Alright, Chun > yun? Can’t bring myself to agree there. Hell, it actually feels like Yun was designed specifically for shutting that bitch down.
He can dive kick her all day and there’s not much she can do to stop it. Yun is possibly the best “from the air” character in the game and Chun Li, IMO, is easily the worst anti-air character. Besides her SA3 (which sucks because equipping it a completely robs her of her dominate ground game) she has no reliable anit-air moves. She’s retardly easy to jump into. Yun can dive kick her all day and there’s really not much she can do to retaliate. Parrying is about the only way to keep from being put at a disadvantage here.
Not that it matters, because all Yun has to do his get Genei-jin ready. Once he activates it, all you can do after that is hope to score a knock-down on him. (Well, that’s pretty much the only hope EVERY character has agianst the Genei-jin)
EDIT:
Ken> Makoto? Maybe. Makoto does tend to get predictable after a while, and I find Ken really good at punishing rush down attempts. Especailly if the character is somewhat linear like Makoto. (Basically, she’s get close, land the command throw, apply pressure. Rinse, repeat.)
What what what?? Q, Hugo, Sean, Alex, Necro, and Makoto are all worse for anti-dive kick attacks. Even though she’s light on attacks that look like they’re antiairs, she actually has some great ones. Back + fierce, close roundhouse, back + fierce xx lightning legs, ex spinning bird kick, standing jab, preemptive antiair standing fierce, jumping air throw etc are all really useful antiairs, not to mention the fact that she can just duck your jump-in attack and hit you with low forward xx pain. Chun is so NOT easy to jump into. That’s one of the reasons she’s top tier; for most characters, you basically can’t jump toward her.
Dive kicks bother her, but she can deal with them better than lots of other characters can. The match is in Yun’s favor, but not by very much.
Makoto would be top tier if she had more consistant ways to land damage. All of her damage can only be verified off of her Karakusa. When it comes to SA2 Makoto it’s worse cuz your back has to be close to the corner or it won’t work. Other than that all of her damage she just kinda has to “hope” you fall into it. The chances are in her favor since her rushdown game is just freakin sick but…she doesn’t have a lot to verify from if the opponent is looking out for Karakusa.
Basically, if you can block all of her stuff she becomes less scary. Which is why a lot of people say Makoto just has her “good days” and her “bad days”. If you have the opponent worked up in your mix up game…you look like god with Makoto. If they figure you out and can keep you from getting back to your feet…you look low tier. :lol:
Ken >>> Makoto cuz he has ways of dealing with her crap. If she makes even one small mistake in her rush game…LP shoryuken or reversal SA3 is coming to own you up. Basically, Makoto can’t do anything that leaves her at frame disadvantage or he can punish badly. Plus, Ken simply has a better poking game. Ken is a character that can actually deal with Makoto’s random ass jumping attacks as well.
i think best in the game…whos is better? chun is the hardest character to get in on in the game, she has anti parry moves, really high priority moves, an air throw…w/e u want…
epsilon is right the only person who can jump at chun is yun…no else can without parrying something, even then they could cancel into lightning legs what then???
plus if you get in you have so much to worry about sometimes even though i play dudley i don’t even want to get next to her lol…j/k but seriously she is sooo boring to play against b/c of her solidness on all levels…
Yeah, Chun Li’s one of those characters that’s decent without bar and monstrous as soon as she gets 1 super bar.
As for the AA thing…she doesn’t have any AA’s with invincibility on them so there’s a few things she’ll have to trade with here and there or just have to parry. Just because her b+HP has grand priority though you can use it to AA a lot of things. Certain things will still definitely trade/beat it out though. Namely Twelve’s and Dudley’s jump ins. Which then Chun can just crouch and then c.MK to super. Which is an AA in itself. So Chun Li doesn’t really have a “fool proof” AA like the shotos but she has lots of ways to deal with different types of air attacks.
haha, nah i just wanna play a really pro chun. not really about beating, its a learning experience. i didnt get a chance to play him at fr8, so i wanna guarantee it.
Well maybe all the people I succesfully jump on in while user her just suck:
Out of all the attacks you just named the only attack that’s actually annoyed me (based on expirence) whe I picked a time to jump in was her lightening kicks. Of course, my experience more than likely isn’t up to par with others here, but again, i find her easy to jump in on than most other characters.
Wake ups? U mean when u knock someone down and ur now jumping at them as they get up??
It really depends on the characters.
For Ken, ya sure, since he can crossup, or twins who have divekicks. Its also a good way to play mind games, like jump-in, land right when they get up, and swingblow to bait out throw attempts.
In a normal situation, when both characters are standing, u shouldnt jump at ppl unless : they suck, or u have to, like a Dudley vs Chun, or its not that bad of an idea since U have a good jump angle vs someone with limites anti-air option, like maybe Dudley vs Hugo.
Unless ur so good at parrying, or have figured out opponents anti-air options, jumping in leaves limited options while ur opponent has a whole bunch.
^ Well, I figured that last part out already, seeing as parries are the only defense option you have during a jump in. I noticed a few characters have moves that make jump ins easier (Akuma’s Air Hadouken, Oro’s double jump.)
