Ono LOVES spinning!
Something about cinematic supers in Street Fighter never really worked for me. From a gameplay standpoint they interrupt the flow of it and storywise it kinda puts certain moves over other moves and that’s a bit weird to me. Especially in vanilla SF4 where Ultras and Supers were the same shit, just more powerful. Why do these characters have the same move, named differently, but achieving the same result?
Someone like Ryu who has shin versions of his every move… well, why would one be more deserving of a cinematic than the other? They’re his aces and they are used differently. Which is why I kinda hate that some supers became regular EX moves in V.
My point, and this will never happen because you can’t sell a fighting game nowadays without this, but I’d much rather get rid of cinematic supers entirely, cool as they may be.
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Eh? I like all the characters you listed there, but comparing T. Hawk to Gill is stupid. T. Hawk’s design, story and gameplay all shit on Gill’s.
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Anyone hating on thawk needs a swift banning!
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I mean, T. Hawk isn’t great, and I don’t like that he doesn’t use a recognizable martial art but…he’s still several levels above Gill.
Fucking Gill…
And Dee Jay is way better than both of them.
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No, I disagree. Alpha, more than everything, opened the gates to a bigger anime influence. That way it could have schoolgirl fighters and larger brutes, as well as injecting more humor (for characters like Dan, Sodom, Blanka; and tongue in cheek stuff, like Rainbow Mika or Dan, as well as less credible fighters like Rolento). But it didn’t bring any non-human-looking fighter to the mix.
The “normalizing” of that came from SF3, sure SF2 had Dhalsim and Blanka but SF3 added plain weird concepts Q and Twelve into the mix. I mean, Dhalsim and Blanka are still ‘fighters’, they have a fighting background and you can believe them as slightly weird humans (especially Blanka)… but Q and Twelve are plain weird design-concepts.
Designs like Hakan and characters like Seth or G are direct results of the Third Strike decisions.
But designs like Juri, or charactres like Rufus or Abigail, well, that’s all on SF4 and 5.
That again, as I said, I know the creative teams sort of HAD TO embrace the weirdness to make every past entry of Street Fighter to fit together… but sometimes they embrace it a little too much.
You can say everything you want about Mortal Kombat but current era (9 to 11) has made a good job with designs and not going too ‘out there’. I think most, but from the new characters from MK I think almost all of them are great concepts that fit in the MK Universe very well (even in the Original Trilogy). Erron, Kollector, Ferra/Torr, Jacqui… all of them work perfectly.
And aside from Ermac (cause no matter what you do, Ermac sucks), the redesigns/reinventions for classic characters like Reptile, Saibot, Shinnok, etcetera, have been very good.
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To be true the blame on SF4-5.
Compare Birdie’s redesign from 1 to Alpha and then from Alpha to 5.
First he became a more stylish muscular brute with attitude and a bit of quirks.
Then he became a grotesque ape with a beer belly eating giant donuts and attacking you with bubblegum and jumping the rope strikes.
I doubt he would have been like that in SF3.
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Agree with @Baines on alpha being the turning point for the games tone. Its been mentioned before ono is a big fan of blanka and the alpha series.
Disagree with above blaming 3S being responsible for freaks. If anything 3S brought the series back to its roots, most of the characters were pure maritial artists. I read somewhere Q, Remy and Twelve were meant to be fore Barlog, Guile and Vega replacements. They wanted a very similar gameplay but without being from the same background. At least they tried to think of a completely new character rather than derivative “oh hey its someones bro so they have the same moves”.
Tbh the wackiness wasnt too bad before SF4 and in the case of alpha, given the anime inspiration was maybe appropriate. It all started going to shit with SF4 but people overlooked it cos of hey nostalgia. I still remember reviews at the time sayin “yeah this is the SF I love from my youth”. No it wasnt. Dont get me erong SF4 is a good game, I dare say in some ways better than SF5 but aesthetically and tonally it was nothing like the games of yore
I feel like Alpha 1 and maybe 2 still had the SF philosophy intact but its Alpha 3 where everything escalated.
For reference. Alpha 3 was the game where we got Karin and R.Mika who seem way more wacky than all the Alpha newcomers combined. Blanka was turned from a beast like being with a hidden emotional side to a joke and etc.
Rose, Birdie etc and even Sakura (but that’s pushing it) still fit the SF style that SF2 established and that SF3 built upon.
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Karin was not wacky. At all.
Rainbow Mika is tongue in cheek and has a loud personality because she’s a pro wrestler, and well, the wrestling ring super is wacky, right.
Yeah, Blanka is like the worst case of cartoonization for Alpha, but him, Dan and Sodom are the only comedic characters there, I think. It’s anime, you have to have a little comedy there.
But in SF4/5, it looks like the universe itself is wacky. Every character has some wackiness on it, the physics itself is wacky, etc.
Rose and Sakura I don’t think would have fit in the SF2 style. Well, Rose has a design style a little similar to Vega in some ways… but nah, first thing in SF2 is that everyone’s first and foremost a fighter, not a… magician.
