block so this is a huge buff in those matchups. But others it isnât. Iâm not saying itâs a debuff, i do think itâs a buff. But if the range is really close where big punishes can occur from the entire cast iâm not ready to call him the most improved character in 2012.
^Its a good argument, I can really see what you both mean from both sides. I think the questions are:
What specific matchups does it help him with most?
Are they his worst matchups?
if yes = great buff
if no = foxâs point is a concern
Way too complexâŠjust give it an Oroshi type movement ala Makato. That way it could keep its startup time, be backchargeable and have an ex version (armor break). Not.
All upballs are punishable on block by about everyone except for t.hawk.
Fox, your experience in upball being safe is not due to the great qualities of upball, but the crap competition you face. Upball simply doesnt reset shit, and more often than not you are in a much worse situation for using it for any reason other than an anti-air.
Yes, ryu can punish with low rh after blocked upball.
Also, Balrog ex dashes on wakeup are a terrible reversal. He can simply be thrown. Headbut is balrogâs only reversal (not counting super/ultra), and, like upball, should only be done when one actually sees an opening, never ever randomly.
Look at almost ever reversal in the game. Shoryuken, balrog headbut, etc. When blocked, people are open to massive fuckin damage. Thats how it works, thats the risk reward. ITS SUPPOSED TO BE LIKE THAT. Stupid characters, like yun, who have characters where there reversals are often safe no matter what (lookin at you fp kick uppercut thing, also obviously character specific punishes) are often yuck and lead to an upheaval in balance.
Off the top of my head, the only real reversal that is mostly safe on block is honda ex headbutt (can be punished by a few ultraâs, but very very few). But the limitation of that move is he can simply lose charge if opponent switches sides, so if opponent is smart, its not a reversal in many wakeup situations.
EX uppball being a real reversal is a gamechanger for blanka. SOOOO Many characters can punish him even on hit right now, who gives a fuck about being punished or even pseudo safe on block. BLANKA IS PUNISHABLE ON HIT AGAInsT MOST CHARACTERS IN MANY SITUATIONS. That means blanka = free to pressure. Blanka with real reversal is dangerous as all fuck. This is the game changer blanka truly needed, and balances him out nicely.
Off the top of my head, this is a list of characters that can punish a blocked ex upball WITHOUT ULTRA
Ryu, ken, sagat, akuma.
Cammy, fei, yun, yang, seth
ibuki, guy, blanka, honda
balrog, bison, vega. duddly
cody, guy, guile!!(ex sonic boom, maybe even standing rh)
dhalsim, makoto, viper, zangief, gen
Not sure about chun li without ultra, same with abel.
On hit or block, upball can be punished with ultra/super by at least:
chun li, abel. yun (ultra 2), gen. honda, seth cant think of others right now.
Based on this, entirely from memory, and deffinately incomplete list, almost everyone can punish upball on block. Many of those characters can also do it on hit. Sorry fox, I just dont see how you can feel that upball is a move you can just toss out. You cant, against smart competition that know how to fight blanka, they can and will punish. Unless used as anti-air, the move is absolute garbage.
except itâs not. thatâs like saying fei longâs flame kick is garbage and i see top top players doing it all the time without meter. It is just as punishable if not more so then upball on block. But itâs used. It is not garbage at all. The threat of it is always important. It forces you to stop strings and try to bait them because you will get him with them. Everyone will reversal even if itâs unsafe on block. I mean viscant said it correctly it stops people from mashing jab on you and other things. Chun li can do c.HK to punish exupball on block and abel can do COD on it on block. That being said a lot of those puishes are something as simple as a long normal and thatâs it.
I donât know how you can say itâs garbage lol. Youâre basically saying almost every single reversal in the game is garbage.
What he is saying is VS someone like Ken - a step kick punish is still a win for us, whereas if we are baited it could really hurt now. Its a valid point, even tho the buff is good.
Speaking of ultra reversals, we should see a lot less wakeup ultras with blankas now(technically he wasnât totally free on wakeup) lol
Yes the crap competition of guys like latif, wolfkrone, air, iiperu, juicebox, rico, dieminion, banana ken, and others have truly giving me the wrong experiences on upball.
This is how Fox says to use the upball:
I also use upballs in strings sometimes or in neutral situations. Iâts a very good move and it makes people think twice before mashing buttons on you. Iâll take a CH exupball when my punish is either nothing, or on block i get stepkicked. So i do throw it out randomly because it CAN be done that way and makes people really worried about it.
Basically, he is literally willing to just toss it out because it can make people worried about ex upball. As a result, on block, if it becomes easier to punish, its a nerf for him, regardless of whatever buff, because now he cant use it all randomlike.
