This Feels Different... OLD Abel Match Theory Thread

calm down, 2nd post that just wastes time instead of easily answering the question
and hey, maybe someone should put the answer in the fucking matchup area on the 1st page so i dont have to ask?

Just noticed that the Abel in the videoalso does the jab before cross up mk against Boxer on wakeup. Need to try this in training mode or hfz69 could translate for us. :smile: Tried it on Chun on Sat and I keep messing up the timing with j.mk always missing.

Excellent vid, thanks AhDee.

Anyone know the other knockdowns that’s possible off of?

TT?

i think thats just for those who watches the video to know the timing… you dont really need to do that if you know the timing instinctly lol

Against Gen you can do four shorts/jabs into standing strong, you just have to use a crouching jab last before the strong. Crouching jab will hit his weird reeling animation while standing jab misses. Nice way to get extra damage off an easy and safe combo

If you block Blanka’s up ex upball pointblank, you can reversal HP CoD -> fdc etc.

Meaty s HK doesn’t work on Blanka because of his hitbox.

There’s a distance about two character’s width away that Abel’s c.mk will not work against Blanka’s j.HK and Abel need to j.HP/HK to anti air.

Abel can normal roll after blocking the first hit of Blanka’s ultra up close. Just make sure to use MK/HK roll.

If you blocked the ultra, can’t you ultra him back? Unless he’s going for chip kill that is. meaty s. Hk doesnt work?! Thats so whack.

blocked blanka ultra, cr.hp and ultra. or fa2 crumple ultra. go and test in training mode.

but if its the crossup going the other way ultra, you cant ultra back iirc.

No need to test it, i was suggesting another alternative instead of his original cr.hp>ultra. But if u hit the fa2 crumple, that would scale the damage right? If no ultra, id go for the skyfall after he bounces off.

As for your suggested alternative, no you cant ultra back just like that.

For the fa2 ultra punish, I’m not sure if its a sure punish or not because there were times that the blanka managed to block the fa or backdash away, im not sure if its my timing or anything because i usually punish with cr.hp ultra.

Regarding the scaling, i think you do more damage after fa2 crumple than an AA cr.hp into ultra. Abel’s ultra is so high damaging, damage scaling by one move wont affect much, most of the time its still higher than raw ultra damage. I wouldnt worry much about damage scaling unless its in the middle of a 5-9hits combo :rofl:

Without ultra, you can cr.hp roll fs or something for more damage i guess, even ex wheel kick would work i think. All depending on what you aim for, more damage? Positioning/spacing/untech knockdown? Or simply moves that are easy to execute?

All good points bro, and the fa punish is weird for me too, for some reason most blankas i play just backdash. I use skyfall for the untechable knockdown (knockslam?) Then roll to go for crossup. Or backdash then wheelkick to see if i can get a hit on wakeup.

Hey guys I’m having major trouble with one of the Ryu players from my group. He plays by spamming jab a LOT and slowly chiping me with c.mk -> fireball. If I manage to get in and land a c.FP I can’t really seem to get any resets if he’s mashing the Jab button all the way through so I go for the guaranteed dmg of FS.

I’m really not sure how to approach poking someone who plays like that with Ryu as pretty much all my pokes seem to lose out if we trade and his super lands so easily so I don’t like to poke when he has one. Does anyone have any advice towards someone playing like that I’m guess I should try to use more ex tts or something? The other Ryus in my group are not nearly as annoying :confused: Also I don’t like to use many focus attacks considering how many double hit normal he has >_<

So yeah any advice would be great. Thanks

Don’t let him close in on you so easily (from what it seems like). You can be patient and play the footsies game with him. If you can, FA those fireballs in the c.mk -> fireball link and do a block string or TT. Or, do a counter hit step kick (f.mk). It also sounds like you’re not mixing your game up if you consistently have trouble with him. Might want to address what your general strategy is against him instead of just what he does. Could give us some insight and would further help us help you.

Have you tried EX cod?

watch the distance of the low forward, if its far about max range then you can ultra/ex cod before the fireball hits or focus the fireball dash TT. if he is mashing jab block. blocking doesnt get u hurt. you need to do a meaty reset so that your cr.fp doesnt get stuff by the jabs. do cr.fp roll st.lp (if you do the st.lp too early/too late your next cr.fp wont be meaty) lk roll and cr.fp. if he mashes jab holding down forward you will hit him, if he mashes jab holding down back he can block.

Ugh…

If you have to rely on EX’s to beat silly shit like this, you need to do some serious work on your fundamentals.

Couple points: Jab is a very short-range move, that does zero chip. It’s not a threat in and of itself. Low Forward XX Fireball does next to no damage. It is also not a real threat.

These things only become threatening when you lack perspective, give them way more credit than they deserve, and start doing stupid shit to try to beat them (like wasting meter every time you think your opponent is gonna press Jab).

So let’s backtrack. First point… you shouldn’t be trying resets on any decent Ryu anyway, IMO. I think resets are fairly worthless in general from a risk perspective, but that’s just me… But resets are especially weak against a character with a 3-frame, invincible move that auto-corrects any side switch shenanigans. While a character like Rose, will have to understand exactly what’s happening to her, and attempt a specific counter, thereby making her chances of success comparatively lower, Ryu only has to guess whether you are going to try to reset him with an attack, or if you’re baiting an SRK. Now, most Abel’s are impatient, so they’re going to attack 90% of the time, making this decision really easy for Ryu. FADC-> back dash makes the decision almost braindead, if he has bar.

That being said, let’s attack the jab. OK… I’m sure you don’t use Stand Short. Ever. Start using it at mid-range. That will help you fight Ryu. Ryu’s jab is only a viable move at short range. It’s a good Jab, but it’s just a damn Jab. Learn some frame traps. Use them until Mash Jab stops being a good tactic. Use normal throw more (your fastest move) at close range. You have options.

As for Low Forward xx Fireball… again… use Stand Short more to have better control of midrange. Or, just stay out of that range. Back dash, jump back, jump in for cross-ups, Step Kick, Short Wheel Kick… Short (or RH sometimes) Roll, to keep Ryu honest and on his toes.

Step back and really assess what’s happening to you, because I’m sure you’re not losing to Jab, and fireball chip from mid-range. I’ve never seen a match, but I’m SURE you are putting yourself into truly bad situations, by overvaluing the threats being posed. Much ado about nothing.

if anything, I relish playing guys who mash jab. That means free counter hits on step kick all the time, and free tick tornado throws all the time.

Thanks for the tips guys, I am going to play the guy again at lunch tomorrow I might bring my laptop to record the matches on the webcam. I don’t think I give the guy too much credit he talks an incredible amount of trash so I think I don’t play as aggressively as I do against the other Ryus in our group because I am more worried about losing than winning.

I think setting up the step kick a lot more will probably help, on CH the hp link is easy. I haven’t tried any tick setups I thought they would just be beaten out by the jabs so I never bothered and he seems to be able to land his super off any hit he gets so every time he lands a jab I eat a super if he has it so I’m worried about stopping my combos for any ticks or anything like that.

The guy who said it may be my play style could be right I used to beat the guy quite consistently when he used to main Fei Long and I think I was approaching the match the same way and I feel predictable against him

Cheers guys I’ll let you know how it goes.

Oh and I’ll try to mix in some standing shorts :stuck_out_tongue:

Yo Hav, you done with this thread? :frowning:

Pretty much. I had plans a while ago, but I quite literally never play SF4 anymore, so I’m kinda done. Plus, discussion in here is pretty shitty.

I actually have some new thoughts, and some thoughts on match-ups that I never posted… but I really don’t care at this point. No real motivation…