Yeah, I pretty much plan jump ins. I don’t, contrary to what most here seem to beleive, perfer to jump in at Hugo. His anti-air options are limited (I only pretty much know him to have the back breaker). But he doesn’t really have to counter a jump in…
He could simply defend and let them jump right in. That’ll put you right next to Hugo, exactly where you don’t want to be.
But of course, there are obvious manuveurs and attacks that make jumping in hardly a good idea most of time. (Shoryukens, of course.) but as for Chun-li…I don’t find a good number of her named anti-air moves very threatening. I’ve delt with all the things Udavid named pretty easily. Whether with a parry or simply beating it out. (except her lightening kicks, which, from what I know stops mostly everything from the air and ground.) All except her EX spinning bird kick, which is the very reason I don’t jump in on her while she’s crouching.
So, like I said before, I find SA3 to be her only reliable anti-air.
Another reason I perfer to jump-in at her is because I feel she’s best delt with up close. When I’m in close to her, usually I find myself overtaking her as long as I’m careful about staying clear of her super art setups.
you probably haven’t dealt with an experienced Chun player.
out of all her anti-airs, it’s s. jab that annoys me and strikes fear in me the most. you’re probably wondering why that is. i mean, s. jab? that’s like, a pixel of damage at the most, right? true. but it’s not so much that move on its own that makes Chun freaky. it’s because s. jab can set up several painful sequences for you, whether you get hit by it or if you parry it.
if you parry it, she can chain into another s. jab. sure, you can parry all day, but that just leaves you parrying in the air while she can dictate your pace.
if you get hit, she can (among other things)
throw
walk back slightly and do c. forward -> super
if you’re blocking low after getting hit she can do UOH -> super or twds/back + roundhouse -> super
she can walk/dash under you and do close s. roundhouse xx super or throw or bait you to do something stupid
either way, all 4 can lead into you getting supered.
Makoto doesn’t get the respect she deserves in the US because I don’t think a god like Makoto player has emerged here. There is just SOO much you can do with that character and anyone who just writes her off as “random” is an idiot. I think Yun and Makoto are top, then Chun and Ken.
After that, I think Yang has better ground and air game than Dudley and Urien, but on the flip Duds just does ludicris damage off his mixups and combos, and Aegis is just scary. I grade these three as pretty much equals. Then I think Oro, Akuma, Ryu, Ibuki and Elena are just solidly built characters, each with a strong, but not top offense, and a strong, but not top defense. These 4 are the mid tier. Just below them are the next group, which is where alot probably will disagree with me on. This group has limited offense and glaring weakness’. I go Hugo, then Necro, then Alex, Q, Twelve, Remy, and Sean. Hugo is a badass, a popular character with a ton to offer. Great pokes, defense almost as high as Q’s, tons of mixup, and is just scary in the right hands. Next I like Necro. Though he is limited, and takes damage like a bitch, he can be played relatively safely which cannot be said for the remaining characters. Alex has decent pokes, and an ok offense and mixup, but he’s no Dudley, and his game can be shut down pretty easily, and you have to take alot of risks in order to win with him. Next is Q, my character of choice. Stupidly slow, stupidly tall, a huge target for most characters. You MUST be good at parrying because you are going to get attacked. Alot. People that run from Q are stupid. Luckily, his Kara throw is extremely useful, and used properly can keep people off of you. His CDB mind games are limited but can be very effective, and can lead to big damage. However, you cannot play too safely with him, eventually u will have to take risks to win. Luckily he has highest defense in the game.
Remy. I use Remy alot, and he actually has a ok game to offer, but unfortunately Capcom just crippled him. He doesn’t have anything safe outside of LOV’s, nothing he has is scary, and most ppl can just peace him in ten seconds. I think Twelve has way more to offer than Remy. Twelve is really cool and has good pokes, speed, and mixups. The problem is, he just doesn’t do any damage, and he takes it like a bitch. Makes me sad.
I forgot to mention the thing that makes Chun Li REALLY top tier, or at least makes it really hard (like, 2-8 or 3-7) for a bunch of characters to beat her: jumping in on her is extremely dangerous, and yet at the same time it’s the best offensive option you have. Her ground game is essentially Third Strike’s best, so you’re not gonna have an easy time of poking her or linking/canceling her into submission.
Chun can set up a kickass wall where you can’t attack her horizontally and where attacking from the air is almost as dangerous, and she can use that wall to do whatever she wants with you. You don’t want to walk up to her, you don’t want to jump up to her, but since she’s also the game’s best turtle, you can be forced to. If she doesn’t want to play as a turtle, she can use it to push you back into the corner. Heck, you might already be in the corner anyway considering that Houyokusen automatically puts you there, no matter where you previously were on the screen. She can force you to play a defensive game, but since your defensive game is not as good as hers is (no character’s is) and probably not as good as her offensive game is, you playing a defensive game won’t get you many wins. And that’s why she’s top tier. Her options are better than yours, and even though you probably know exactly what her game plan is, more often than not she’ll be able to force it on you anyway, force it on you until your health is gone.
To me, any tier list that doesn’t include Chun Li in the top tier is flawed.