Introduction:
On the off chance that someone at Capcom decides to take a gander at our thoughts about Dormammu and where we want him to go, I decided to make a thread where we can all post about changes we would like to be made to Dormammu, our reasons behind those changes, and discuss our ideas. I won’t be compiling a list or anything, since this isn’t something we will all agree on. Maybe it will be food for thought for Capcom though.
I am going to separate my own changes into 3 categories for easier reading, and so everyone knows when to take one of my ideas seriously, haha:
Necessary Changes - for things that are really needed to make Dormammu a more whole character in UMvC3, and ensure that he stands a reasonable chance against everyone in the cast.
Wanted Changes - stuff that would make Dormammu more interesting, flavorful, or just overall less stressful to play as. None of it is really necessary or top priority, but I would like Capcom to keep it in mind.
Dream Changes - a section for things you know probably won’t make it into the game, but it’s fun to pretend it could happen.
Necessary Changes:
A Universal Hit Confirm
[details=Spoiler]
Dormammu needs a way to be able to confirm his attacks into a combo. As it is, Dormammu only has two follow-ups from c.L: c.M, and s.S. s.S is punishable on block by most of the cast, and c.M whiffs against many characters, sometimes even if they are hit by c.L and you are at point blank range. c.L does not chain to c.H unless c.L is a counterhit, meaning that every attempt a Dormammu player makes at attacking his opponent while grounded is coupled with a risk in some matchups. Dormammu players are forced to link c.L into Flame Carpet if they want to be safe, foregoing any chance of comboing the opponent.
There are three possible solutions, and I think all of them would be dandy:
- c.M no longer whiffs against characters of any height, crouching or standing, within reasonable distance.
- c.L chains into c.H.
- s.S is made safe on block.
Obviously, 3) is the least desirable, since s.S can’t be chained into Flame Carpet to give you frame advantage on block, but it’s still a reasonable option.[/details]
Cancelable Ground Dashes
[details=Spoiler]
This game is 100% about mobility. If you look at every top tier character in MvC3, exception given to Tron and Haggar for being assist tier characters, they all share one thing in common: huge mobility. There is no such thing as a top tier character that cannot cancel his or her ground dashes. The ability to minutely adjust your position to attach your opponent outside of slowly walking forward is essential.
Dashing backwards with Dormammu is tantamount to suicide at close range against any fast character, because your opponent merely has to dash forward and hit c.L. As a Dormammu player, there is absolutely no response to this. Attempting to jump-cancel the backdash still contains a 3 frame startup, during which you will be hit. A limitation on his ability to rush is understandable - he does not need a fast forward ground dash, or even a fast ground dash at all, just the ability to dash safely.[/details]
Close-Range Defense
[details=Spoiler]
If a fast rushdown character is in front of Dormammu, he is already as good as dead. This is due to three reasons:
- Jumps have 3 pre-jump frames.
- Dormammu’s normals and specials are all slow.
- Dormammu cannot cancel his ground dashes, and he is very slow.
Essentially, when a character is near Dormammu, your only option is to block or maybe go for a ground throw. Of the other slow characters, most of them are either fast enough that they can ensure their nearby space is under their control (Dante), have super armor so they can gain off of careless approaches (Sentinel, Hulk), or have a command throw to ensure that they can defend themselves at close proximity (Tron Bonne, Thor, Haggar). Dormammu has none of these. He has no way to defend himself in close proximity.
Even with perfect play, your opponent will close in on you eventually. Dormammu is in desperate need of something, as the 3 pre-jump frames are not likely to change, and for good reason, since it would ruin jump-canceled launch tricks. There are too many avenues to explore for remedy of this situation, so I will leave it there.[/details]
Wanted Changes:
0D1C and 0D2C OTG
[details=Spoiler]
In earlier builds, 0D1C and 0D2C both OTGed opponents, providing either a little extra damage in your combo, or a relaunch in corners. This was cut in the final version, and it would be very nice if it would return. 0D1C and 0D2C are currently worthless in nearly every situation. Having some use for these would be much appreciated.[/details]
0D3C Given Purpose
[details=Spoiler]
3D0C, 1D2C, and 2D1C all have very specific purposes. They are all great against various matchups and we can appreciate them all. 0D3C wins the dubious award for an attack with the most potential, but no actual uses. 0D3C pins your opponent to the ground for 5 seconds. It sounds neat, but it can be blocked low, and being stuck to the ground for 5 seconds isn’t necessarily as bad as it seems. It only hits grounded opponents, and characters attempting to rush Dormammu are constantly airborne as it is to get around Flame Carpet. 0D3C builds no meter, and the best you will ever get out of it is some chip damage. It can’t even help Dormammu rush his opponent much, since characters with anti-air specials can still use them. Basically, it’s a huge risk with little payoff either way; your other options are all vastly superior.
In earlier builds, 0D3C was unblockable. Taking that out was probably a good thing, because it would have made some of Dormammu’s favorable matchups, like Haggar, nearly impossible for your opponent to win. Some possible ideas of what 0D3C could do that would make it situationally useful (these would wholly replace its current effect):
-Unblockable, but it drains a bar of meter from your opponent; still only runs along the ground
-Reaches full-screen, disables jumping, and pulls your opponent to the ground. Blockable.
