The Vortex Thread

Crossup fireball loses alot to DP spamming. I stop using them because of that.

Yeah that’s what I was thinking. If an akuma were that airborne while I was waking up, I know I’d do the same. Still, looks so cool and at least I think the crossup fireball while also jumping over the side is still highly viable.

@lord. thanks for vids, you’re the tits. at work now, but watching your vids will be the first thing i do when i get home (after peeing the dog, of course).

ow ok now i understand. thanks. i new about the existence of quickstand, but didn’t know you could do that yourself. that makes it all alot clearer :blush:.

Hey Loltima, thanks for the headsup on the kara-demon (super) ^_^. Had fun with it earlier today haha.

which basically means

1 - Crossup tatsu
2 - Jumping hard kick (front)
3 - Empty jump (front or back) into anti throw string
4. - empty jump sweep

Naked dive kick should be used too I think, and definitely the demon flip which is incredibly versatile and has lots of baits and mix ups.

Do you prefer jumping hard kick over jumping medium kick? I use hard kick myself, but it seems most people use

Great job loltima. I’d rep ya if I could. This is going to raise the level of Akuma players in general. Even players who have been on to the vortex for a while now like myself could appreciate this video and all the options offered.

Is there anything wrong with starting a vortex off of a block? For example ill start my vortex with a standing hp into a light demon flip kick or a into a light demon flip kick (and or medium demon punch to cross over and throw, combo, etc)

It works very well but it may just be because I haven’t had any real pros yet (im g1)

I have been using the vortex a while now but this video sums it all up and keeps all of the options fresh in your mind. Thanks for your work.

Number 4 shouldn’t be on there. You are reacting to the backdash(can also be option selected). Empty jump into sweep will lose to any wakeup option your opponent has other than backdash. The point of the mix up is to give you fairly safe options, and simply empty jumping into sweep is the least safe thing you can do.

Naked dive kick is pretty much ass. There’s a reason Jap Akuma’s don’t really use it. Demon flip is good stuff, but it’s more situational than the other options and in many ways just mimics the same type of mix up afforded by the crossup tatsu/jumping hard kick/empty jump anti throw string combo.

Jumping hard kick is better. It’s far more deceiving and is Tokido’s front jump attack of choice. :smile:

Since the term “vortex” refers to Akuma’s mixup on a downed opponent it’s actually impossible to start it from a block, since the opponent isn’t downed.

However you can still get some great mixup shenanigans on a blocking opponent.

Ah ok… I thought it was more of a constant barage of attacks that either constantly cause damage and or keep you in control at all times because hes knocked down or constantly blocking.


really good stuff

Hey what’s the option select for sweep? d+lp+lk+hk?

I feel the demon flip is a important part of the vortex especially vs characters who don’t have a real answer to it like Abel. He has option selects that screw abel up pretty bad. and are pretty safe.

naked dive kick isn’t ass especially vs characters who have annoying anti vortex options(ken, ryu). I’m not going to post what they can do here since I don’t want to ruin things for my Akuma brethen if there are some Ken and Ryu spies lurking around, but it forces you to deepen your options. I got a set in with my boy Dr. Chaos before he went to SB4, and I knew from playing him that he was going to be a headache for Akumas who didn’t have a deep vortex arsenal, and he was. If you watch the videos you will see what he does to stuff 80% of the vortex options(jumping hard kick and jumping medium kick included, hence why naked dive is helpful). It can’t beat naked dive though.

I believe so.

For one, if you’re only doing it against certain characters that would qualify as “situational”.

Two, other than demon flip throw, what options would you get from the demon flip that you can’t with the mixup previously mentioned?

What exactly could he possibly be doing that can beat a meaty jumping roundhouse but not a naked dive kick?

Yeah the latter fireball trick will get you dp’d by someone with an uppercut, so it’s definitely not safe. Not even the actual cross-up FB is safe really, but then again most of the vortex options aren’t super safe anyway - there’s always a risk associated, but that makes it more fun.

Well, The demonflip palm whiff is essentially an empty jump but of course it can be done at multiple ranges, so that alone I think makes it different enough. After a x-up tatsu -> sweep sometimes you don’t space it very good, and they’re pretty far away. In that case an HK flip will put you just in front or behind them.

Also, I stand by my decision in saying D+MK is poopy. You can get some impromptu ambiguous cross-ups off of it, but other than that, it’s stupid hard to combo off of, and offers no benefit other than having to be blocked, which you can totally just do with a normal jumping roundhouse.

What are your options if you hit the cross-up tatsu and knock your opponent out of sweep range? Is it best to just s.HK and get 1 hit and then block?

HK Tatsu could possibly hit after a real distant x-up tatsu, though I haven’t tested it enough from that range. It wouldn’t put you behind him, and I’m not sure if you would land in time to block a reversal. Might have to test it out. I say just take what you have and let them fall to the ground at that point.

Check your PM.

Hey hey now, I want in on this too.

Also vs Balrog. demon flip palm and demon flip throw own him. Palm hits him out of everything and headbutt gets blocked.

Throw hits him for when he wants to block. Cross up Tatsu is good for when he commits to blocking the palm. If he backdashes away from the throw/palm then you can sweep him.

Against Abel however I don’t find it so hot. Ex TT is hit invincible as is command roll. Demonflip dive kick can be good to maintain pressure when out of range, but isn’t really much of a “vortex” in that case. Demonflip has it’s uses, but if you are in range for your vortex options, why would you demonflip?

Yeah you’re right, guess I was thinking more generally than Abel specifically, my bad.