Third Strike really dropped the ball with those out-there fighters. One thing is making a character ‘different’, another one is making it an alien or a robot or not even a human being.
I think I’d like to see some sort of return to seriousness for Street Fighter VI. Only for a change. And it could be interesting to see if/how they adapt the sillier characters from past entries into a more serious style.
Street Fighter III had the perfect balance between seriousness and wackiness, IMO. I compare it to TEKKEN. It’s only they pushed the envelop a little too much for some character concepts/designs in Third Strike.
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I’m…gonna agree with all of this.
No, they just did the even LESS sensical “they have the same moves for absolutely no explainable reason”.
If they wanted to have the old moves, BRING BACK THE OLD CHARACTER!
Compare Tekken’s Kuma to Capcom’s Kuma…
Kuma is a fighting bear… that’s wacky on itself. We all know he’s a little comedic in his endings (like most Tekken characters) and sometimes bats you with the fish or something. No need for more.
SFxTK’s Kuma is a giant cartoonish too-human looking bear, that also farts on your face, which I don’t think represents well Kuma’s character.
I knew Capcom’s Kuma couldn’t be the same as Namco’s Kuma, but I was very disappointed on how grotesque and cartoonish and wacky they made him.
We’ve had fighting bears in other SF-like games, and they weren’t that wacky, that wasn’t necessary.
I don’t think a SF1, SF2, SF Alpha or SF3 fighting bear would have been nearly as stupid as Kuma was in SFxTK 
It’s like in some instances, SF is turning into a bottom-of-the-barrel laughingstock of fighting games, when it comes to character designs.
It’s the Ono effect.
It’s amazing how one man can completely change the tone of the franchise.
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Well I still prefer SF designs/new character concepts than Tekken’s new designs/character concepts.
Tekken’s are just so boring. I liked I think there was a new lady with a tiger, that was cool, but for the most part… BOOORING. Looking every time more like fashion models than fighters.
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All the wackiness you all blame the SF series for was already present in all of the animes and mangas Capcom stole everything from. It doesn’t surprise me in the slightest. I mean, Riki-Oh was atrociously illogical, but who cares as long as it gave us Bison’s model… Too bad it already had GILL’s model AS WELL.
Say hello to Nachi, brother of Riki. Gill has his same idiot hair; his same god complex; his same “secretly bad guy all along” aura (here he has already revealed himself, but earlier in the manga he was a MIRACULOUS HEALER hailed as a divinity) and his same brother rivalry shenanigans going on. If you wondered where Gill got his hair from, that’s him… only not blonde.
I can understand everyone has his own limit of what is acceptable and where things start to become stupid, but ultimately I think this enormous variety is exactly what saved SF from the extreme boredom that would’ve been a MK style… or even a KOF style, for that matter.
See you later with Chun-Li’s backstage story from SFZ3.
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Going back to MK and SF style comparison… back in the day where there was SF2 and MK2, before both series styles became more complex and designed… I would say there could very well have been a crossover between MK and SF.
In matters of characters design, the characters from both games were mostly simple, contained, compatible (with a few exceptions) and reached iconic status. I mean, it’s obvious which company had the (vastly) superior designs… but you could make a SF2 vs MK1-2 concept crossover and it wouldn’t be as hard as nowadays is.
Did I see someone bashing Dee Jay’s design??
Dee Jay looks good, plays well and is inspired by a real martial arts person…
He takes a hot steaming dump on Gill and MANY other designs.
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@bakfromon @Lord_Vega @Chun-Li_Forever Here we are.
Ryu’s SFZ3 revised scenario backstory
Ken’s SFZ3 revised scenario backstory
Preliminary notes: the Chinese names are all in pinyin, except the well-known form 功夫 kung-fu - which should be 功夫 gōngfu in correct pinyin. 太极拳 Tàijíquán is a borderline example, because even though it was more known as T’aichichuan and variations, the pinyin form has gained more exposition in recent years. After all, even “Chun-Li” should be 春麗 Chùnlí.
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ICPO Special Investigator (super exception). She is pursuing the organisation Shadaloo, suspected of drug and weapons smuggling. She has added her personal variations to the Chinese Kung Fu her father taught her; her father has recently disappeared.
Fighting Style
The core of the style she developed is composed by jumps and kicks, making use of her powerful legs. Her muscles and sense of balance are extremely developed, thus she can unleash repeated kicks one after another without losing her centre of gravity.
She has learnt many styles of kung-fu to establish her current style, and the influence of chángquán¹ (a kung-fu style of Northern China) can be seen in her leaping “Èrqǐjiǎo”².
Fashion Style
Maybe she uses so much her sportswear and shoes because they’re suitable for a detective work. Simple and functional, yet enhancing the beauty of her legs. Sometimes she changes it with a magnificent Chinese dress, maybe showing a slight tendency to shift towards street fighting.