I said: Upball needs to be used on reaction, or to interrupt things you see the opponent doing, such as a yun strong to shoulder block string.
Then Fox says that balrog ex dash is his best reversal. Except that it loses to throw, making it not a reversal. Fox just ignores my point.
Then fox says, regarding fei uppercut, "thatâs like saying fei longâs flame kick is garbage and i see top top players doing it all the time without meter. It is just as punishable if not more so then upball on block."
EXCEPT FOR ONE THING: FEI UPPERCUT KNOCKS DOWN and blanka upball DOES NOT. as a result, there is a risk-reward that is rather even, because if fei gets the knockdown, he can apply pressure, whereas if blocked, he can EAT AN ULTRA FROM EVERYONE. Not to mention, that if used right, fei should be able to cancel, which leads to a juggle combo or a +1 block string.
When I said upball was useless, i meant specifically in ground to gruond situations, BECAUSE UPBALL DOES NOT KNOCK DOWN. EVEN ON HIT, blanka can get mega punished. Fei does not have that problem on hit; no other reversal I know of has that problem ON HIT.
And yes, your opposition, your opponents are shit because IT IS INTERNET PLAY. Internet is just shit. I have seen the best real players lose like scrubs on the internet, because internet is shit. links are harder, punishes are harder more shit is random. INTERNET PLAY DOESNT MEAN SHIT, especially if it leads anyone to believe that upballs can just be tossed out, in order to make people âPhearz the upballs.â No good player fears the upball. Almost everyone can punish easily on block, and also many can easily punish on HIT. Why fear that shitty move until it gets knockdown properties?
I rest my case. Upball as an anti-ground maneuver is absolutely shit until it can knockdown. Capcom is smart to make it easier to punish on block, or, like the horizontal ball, retards will just keep doing it, thinking its safe, and then all these monkeys start crying about how broken blanka is and bleh bleh bleh. Blankaâs reversal is now a real reversal and conforms with most other reversals. Knockdown on hit, massive punish on block. Seems fair to me.
Josh you missed some characters. Adon for instance.
The thing is with upball not knocking down there is never any mind game about it vs. certain characters.
If Iâm fei with 1 bar, the other guy might be thinking I wonât flamekick because I donât have meter to FADC, which is a pretty reasonable assumption.
If Iâm playing Blanka vs. certain characters, upballing is suicide. They donât have to respect it because it isnât safe on hit. If I upball Akuma and he does walk forward sweep to punish, he literally doesnât care at this point what happens unless heâs low on life(which means he has a demon stocked), he got a reset of the situation.
Reversals are good because of their ability to reset momentum if your opponent guesses incorrectly. In a lot of matches now, including the mirror, the other player can simply knock you down and go to work because you have no way out.
At the moment ex upball is only a functional reversal in a handful of matches or situations, but is a good anti-air, and counter to specific moves.
With the knockdown property it functions like a real reversal against more characters, and a few characterâs canât just keep you locked down.
But yeah if people arenât punishing ex upball on block/hit consistently they need to practice it more.
Upball def wasnt total crap, the punish window was small and your opponent had to be on his toes at all times in order to punish, if you interrupted your opps offense with it, then they sometimes missed the punish all together.
Getting slapped on hit totally did suck, but getting hammered on block isnt a fun thought. We will see how punishable it turns out. It is still a buff either way, since it is preferrable to have your opp try to bait you then to apply offensive pressure.
One more thing:
Fox said regarding punishing upball:
That being said a lot of those puishes are something as simple as a long normal and thatâs it.
No, thats NOT IT. Most of those punishes knockdown blanka, meaning blanka loses momentum, and opponent has safejump setups, or other offensive maneuvers they can do to maintain pressure. Even if the damage is roughly even, or even slightly in blankaâs favor, the knockdown changes everything against blankaâs favor.
Ves Im sure i missed a couple, that wasnt my point. My point was, from memory, to show that 2/3rds of the cast could punish upball. Meaning, Foxâs point regarding using upball to strike fear into the opponents of upball was moot because it was so easily punishable already.
Lol, we still have the not-as-unsafe regular upball!
Itâs something you have to practice in training mode. Do you think I miss slide punishes in the mirror? Or rekka punishes with Fei? Shouken punish with Sak? U2 punish with Sagat? No i donât. Iâve practiced punishing this move on hit, and on block. Hell I kara uppercut blocked upballs, and my Sagat is terrible.
Itâs like saying hops are good because the other person isnât consistently punishing you. They are good in the moment, but overall they arenât. one time i had a viper player hit me with some shorts to SJC ultra on an attempted hop mixup. Yeah, itâs not a good situation to be in.
Itâs pretty free yo.