-Instead of disabling jumping, 0D3C disables something more dangerous, like blocking, for a few seconds. Blockable.
In the end, I just want to have a reason to consider 0D3C as an option.[/details]
Combo Variety
[details=Spoiler]
I appreciate that not every character is Dante in this game, but Dormammu is the only character in the entire game, to my knowledge, without an advanced mid-screen combo that can be learned. Sentinel has fly/unfly combos, Haggar has pipe relaunch loops, Tron has juggle loops, etc. These are all heavy characters. There is no reason for Dormammu alone to be a character with no depth to his combos outside of Liberation and assist tricks - he deserves to have some fun on his own.
The easiest way to implement this is to make either s.H or c.M jump-cancelable. Dormammu has some really neat juggle loops, but he doesn’t have a way to set them up outside of using Dark Matter in a corner, and even then Dark Matter causes so much hitstun decay that it’s usually not worth doing if you have assists to let you relaunch, which most Dormammu players do. By making s.H and c.M jump-cancelable, Dormammu players would have some way to style on their opponents and have fun pursuing more difficult and flavorful combos.
Alternatively, Dormammu could be given to combo off of Dark Matter solo with ease. Currently, Dormammu can link a trijumped j.L off of Dark Matter, but it doesn’t lead to anything more than a launcher into magic series. Dormammu could be given fly-combos, but I really do not feel that’s in his style; leave that to the pixies. Regardless, some variety is desirable.[/details]
Flame Carpet Duration Increased
[details=Spoiler]
I think most Dormammu users are fine with Flame Carpet disappearing on hit. It’s very much in line with how Trish’s traps work, and I think most Dormammu users are comfortable with making this sacrifice to make some of his matchups more fair for his opponent. However, the carpet only lasts 3 seconds as it is; it’s very risky to put up in many situations. Three seconds plus disappearing whenever Dormammu takes damage seems a bit extreme, and I think Dormammu users will have to consider whether the move is even worthwhile in many matchups, since previously we could use it to trade hits with our opponents.
To place Flame Carpet more along the lines of Trish’s traps, it should last 5 seconds (300 frames) before disappearing. Alternatively, let us cancel Flame Carpet into specials and hypers so we can make it safer (and this would be fun, too).[/details]
Dream Changes:
Non-Maxed Liberations Useful
[details=Spoiler]
Right now, there’s no point to 1D0C, 2D0C, 0D1C, or 0D2C. 1D1C has some uses, as mundane as they are. Absolutely, without a doubt, 3D0C should be superior to 2D0C and 1D0C, etc. However, 3D0C is not just superior to these moves, it’s the only version worth using. It takes a lot of work to charge Dark Spells in this game, and we are not keen on blowing those Dark Spells on something mundane.
By giving the lesser Liberations some form of utility, Dormammu becomes more strategic overall, and he is a more interesting character to play as. For example, 1D0C and 2D0C both have 15 frames of startup, just like their big brother, and provide +1 frame advantage on block. If 1D0C instead gave +10 frame advantage on block and came out in 5 frames, there would be situations where a Dormammu player would consider expending his or her one charge for a moment of breathing space. 3D0C would still be vastly more desirable due to reaching full screen, but that 1D0C charge would have situational use. This same concept can apply to the other lesser forms in some fashion; situational use, but nothing that would replace the big brother version(s).[/details]
Liberations Cause No Hitstun or Damage Scaling
[details=Spoiler]
Liberation combos look a lot cooler than they actually are. Whenever I mess around with jump-canceling into 2D1C or 1D2C after a launcher, I am disappointed and surprised at how little I actually gain compared to a normal magic series. Unless it kills a character or you are in X-Factor, it’s generally just a better idea to save your Liberation for utility, and go with a standard combo.
In many situations, 2D1C and 1D2C make your combos do less damage overall than a normal magic series, because 25-40 hits causes a lot of damage decay. However, if you try to use 2D1C or 1D2C in a relaunch, your opponent is generally under too much hitstun for them to actually connect in time, and you drop the combo.
So, either have these attacks cause no damage scaling, so they can be performed during the initial launch without ruining the combo, or have them cause no hitstun scaling, so we can hypothetically relaunch twice after performing one.[/details]
Tracking Purification Assist
[details=Spoiler]
When MvC3 was announced, we were told that Dormammu was our Blackheart. Most people assumed that Purification would track like Inferno did, but this turned out to be false. This is fine, but Dormammu’s Purification L assist is among the worst in the game due to its slow startup and lack of versatility, and the results of it being successful are mediocre as well.
Assists in general are not as good in MvC3, so this was not too staggering. In UMvC3 though, Strider Hiryu was given a tracking dive kick that causes a ground bounce. It even tracks to superjump height. If Strider can get an assist this good, it seems reasonable that Dormammu could get a tracking Purification, which would be still slower than Strider’s dive kick and would not lead to combos. It would just be worth using for a change.[/details]