Writings and signs
1 - That’s Double Happiness, a traditional Chinese decoration symbol composed of two 喜 xǐ “joy”, often written as a ligature 囍 shuāngxǐ. It’s associated with marriage.
2 - 師傅 shīfu , “master”. The typical way to address a martial arts master in China.
Chítáng Plaza³ [China]
Chítáng³ plaza - that spot in the public park where every morning people gather to practice tàijíquán routines. Chun-Li’s house lies in those neighbourhood. The plaza is one of the places where she, every early morning after her training, comes to get some rest.
Chun-Li loved to watch people calmly moving along the sequences of tàijíquán.
She used to shed a tear thinking about her disappeared father, but in that park she could at least smell his “scent”. That sensation alone was enough to calm her, more than anything.
“Heh… Who would believe I hated tàijí, when I was little…”
While she was pondering that, she casually saw a little boy who was looking around; Chun-Li immediately noticed he seemed scared.
“What’s happening, kid?”
Chun-Li had walked to his place and was leaning over him, speaking in a gentle tone.
“Ma’am⁴…”, replied the boy with tears in his eyes.
“It’s not ma’am, isn’t it? You wanted to say ‘miss’, didn’t you?” replied Chun-Li, laughing.
“Mis… s…”
“What happened? Where are your parents?”
“They’ve… disappeared…”, said the boy, on the brink of tears.
“Disappeared? Don’t worry. I’ll help you. We’ll find them in no time”, aswered Chun-Li just to relieve him.
“Really…?”
“Yes, really.”
This time she was clearly confident.
She had been taught how to handle children. But even if she weren’t, children were her specialty anyway.
“Ok, let’s go find them!”
She grabbed the boy’s hand, and the moment she started to walk,
“Li Fei! Li Feeeei!”
she heard two voices: a man and a woman, presumably a young couple, coming running from behind. They were obviously the boy… Well, Li Fei’s parents.
“Are you this boy’s parents? Be sure not to take your eyes off a child so young.”
“S - Sure… And you are?”
“A police officer… More or less.”
Chun-Li showed her police ID card.
“W - Well, I see. Thank you so much!”
The parents bowed deeply.
“Oh no, it was… Nothing, really. You have a lovely kid.”
“Not at all! He’s so naughty… Today he said that tàijíquán is uncool and he won’t do the exercises!”, laughed the mother.
“That’s too bad, Li Fei! You should train your kung-fu!” Chun-Li scolded the boy while poking him in the forehead. She bid farewell to the family and murmured to herself.
“So should I… I can’t give in!”
¹ Japanese 長拳 chōken, “long fist”. A family of Northern styles that focuses on attacks and is renowned for its acrobatic kicks. In Japan, it’s often lumped together with Tàijíquán in public exhibitions and competitions.
² Japanese 二起脚 nikikyaku, “two rising feet”. Chun-Li’s diagonal jump HK in SF2 and SFZ series, a bicycle kick indeed. The same name was then used for Yun and Yang’s diagonal jump HK, when Chun-Li changed kick in SF3, IV and V.
³ The original is in katakana, チータン Chiitan , so we can’t be sure of the intended Chinese. The most widespread transliteration is Zhidan, that would be the Chinese 志丹 Zhìdān, a county in Shaanxi, but that’s only because it’s the first meaning the online Japanese dictionary Kotobank gives; thus ended in the Old Plot Guide and spread in the net. It could be 池塘 chítáng, “pond”, or 鶏蛋 jīdàn, “chicken egg” and so on. I strongly suspect that Capcom actually intended 池塘 chítáng “pond”, because there’s evidence Capcom actually used The Naming Dictionary instead of Kotobank, where chiitan is indeed the katakana reading of the Chinese “pond”. They took a very rare Ancient Greek word for Cammy’s backstory which is found (amongst Japanese dictionaries) only in the Naming Dictionary… and spread itself in Japan because many firms used the aforementioned dictionary as a brand name for other things. More details in the Cammy article. Anyway, please be aware that, as much as I researched all of that thoroughly, I can be completely wrong and the correct name could be Zhìdān, or Jīdàn…
⁴ Original オバチャン obachan, “aunt”, commonly used by children to address a woman more or less the age of their moms. Chun-Li corrects the boy with オネエサン oneesan , “big sis”, because she’s obviously not so much older!
Next: Cammy
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What about this? Glass Joe’s only win was against Mike Tyson!!!
Well, I remember once I checked and about 90% of the pre-SFIV Supermoves involve spinning of some sorts.
Another argument against (?) the “EVERYONE IS HERE” approach is that we just had an “Arcade/Story mode” featuring chapters of every Street Fighter entry, supposedly telling the story of each chapter.
Shouldn’t we have that again now that everyone is back into the roster, to do it more properly?
Unless Street Fighter VI… probably reuses the assets of SFV? I mean, the 3D models are ok, but gameplay is drastically different to the other Street Fighter games. So many characters would be hard to adapt…
I don’t think they would ever repeat that Arcade Mode format every again, to be true.